A month down the line, the situation is as heretofore: the two officials have not met on one pretext or the other, the pretexts emanating mainly from India. Such as, for instance, insisting that diplomats from the two sides may not attend the DGMOs’ meeting. I don’t know about you, reader, but this makes no sense to me. What in the world is the harm in the same number of diplomats from both sides attending the meeting?
So, on and on we go, our two unfortunate and hapless countries making spectacles of themselves before the world like two recalcitrant young boys playing marbles and by turn, picking up theirs and walking off in a huff whenever a dispute occurs. Instead of stepping back and taking two deep breaths, and thinking seriously about how we can become good friends, for there is no other way, we pander to the hawks (and the hawkesses if I may coin a term) on both sides and indulge in self-congratulation on every little nonsensical and suicidal idea that they spout.
If the Indians applaud their now-retired but most unguided missile General VK Singh and his special ‘unit’ that funded insurgencies in Pakistan and bribed politicians in Indian Kashmir; and other army chiefs (General Deepak Kapoor) who hinted broadly at developing the so-called ‘Cold Start’ strategy by which Pakistan is invaded quickly and after receiving ‘punishment’, the troops withdraw speedily, we are besides ourselves with joy when a Pakistani ‘tactical’, i.e., field nuclear weapon delivery system is test-fired successfully to counter this ‘Cold Start’ drivel. Which is then answered by India testing one of its own.
Is there any madness above this? Quite apart from the massive expenditures of scarce moneys on these weapons of mass destruction by both sides, would Pakistan sit on its hands while this ‘Cold Start’ nonsense is being put in place? Apart from the strong and well-equipped conventional forces that we possess, do the planners of this particular insanity know just how many automatic weapons are in the hands of private citizens in Pakistan? Would they hide in their homes doing nothing while India did what it pleased? And what about our ‘tactical/field’ nuclear weapons? What if (heaven forbid) they are used? Would India not react with a strike(s) of its own, and so on, and most stupidly on both sides behaving like sub-humans until vast regions of both countries lie in ruins and nuclear winter descends, obliterating all life for decades?
And this in two of the sorriest countries, the Human Development Indices of which are among the worst in the world, India’s (136) only slightly better than ours (146) among 186 countries? Where vast numbers of humanity don’t eat two square meals a day and where the mass of the people have no access to potable water and hygienic toilet facilities and where there is no health care and where most children die in infancy? Is there any madness above this?
As I said on NDTV the other day, is the loss of a Pakistani soldier less tragic than the loss of an Indian soldier? And that was it not time that both countries stepped back from the brink, the abyss actually, and actively looked for ways in which the slaughter of our young kids, both Indian and Pakistani, who give their lives needlessly on our LoCs or borders or Siachen or wherever, is stopped? Is it not time that Pakistan and India entered the company of the civilised countries of the world, and talked about things rather than firing at each other and testing new and newer missile systems which can only spell disaster for the people of both countries?
If anyone thinks I am condoning a violent act against India that evidently had its roots in Pakistan, I am not. I refer here particularly to the Mumbai Madness after which, remember, one of our leading TV channels traced Kasab’s village and which was then confirmed by our National Security Adviser, the great gentleman General Mahmud Durrani.
While I do not condone the Mumbai Madness and hope that the accused are punished appropriately, I call upon all clear-thinking Indians to also rein in their own ‘agency’ from fomenting trouble in Balochistan through Afghanistan of which there is every evidence newly discovered. They must desist, for not only would we react strongly, it must be realised that if Pakistan is destabilised any more than it is already, India will be destabilised too.
Yes, my Indian friends, it is time that your political leadership, despite the looming elections, took Nawaz Sharif’s outstretched hand of friendship and amity, and worked with the Pakistani prime minister in lowering tensions; encouraging enhanced trade; making it easier for the peoples of the two countries to visit the other and so on.
I would also one more time call upon the chiefs of both the armies to not only have hotlines on which they speak every so often to one another, but had regular meetings. Can you believe that the (native) chiefs of the Pakistan and Indian armies have never ever met after Partition!
And, again, one more time: May I ask both countries to please, please stop the tamasha on the Wagah border every evening. It is not only against every military Manual of Drill; it is childish; it is churlish; and it is downright stupid. Let us grow up and learn to handle our beloved flags with some grace.
P.S. Some sobering statistics of casualties in some cities in case of a nuclear exchange from Dr Pervez Hoodbhoy’s Confronting the Bomb (Oxford ISBN 978-0-19-906833-3): Bangalore: Killed: 314,978; Severely injured: 175,136; Faisalabad: 336,239; Severely injured: 174,351.
Published in The Express Tribune, November 1st, 2013.
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COMMENTS (109)
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@John: It seems the ambassador is very well paid with lots of perks. I do not know if he enjoyed similar monetary comforts in his previous avatars of journalist and retired army officer. He is doing a good job for Pakistan.
Anyway long live the ambassador.!
Most Pakistanis are brainwashed by "Pakistan studies," none more so than @Lala Gee who keeps spouting the most fantastic nonsense of this forum. Who knows, he may also be the author of "Pakistan studies" constantly inventing fiction to justify Pakistan dark past and darker future.
Even two officials don't have to meet, Pakistan just should stop helping Jihadis infiltrate into Kashmir.
dear mr. kamran saheb- you are one of the few sensible people in your country, not only because you have a balanced view-point on india-pakistan relations, but because you are willing to write about all this in a main daily. - which means many of your country-men may not like you. India pakistan should not have separated. If Jinnah saheb wanted a state within india for muslims that is okay- you could have autonomy- and with about 500 million muslims in a combined india- you could probably have the prime- minister"s position and lead the govt. with the scheduled castes of india. Now you have a country which has split the muslims of india into three zones- india- 180 million people, bangladesh 150 million and pakistan 180 million- this has caused the kashmir dispute and other disputes. Your country spends far too much on defence to fight the mother country-india. Even now saner elements could help to bring all the countries together- let us hope it is not after a holocaust caused by your talebanis- the muslims in india are happier than in pakistan- that is for sure. we do not see shias, and other non-sunnis being killed in india. Azim premjee our india muslim is richer than 100 million pakistanis. And the mumbai massacre your govt is so proud to have done against india will bring at least 1000 times more misery to pakistan due to divine retribution- or karmic reaction- even now you all can change if you want to...
I find it strange that Pakistani loudly demand Kashmir but silent on accepting Crores of Muslims living In India whose social and spritual home is actually Pakistan which came to fruitaion under their able leader MA Jinnah. IMHO, its a great insult to Quaid if even one Muslim is left behind in India. Pakistan will be complete when they all enjoy the safety of Islamic Republic of Pakistan.
@Hussain Turri: It does not matter what a bunch of Kashmiris think. They don't represent whole of J&K. Does it matter to Pakistanis what Ghaffar Khan though or Khan Bugti or Balochis thought?
Stop worrying about our Kashmiris. They are living in Paradise on earth. They don't have to face brutalities of the kind inflicted by Pakistanis or Chinese !!
@Hussain Turri: Things have changed on both sides. You were getting free toys from USA while we chose to be non-aligned and had to do with old Soviet equipment. In addition we were under pressure from both China and US and our forces had to monitor those borders too. Cold Start doctrine is an important doctrine that presents a new mechanism not only for India to handle jihadis being pushed by Pak Army but also a mechanism to prevent nuclear war between the 2 countries. It is meant to be an advance announcement to Pakistan that our ingress into Pakistani territory should not be read as intent to occupy Pakistani territory. This is required because Pakistan has made it known its doctrine that in the event of a war, because it fears Indian occupation, it will launch nuclear weapons. So India's doctrine is a way to take away that excuse from Pakistan.
If Pakistan still resorts to that tactic, that will become cause justification for concerted global action against Pakistan.
@antanu: Mr. Pakistani, India is quite different from Pakistan and not, as you say, "quite the same as Pakistan". Yes we have poverty like in Pakistan but it is triggered by only one factor- corruption in last 20-30 years. In Pakistan's case you deny basic rights to minorities in your constitution. There is thus no hope of their poverty being alleviated or them getting equal employment opportunities.
Pakistan has way too many problems of fundamental nature that will keep it from moving forward, non of which India has.
@Lala Gee:
Only when you do the same on your side. Consider punishing the Indian masterminds behind the Mukti Bahini, LTTE, TTP, BLA, etc. They are responsible for the mayhem thousands of times bigger than the Mumbai 2008 incident.
And how about Direct Action Day?
And also the Delhi massacre of 1739 by Nadir Shah?
Aren't TTP Boys the same 'stake holders' that your Parliament is prostrating before? Didn't your Home Minister condemn the killing of Mehsud? And didn't some one declare Mehsud to be a 'Shaheed'? I am sure you know where to find this guy.
http://lubpak.com/archives/1704
And LTTE? What has LTTE got to do with the Ummah?
The author is a comedian. The true solution to peace with the Pakistanis is fencing the borded even more comprehensively, laying land mines all accross, throwing out all pakistanis in India including the diplomatic mission and recalling all Indians from pakistan.
We should also start supporting the baluchis and other non-punjabi states to secede from pakistan by pumping in our own money/weapons and start a full fledged fake pakistani currency operation similar/bigger to the one the pakis run for IC. basically do everything they accuse us of doing, and they should understand the need for peace.
@observer:
"@Lala Gee: You are most welcome. Hope you will consider the comments seriously and do something about Mumbai 2008 and IC 814, PLEASE."
Only when you do the same on your side. Consider punishing the Indian masterminds behind the Mukti Bahini, LTTE, TTP, BLA, etc. They are responsible for the mayhem thousands of times bigger than the Mumbai 2008 incident.
@gp65:
"So what should wise and peace loving India do while Pakistan beheads our soldiers on LoC, sends terrorists to our cities, officially funds anti-India groups like JuD in its budget?"
Just leave Kashmir to Kashmiri people. That's all India has to do, and there would be nothing of the sort from Pakistan, ever. This is exactly what a decent truly democratic nation would do without needing to be told by outsiders.
Kamran Shafi is well-respected in India for his moderate, liberal views. But the prospect and "responsibility" of office turns the best of them into hawkish stance. Congratulations to ET for publishing the raft of Indian rebuttals to some spurious and very un-Kamranlike arguments Micky-saheb has made. Great sport that he is, I'm sure KS will ignore some of the invective and take the constructive rebuttal in the spirit that they are made. Pakistan has to walk the talk, and as long as its fauj, Kamran's alma-mater, call the shots, that's not happening. No amount of bellicose threats is going to move India. Time -- and truth -- is on its side.
@Lala Gee:
I would like to say “Thank You” to Indian commentators (bit short of time).
You are most welcome. Hope you will consider the comments seriously and do something about Mumbai 2008 and IC 814, PLEASE.
Pakistan showing concern for Indian poor is like the child who comes last in academics showing concern for well-being of class-topper.
I would like to say "Thank You" to Indian commentators (bit short of time).
@Gratgy: "A wise man (me) once said “If you can’t stand heat, don’t start a fire”." +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Do you know how many match sticks private citizens in Pakistan have? India would be reduced to cinders if they decided to simultaneously ignite...
@Nero: Sham for last 2 decades? What about the sham in 1965? In 1948?
@naeem khan Manhattan: With due respect, most of us Indians are not drunk with power (or anything else). Most of us know very well that we are a mid-level military power and upper-mid level economic power, as of now. We are just fed up of the sham carried on over last several decades by the Pakistani establishment, which continues unabated. Pakistan needs course correction for its own sake. I fail to understand what exactly has done which deserves praise.
Megalomania all the way. Seems its no use to put forth a balanced view for a WIDER audience . Keep up the good work Kamran Sahab.
Kamran Shafi's intentions may be noble but the article seems more like an expression of frustration. India has never sought any war with any neighbor and is unlikely to do so now. However after the 26/11 Mumbai massacre India's tolerance levels stand considerably reduced. India wants to be left alone and seeks neither friendship nor enmity with Pakistan. If Pakistan wants to cuddle up to the terrorists it has created at the cost of the lives of its citizens, no one in India should have any objections. The only communication India seeks to convey is that Pakistan will be held responsible for all terror plots emanating from its territory against India. As long as that is understood all is fine, else trouble lies ahead.
Nuke the drones that make daily mockery of Pakistani state ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ and then threaten India with the Paki nuclear might.
Shafisahab,
I accept that chances of Nawaz being honest are good, but he is basically impotent opposite the omnipotent (or so they think) Pakistani Khaki!
How can he be trusted to do anything when his impotency won't allow him to do anything meaningful with apparently no authority over 'good-for-nothing' Pakistani Armed Forces?
I wrote a couple of articles lauding what Nawaz said about forging friendly relations with India, but poor fellow can't do anything when your Generals stare hard at him because it is he who has to blink!
Pakistan has to cure itself first before India can trust it!
Shafisahab, with UK High Commissionship dangled in front of you, I don't know whether Pakistan got a good diplomat, but we surely lost a good columnist who once wrote balanced articles and criticized the Pakistani Rommels & Guderians!
As you are basically a PPP supporter, the offer of the post of High Commissionership should have come during PPP Raj. How come PML-N is offering it to a PPP Supporter? I think it is a carrot!
Paki War Strategy +++++++++++++++++++ Conduct a massive proxy war against India under the ISI wholly owned subsidiaries and point out the dangers of a nuclear conflict if India reacts. Appeasement didnt work against Hitler either.
Mr Shafi forgot to write that NS has walked so many extra miles for peace +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Pls let us Indians know when the Paki mil also takes the first step for peace. In the meanwhile NS walking is good only for his frail health.
@Editor: Has Kamran Shafi written on the Kargil War? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++== The Kargil war has highly instructive lessons for India and for Pakistan as well. Did the Paki Mil ever conduct a formal review of the war?:)?
@Arijit Sharma: '” … ” … They must desist, for not only would we react strongly, it must be realised that if Pakistan is destabilised any more than it is already, India will be destabilised too. … “ How and why will India be de-stabilized ? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ India will be destabilized cause Kamran Shafi feverishly hopes so.
@Zayyad: "The Indians think they can repeat 1971…that is their biggest fallacy." +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++== This time around Pakistan is self destructing. Have you heard of the TTP?
its hilarious for india to deal with the PM FM & Defence Min rolled into one ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ All negotiations c/o Obama. Obama says pls wqait till 2014!!!!!
"The utter madness of it all' ++++++++++++++++++++++ Another Hussain Haqqani is born !
"The utter madness of it all" +++++++++++++++++++++ Since when has madness desisted Pakistan? were the wars of 1947, 1965, 1971 and Kargil not mad attempts? So why will the next Paki military attempt be any less insane ?
Every Indian knows it in his bones +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Pakistan can never be trusted!( Kargil and mujahdeen nonsense etc) The more Pakistan changes the more it remains the same. ( OBL !!!) A low level of conflict is inevitable with that terrorist state The most likely nuclear conflict will arise when a Paki Mil inspired jihadi gets his hands on a dirty bomb.Indian retribution will be swift, massive and total. OBLs batchmates may start relocating !
".....do the planners of this particular insanity know just how many automatic weapons are in the hands of private citizens in Pakistan? Would they hide in their homes doing nothing while India did what it pleased?" I don't even begin to see the logic in this argument. So what are you saying? That the Mafia is now a strategic asset of Pakistan?
@naeem khan Your brand of liberalism (as mr Shafi's) is to completely push under the carpet Pakistan's persistent and CURRENTLY ONGOING malicious conduct and present with a fake innocent face. Nobody buys it.
Would you like to comment on who started the LoC skirmishes?
Indians are not pleading for mercy. You continue what you are doing and let's see where it takes you.
Who is arrogant? Without US aid, your country will collapse in no time. Look how you talk! And punch above your size.
@naeem khan Manhattan,Ks: " DO YOU EVER READ THE NASTY COMMENTS BEING WRITTEN BY INDIANS IN OUR PAPERS EVERY DAY, it reflect their thinking, I for one who was in favor of normalizing relation with India has completely turned around in my thinking by these nasty comments, I would not be surprised if they are on the payroll of the Indian government."
Sir Do you have any intelligent information to share with fellow readers. I am told that when people have no intelligent thing to offer they resort to profanity. Nationality of the person commenting is not important what important is whether they are adding value to the topic or not. Next time rise above or remember silence is golden.
@ Sir you are wrong about the Heads of Indo -Pak army head meeting. They met in Dhaka in 1971 . The Pakistani was weeping and the Indian was laughing ...but they did meet ..
@antanu: STOP referring as "Us" you fake Indian..
There seems to be prevalent in Pakistan the entirely misplaced notion that spouting sweet sounding words is enough to negate past and continuing actions of promoting terrorism targeting India not to mention other hostile Pakistani behavior such as attacking and beheading Indian soldiers. Pakistan must be very clear that the tree of peace will need to be necessarily watered with the blood of Pakistani based terrorists who have targeted India. There is no other option notwithstanding Pakistan having nuclear weapons and / or Pakistan running the risk of becoming destabilized.
@naeem khan Manhattan,Ks: So when did you think of normal relationship with India before 1971 or after 1971. That was a full 40 years back! Also from your own statement you believe Indians commenting on the site are paid by Indian Government, In other words you do not believe normal Indians would comment like that. If that is the case please re-double your efforts for peace with India. We Indians are in no delusion. We know Pakistan can be a migraine if not handled properly.India does not want war but needs a Government that keeps it's promise. Is that asking for too uch?
Kamran sb. change his argument line length after hint of ambassadorship in UK.
Talk of peace by Mr. Nawaz Sharif’s lacks any credibility with me owing to the not forgotten fact that he was Prime Minister of Pakistan when Indian Prime Minister Vajpayee's peace overture was rewarded with an attack in Kargil. To be taken with anything more than a truckload of salt , Prime Minister Sharif needs to first walk the talk of peace by stringently punishing those in Pakistan who have supported acts of violence aginst India.
@kamran ji
problem with US Indians is that we are in a state of delusion about our country. we have this habit of ignoring the fact that our socio economic situation is not very different from Pakistan. this has created a false sense of arrogance in our minds. if we accept the facts ....we may be able to press our political leadership to give peace a chance by acting as a big brother and not as a country overly obsessed with Pakistan.
Well shahi favors will do wonders to ones integrity.
Not sure how Pakistan has changed recently after Nawaz coming to power. Has Nawaz backed up his words: Any change in Mumbai investigation? No, recently Pakistan said not enough evidence. Any change in cross border terrorism? No, it actually has increased since Nawaz coming to power. We have an emboldened Hafez Sayeed. Any change in trade issues? No. Pakistan recently said it is not in a hurryto give MFN status. Any change in other narratives? Pakistan keeps saying India is actively involved in Balochistan without given any iota of proof.
So please tell us what exactly Nawaz has changed. He successfully managed to antagonize the Indian Government which against all public pressure shook hands with him. He rewarded them with more cross border firing. Now the Congress Government is even more upset then the opposition parties. I know it suits your convenience to say it is 2014 election gimmick.
We think the soul searching needs to happen on the Pakistani side. You cannot fool the world too long by saying all the right things but not following it up with actions. Unfortunatley the whole world understands the Pakistani dubious track record in dealing with terrorism.
" ... They must desist, for not only would we react strongly, it must be realised that if Pakistan is destabilised any more than it is already, India will be destabilised too. ... "
How and why will India be de-stabilized ?
What is this referring all the time with the term NUCLEAR-ARMED?
Aren't you tired of using it? Don't you know nuclear arms should never be used?
Be VERY VERY CAREFUL, the whole world is watching you and all nuclear stuff shall be removed like how chemical weapons are being destroyed in Syria.
years passed by..... 66 years.... infact 66 years aren't much for countries to get developed especially countries as huge as india and pakistan... but honestly in those 66 years what has pakistan achieved?? tell me... tell me 1 positive thing for which pakistan is know....terrorism and polio apart....tell me ONE .... just ONE....anyone?? no one?? :)
Peace is indeed a good thing to work towards. However let Pakistan first go beyond empty rhetoric and establish her good intentions by sustained and visible punitive action against terrorists in territory controlled by Pakistan that are targeting India and Indian's anywhere in the world.
This is another argument in "moderate" packaging to force India to forget Mumbai and other acts of terror exported to it via "strategic" assets of Pakistan. It will hurt India is a clever way of saying - negotiate and give us everything or else you are to be blamed!
Every day i hear, India should stop interfering in Balouchistan.....Pakistan has presented new evidence which supports that.....But WHERE IS THE EVIDENCE.... No where Pakistan has presented any evidence.... only talk ...talk and talk.....and Yes India has got the willpower and the required muscle power to redrawn the political boundaries of other country that harbours malafide intentions towards it. Don't consider our patience as our weakness...
"...the pretexts emanating mainly from India. Such as, for instance, insisting that diplomats from the two sides may not attend the DGMOs’ meeting."
I've long suspected that India PREFERS a Pakistan at the edge of insanity and disintegration due to its mindless insistence on conflict with India to a Pakistan that is healthy and whole. Indeed, it's been so long Indians might not be able to conceive anything else.
What may be needed to break the logjam is some sort of grand gesture by a Pakistani leader so that Indians will be willing, even eager, to embrace normal and peaceful relations with Pakistan. Something like Sadat's 1977 declaration that he would seek peace with Israel by traveling to Jerusalem and speaking to the Israeli Knesset. By placing himself in his "enemy's" hands he won Israelis' confidence and the rest is history.
The substantive gesture needed by one or more of Pakistan's leaders might be different but it's impact must be the same: the Indians must realize that Pakistan's leaders truly seek peace and that their efforts are very unlikely to be mere mouthings or deceptions.
Don't worry about us kamran.
I appreciate you thoughts and cajoling the two heads of Armies to meet regularly to minimize the threat or annihilation of each other. That said, I am no right winger, I am a liberal person as they come and believe in peaceful co-existence but one should never forget the history, can we forget what had happened in then East Pakistan, what right India had to intervene in East Pakistan on behalf of those who were not happy in the union with Pakistan. DO YOU EVER READ THE NASTY COMMENTS BEING WRITTEN BY INDIANS IN OUR PAPERS EVERY DAY, it reflect their thinking, I for one who was in favor of normalizing relation with India has completely turned around in my thinking by these nasty comments, I would not be surprised if they are on the payroll of the Indian government. I have witnessed Nawaz Sharif's friendly overtures to the Indian counter part and to Indians in general, it is the right thing to do. They are drunk with power, economic and military, and think Pakistan is sliding to abyss and I say to them that we have survived more than 65 years with their animosity and will survive another 100 years to come with their current and future animosity or even their conniving with the enemies of Pakistan, we are here to stay and we should start strengthening the country economically as much as posible, the sooner the better and that would discourage their bellicosity.
Agreed. 100%
We Indians need to take a few steps back and look take a panoramic view.
Is it the same Kamran Shafi? No, I don't think so.
You are sooooooooooo inocent.
Congrats on your appointment as Ambassador to the UK!
With regards to Wagah border may be you can influence Pakistani army to stop the show. India has already watered down the ceremony and would look stupid trying to look into some one non-existent. Regarding Balochistan, I believe it was Bhutto who ordered strafing of Baloch by air force in 1971 and the grievances are well documented in Pakistan by Balochis from the time it was annexed from Khan of Kalat. If India is exploiting the situation, as you allege, than the government can undo the wrong done to Baloch people by successive governments. Remember Pakistan started actively supporting separation of Kashmir from India. And the largest diplomatic budget is devoted to Kashmir in Pakistan!
Allah bless Pakistan & its founding father, its sciencists, its weathers, its soldiers, its beautiful peoples.
@Author - I always read your article with great enthusiasm and have lot of respect for you as a columnist. You are always pro-peace and want better relations between India-Pak.
I largely agree with the motive of your article which is - dialogue must go on and India should not step back given Nawaz is sincere. I feel nawaz has his hands full with local issues and he doesn't want bitter relationship with India. It is in Pak interest not to have another front open.
But the statistics are giving a completely different picture. Till 2009, the ceasefire violations were low. But since last 2 yrs, there is a steady increase in number of ceasefire violations from Pak side. So far it is already 250 against 170 last year. Also there is a significant increase in cross-border infiltration. As an average Indian, it is hard for me to believe there is sincerity from Pak army even if Nawaz is.
Regarding Indian meddling in Balochistan ... each country maintains relations with different groups of other countries. I am sure you know as an army personnel. Will you say the same for CIA/Mossad who might be in contact with Baloch insurgent. It is part of intelligence gathering just like ISI keep touch with Indian Mujaheddin etc.. But I don't completely buy the argument that India want to destabilize Pak. You can watch shashi tharoor interview about indian perspective. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=no_9alkXyh8)... stable pak is for india's good. We can't progress if our western border is on fire.
I am all for India to talk to Pak and resolve issues and stopping of tamasha at wagah border.... regarding Balochistan.. pakistan should look at injustice done there and work out a strategy to pacify insurgents. Blaming India for everything there is not a solution.
Indian public can not have confidence in Pakistan unless culprits of Mumbai Massacre are punished, Pakistan needs to walk the talk as 99% of evidence lies in Pakistan. Nawaz Shariff has brought the Kashmir issue on top of his list , as he thinks US will deliver him Kashmir,as US need to use Pakistan' for withdrawal from Afghanistan.No Indian political establishment can agree to redrawing the border line, as such, the solution of Kashmir that Pakistan wants is never possible.Border skirmish on LOC is purely military issue and should be dealt by them, as entry of third party will unnecessary create hype and politicize the issue out of proportion.Indian army has cold start game plan at discussion level only, but Pakistan's strategic depth and thousand cut policy has already harmed India grievously.India has contiguous border with Pakistan ,so it defies logic, as alleged,using Afghanistan to interfere in Pakistan,where military of 40+ country are stationed.India has already requested to stop the tamasha at wagah border, as it creates knee problem to the soldiers participating in this drill.- but that was refused by Pakistani side.How can trade relation between the two country can improve if Pakistan can not give MFN status to India, which as per previous government decision was supposed to be given last year.
Kamran shafi sahib, why u wasting your time for india no vitamins worked for them.
"it must be realised that if Pakistan is destabilised any more than it is already, India will be destabilised too." Like KS is saying--Hum to doobengey sanam, Tumko bhi le doobenge. Incidentally soon after Mumbai attack India asked for ISI chief to visit India. Pakistan first agreed and than refused to send him. Imagine if that visit would have had happened it would have opened new doors of opportunities and cooperations. KS is like old LP record. One side anti Pakistani establishment and the other side anti Indian establishment. For last three four article looks like he is playing anti Indian establishment side of LP.
Surprised by the above responses from ultra-nationalists? Not at all. The moment you step on an Indian tail, you hear all type of howling. Damn it! read again and then draw your conclusions. Also learn to digest, and analyze things, and stop acting as chauvinist ultras. Ultra-nationalism will not take you anywhere but deep in self-delusion. Only ugly one do not like to look in the mirror.
Another student of Orya Maqbool jan speaking what he has been taught.....i jst dont understand y pakistanis forget the year vajpaye g took a bus to lahore and in reply wat India got was kargil orchestrated by the vry army u belong to and now suddenly the same prime minister whose watchward was kargil wants to talk....n cmon try to teach ur ppl to pay tax so tht u dont go arnd wrld begging for money......
Very disappointing and specious arguments Kamran sahib, especially fuzzing of unrelated events.
Does the so called "cold start" doctrine pre-date Pakistani nuclear bomb project? Does the so called "cold start" doctrine pre-date even the so called "tactical" nuclear bombs of Pakistan? Why exactly should diplomats sit in a DGMO meeting? Did they used to earlier? What exactly is wrong with cold start doctrine anyway? It just means that India will attack Pakistan at the points of strengths. If Pakistani citizens have enough weapons to take on Indian army, good for Pakistani state. This just means that the whole country has become the "non-state" actors. You have made your "tactical" bombs. If the war happens and if India operationalizes the so called "cold start", you can chose to either use the "tactical" bomb on your own citizens (majority) or just let the citizens beat back Indian army. There are consequences to both the actions for both India and Pakistan. Nawaj Shareef's hands of friendship? Even Charlie's aunt knows that he has nothing to offer except sound bites (even if we believe intentions behind them). Sound bites only deserve sound bites. He couldn't even get the MFN status operationalized. To compare India's involvement with what Pakistan has done in Kashmir (in terms of scale) is a joke, and you know it. Why exactly should India stop? Inspite of having two decades of head-start over India, has Pakistan stopped? Till 2003 most mosques in Pakistan were running "Kashmir fund". Now they are running "social service funds". You don't fool people like that.@Kaka:
Thank you,for accepting your Country's involvement in 1971 debacle.....we were in doubt till you confirmed because that is what your govt has conceded....same way your own retired Police officer has exposed your intel establishment to have planned Mumbai attack. It is normal with all country to use each other citizens to do dirty work.....Americans have used Dr Afridi....any taker.
"And, again, one more time: May I ask both countries to please, please stop the tamasha on the Wagah border every evening. It is not only against every military Manual of Drill; it is childish; it is churlish; and it is downright stupid. Let us grow up and learn to handle our beloved flags with some grace."
Absolutely agree. It is sickeningly stupid.
Reading the article and the comments from Indian commentators, it seems India has a long way to go before it will be able to political reign in its hawks. I would love to see similar kind of op-ed published on Indian side as well. We have been very wrong in the past and we admit our mistakes. But some self-introspection is also due on the Indian side now. In the end, it is the grass that suffers when the elephants fight (and that grass is millions of poor people living in our countries).
regarding ur claims on progress issues.... infant mortality of india is 50 for pakistan it is more than 70...... 90% population has access to drinking water in india.... sanitation is an issue in rural india but that is something that would take place irrespective of how india has its relations with pakistan SEE you should be clear with 1 thing ..... we are not hostage to this peace deal...we were 10 years ago...we are not now... there is no urgency within us...since we aren't in a deplorable situation as pakistan... if india has issues then its the coz of say corruption... now this corruption will go on even in pak and india become BFFs.... and remember its not pak we have to guard against only
Why do you keep referring to India as "nuclear-armed". You Pakistanis may have only one claim-to-fame - but for us Indians "nuclear-armed" is just another little aspect of our larger Identity. So please either refer to us as "nuclear-armed Pakistan and Secular India" or "nuclear-armed Pakistan and Democratic India" or "nuclear-armed Pakistan and Liberal India" - or simply - "nuclear-armed Pakistan and India".
We don;t want nuclear-arms to be the sole definer of our identity - Pakistan may like to, but not us.
india's dometic issues like nutrition,sanitation and clean drinking water wll be sorted out irrespective of weather india has good relations with pak or not....simple as that.....our defence expenditure is a mere 2.5% of gdp...... however it would be alarming for pak if it does not maintain good relations with india.... not only would it have to allocate 1/3 rd of the budget to forces as it did this time it wont be able to trade with india and that would be huge blow for pakistan...... as time passed india only progressed whereas pakistan has regressed coz of badd relations with india....to sum up what i mean is that india is at no loss if it doesn't have good relations with pak however pakistan has huge loss..... india is on track to meet most MDGs ( not sanitation and nutrition though) ... pak will fail to meet many....... understand the difference... ooo KIND author
Author: Yes, my Indian friends, it is time that your political leadership, despite the looming elections, took Nawaz Sharif’s outstretched hand of friendship
Not ! Not unless we can clearly see what he is holding in his other hand hidden behind his back...
Those of you Indians who were still looking for a mythical moderate Pakistani! Here you have it. THERE ISNT ONE. This piece proves it if you still remained unconvinced.
The Indians think they can repeat 1971...that is their biggest fallacy. Those times are long gone. during Kargil,they could not dare to cross international border...same in 2001/02.Let them make all the noise...
It's funny how author talked about Nuclear Holocaust and it's implications and tried to potray that they are no less capable than India in that field. But right now at this moment somewhere in lyari, quetta or khyber-pakhtunkhwa some good talibanis would be planning for some bomb blasts and i can assure you there is no authority in Pakistan that can claim that there will not be a single bomb blast in next few days ! No politician dies in these blast, only innocent civilians get killed. Pakistani government is literally begging to Taliban for survival and you are talking about nuclear capabilities!
I think, if India is really destabilizing Pakistan then deal with it. We are dealing with your terrorist exports since 1947. I don't have anything against Pakistani awam because they are suffering due to incompetent government. Sir,Pakistan is already on a selfdestructive path and there's no need to destabilize it.
A bit dramatic but over all a balanced piece and your call for reason and restraint from both sides is just common sense.
@Author, But where's the evidence of India's so-called involvement in Balochistan? Your government has not shared any evidence with India. Therefore plz don't just talk in the air until you really have any evidence. By repeating a lie, it won't become truth. In contrast India's ample evidence of Pakistan's involvement in Mumbai attacks, which even the world acknowledges. No wonder why Pakistan's called a failed state and epicenter of world terrorism.
What a turnaround ! One appointment dangled, and the author is more "established" than the establishment.
Dear Shafi Sir, You are very right about so many things. There are never any winners in a nuclear war. If India is fishing in troubled waters of Balochistan they should stop. Similarly, Pakistan must stop creating jihadi trouble in Kashmir. LoC was quiet for over nine years and survived two Indian elections. What has disturbed the peace at LoC is not the impending elections in India but the Pak army's calculus has reverted back to pre 9/11 situation because the US withdrawal from Afghanistan is in sight. Indians are simply reacting to provocations.
"Yes, my Indian friends, it is time that your political leadership, despite the looming elections, took Nawaz Sharif’s outstretched hand of friendship and amity, and worked with the Pakistani prime minister in lowering tensions; encouraging enhanced trade; making it easier for the peoples of the two countries to visit the other and so on."
Lately we Indians don't trust the sincerity of Mr Nawaz Sharif. His peace talks are nothing but ploy. Sharif brothers are the real Amir of LeT. Hafiz Saeed is their puppet and nothing else. JuD gets its funding from Punjab government knowing fully well that JuD Amir is on UN's terrorist list and has a booty on his head. Most Indians feel that Pakistan is the real trouble maker in the region. I am very doubtful that in near future any Indian leader will engage with Pakistan.
@Author, Do you think Indians will sit back this time when you do another Mumbai? Don't forget what we did to you in 1971. This time we won't show any mercy.
Mr kamran, Let me tell you that India has every right to design its strategy like cold start doctrine in order to deal with situations like 1965, 1971, 1999 and 2008. We have learnt lesson from our enemy, you people can try stab us at any time.
Do you think we don't remember when you suspended Durrani as soon as he admitted that kasab is Pakistani.
Why are you fighting proxy war with us? Can't you fight straight? Who is stopping to use ur doctrine which you are already doing by using mujahideens against us.
Your own political leader IK said he had never seen any evidence which proves Indian involvement in Baloochistan.
I have lot more to tell you.
Excellent article Kamran saheb. I respect you enough that even though if you write any thing negative about my country (India) I would give it serious consideration rather than outright denial. About Balochistan, it is strange Indian Generals would make mistake of admitting knowing that they are jeopardizing every strategic calculation ( or miscalculation) they had on region. Clearly if it is happening it will be seen as tit-for-tat reaction to Pakistani's support to militants in Kashmir. This exactly how the world will see this situation and it still does not in any way tilt any sympathy towards Pakistan. if Pakistan will seek world help, am sure the world will give Pakistan the advice to stop supporting terrorrists activity in India and then expect India to reciprocate appropriately. While I do not support or justify any act of terrorism it seems India has finally learned from decades of knocking doors on world leaders for forcing Pakistan to reign in it's terrorists. There is no clear mechanism in UN to deal with terorists especially when a nation continuously keeps denying any support and wash it's hands clean by calling terorists non state actors. India is not as powerful as USA or China to bring war on terror to Pakistani soil, so the least it can do is to give Pakistan it's own medicine. Apart from sharing my hopeless thoughts, I do sincerely wish that our nations do not continue to remain under grip of mullahs, pundits and military. Hopefully for the sake of common people of India and Pakistan I wish for a mirracle that we unite again and prosper together. With respect and regards.
Let us clap for the author.....remember we will clap in coming days..remember my words....Forget about pakistan..think about ur own survival now.....India is huge....even if something happens in size equal to pakistan we can handle...we dont bow heads in front of pakistani and kashmiri militants and neither any other militants...we are not like u..and most importantly we are not beggars and we are choosers now............
Yes, my Indian friends, it is time that your political leadership, despite the looming elections . Dear UK Ambassador, the Indians have to do no such thing because unfortunately they survived the "death by a thousand 'nuts'" that was inflicted on them. India more than anyone else has much experience in dealing with the caped honest (Sharif, Not) crusader. Sometimes I think they just have to step back and put mines (or lard) on their border and they will be fine.
Just one bone of ambassadorship and suddenly this guy is an expert in international relations. Oh the irony.