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Hitler is just not that into you
Israel for me is one of the most troubling conundrums of the modern world. It demonstrates a key schism in thought and...
The writer is a columnist and TV and radio anchor (fasi.zaka@tribune.com.pk)
Israel for me is one of the most troubling conundrums of the modern world. It demonstrates a key schism in thought and practice for the West which claim renaissance values but still actively supports apartheid, colonialism and violence in that pocket of the Middle East.
As the Palestinians are cornered more tightly every day, paradoxically their demonisation increases. While the flotilla incident may have woken the world, it will be just a micro-wake. The status quo shall remain, and the inhuman treatment of the Palestinians shall go on without respite.
Muslim anger is justifiable. The rage in the Muslim world is also rooted in the intractable nature of the problem because of blanket protection given by the US, and their utter helplessness in doing anything about it. This frustration, understandably, creates perversions as bad as the injustice in Israel.
In part, this reasoning is why the Tehreek-i-Taliban can justify the slaughter of the average Pakistani because they live under a government that is allied to the US. Not only has this hurt Muslims, but also decreased the standing of Islam in front of those not born into it.
But one thing I find interesting is the occasional lauding of Adolf Hitler (thankfully never in the mainstream press). While this is not something pervasive generally, I found a few grumbles on his recent death anniversary and post the flotilla incident online and in conversations.
It’s twisted, and dangerous, logic at work. While I am no historical expert by any means, there are no conclusive tracts that demonstrate what Hitler thought of Muslims. Some will say there is evidence that he admired Muslims for their martial tendencies. But, he was of the same opinion of Shinto (the imperial Japanese religion of the WWs). So, less than an understanding of actual teachings of religion, he was interested in whether they would be amenable to fighting. He was, by most estimates, at least nominally Christian.
Why I bring this up is to assert that Hitler’s actions cannot be compatible with Muslims. Hitler massacred an innocent people systematically in cold blood. We cannot forget that not all Israelis are Zionists, and that Jews all over the world cannot face collective responsibility for what one state does. It’s like our domestic argument to the world, these terrorists don’t represent us.
But if Hitler had won, in all likelihood Muslims would not enjoy equal partnership with him. His master race theory would have precluded the vast bulk of the Muslim world. For the few exceptions, we would have to forgo the universality of equality of man in Islam. Greenness of eyes and not good action would determine status. In the 1936 Olympics Hitler could not bring himself to shake the hands of Jesse Owens, the black American sprinter.
Hitler was an empire builder, and he would easily turn on any demand to revive the Ottoman Caliphate once he had consolidated his victories. Of course, historically Hitler did support the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem, but the nature of the alliance was opportunistic and not very deep. The Arab’s only had the Axis powers to turn to because they were the only ones outside the realm of the colonising and Zionist Allies.
Even though there maybe some ambiguity regarding Hitler’s exact views on Muslims, one can supplement the gaps by looking at the present through the examples of neo-Nazi’s who try to live his ideology. Neo-Nazi groups ultimately find their way into racism and xenophobia.
There is frustration at Israel, but no amount of wrongs bundled together shall ever make a right, or even right a wrong. If anything, Hitler’s actions are one of the enduring justifications for Israel’s continuing paranoia, one which has led to a repetition of history. The irony is that some Jews are now doing what was once done to them.
So, if you ever hear someone angry at Israel praising Hitler, talk some sense into them. Because, if he had lived to see his plans through you might have had the same conversation as an indentured slave, ultimately facing the same fate at his hands the Jews got.
Published in the Express Tribune, June 8th, 2010.
Reader Comments (34)
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Although Hitler was clearly delusional, what is frightening now is the Nazi behaviour of Israeli authorities, a country that ironically came together as an indirect consequence of the Nazi atrocities on the Jews of their time. The magnitude of what they did however remains disputed.
Not any less frightening is the Nazi-like behaviour of the coalitions Israel finds support with.
But what really scares the living daylights out of me is when the allegedly educated elite of our country blindly believe that a bunch of lunatics yielding old Russian ammunition can have the resources and resolve to create havoc all over the country (and indeed abroad) without any Western influence or help.
Sure blame “rogue elements” in the ISI but surely the party reaping benefits from any plan should be the first to be suspected of perpetrating it. Those who stand to gain the most from the sad situation that our country is in cannot be absolutely sin-free.Recommend
I hope all those who have been sending across the popular sms about Hitler wanting to anihilate all jews; people would use this article on the best of their limited brain capacities.
However Fasi, try searching this on google “what did Hitler think of Muslims?” and see what the results you get.
That should be an eye opener for all the fundamentalists providing fuel for media imagery!
Wonderful read…a kind that would bring a smirking smile to most faces :)Recommend
Apartheid, colonialism and violence were all products of renaissance thought. the two are not mutually exclusive.Recommend
Hitler was a great admirer of the British. The class system, aristocracy and of colonialism. He was impressed by the way 250,000 Brits managed to maintain their hold over British India. Had Hitler not been halted at Stalingrad, his quest for Middle Eastern oil and the the jewel in the crown, India, would have subjugated many millions of Muslims across the Middle East, South Asia and Central Asia to a new period of German imperial rule.Recommend
Thank you for making me realise something that was so glaringly obvious, yet so misunderstood.Recommend
Hitler was a great admirer of British aristocracy and their ability to rule the world. Aiming for his eventual dominance over Central Asia and the Middle East for easy access to the oil required to the fuel the German war machine. With India the next to fall, the liberators would have quickly replaced the British as Indias new masters.Recommend
I second “Umair Jav”…Recommend
Reading of the state of Palestinians wrenches hearts, but believe me, reading of the genocide of 17 million people during the holocaust, not necessarily jews but any rebels that could bring sleepless nights to Hitler cause equally unbearable heartache. Terrorism at any level is not something that can leave anyone at satisfaction with their spiritual self.
@marium, i did receive the SMS doing the rounds considering Hitler to be the messiah of the Palestinians however, it was definitely impossible for me to digest the fact that a power greedy (no, not even power hungry) person whose own people turned agisnt him in the end for having mercilessly slaughtered millions of people could ever be considered anyone’s messiah. Most of us have read of the Operation Valkyrie, in which Hitler escaped death but had to meet it a few months later when his own men left him in the lurch.
I believe it is just one of those escapism stints that we have when we are frustrated to the limit that now of all the people in the world, the butcher of all times Hitler (Stalin follows) is being asked for help. Why the Jews can do what they want to, is a whole world different from the world of terorism… its the politico-economic hegemony in the world map. I just wish we could infuse our energies into constructive purposes more than we do at bashing, lashing and thrashing. We complain our voice isnt heard, isnt paid attention to. I am sorry to say this folks, but we dont really have that kind of voice right now.
Excellent arguments Fasi, it was a topic that really shuns one up! Great.Recommend
@ Wajih Khattak
I am glad to know some really optimistic and i mean REALLY optimistic people like you are still present in the world. Well, then i am sure it would be just to look at the terrorists for their ‘qualities, ambition, courage or any other quality’ and appreciate them for having it, without actually acknowledging the ‘ambition’ is to kill innocent people – women who go to the meena bazar in peshawar or women who got to the moon market in lahore because they are not observing purdah and are worth killing? Or the quality of valour that they have when they, just to blow off the head of a woman politician kill along with her 150 men, that would actually be translated to 150 breadwinners from 150 families leaving hundreds of orphans and 150 widows with most probably little educational background and no hope left to bring up their children?
I used to like Hitler for his qualities – when i was 12. I am glad i have opened my eyes to words like massacre, genocide, hatred, cruelty, trying to be God in this world and defining purgation. I am glad I grew up.Recommend
disaapointing article from mr fasiRecommend
Holocaust, still a mystery!Recommend
Highlighting Israel barbarism by Pakistan Media is encouraging.As for Judaism is concern HITLER was the greatest leader of the world.His greatest mistake was not eliminating Jews from the face of earth.As he wrote in his book that i was able to eliminate all of them but left some for you to know that why i was eliminating them.( he should have finished this curse on earth which is a headache for the whole of humanity).Recommend
@ Wajih Khattak
I am so glad really oprimistic people like you reside out there and when i say ‘really’ i mean it. Somehow i find it absolutely impossible to see ‘qualities’ in a person like hitler who would kill anyone that would threaten him psychologically, aristocratically, physically or even unintentionally. A frioend of mine once said, “i am against terrorism, but yaar, obviously they have so much courage.” She quoted the example of Ahmad Omar Saeed Shaikh but you know what? All good and brilliance is lost when i think of terrorists blowing up women in the meena bazar of peshawar or the moon market of lahore to protest against the UNveiled women, or when just to blow the brains out of a popular woman politician they kill alongwith her 150 men, translated as 150 breadwinners, leaving behind 150 widows and hundreds of orphans who would have a bleak or uncertain future. To hell goes such bravery, such valour and such courage. No good came out of Hitler. Hius qualities, as you say stay confined to his own persons, what good is good that is confined to one’s self alone?
I used to like Hitler’s qualities – we were told stories of his discipline and leadership – i was 12 at that time and was impressionable at that age. i am glad i grew up to know words like chauvinism, authoritarianism, totalitarianism, cruetly, massacre, genocide, hatred and butchery. I am glad i read about Stalin and Hitler. And i am glad i grew up.Recommend
Fasi you deserve a round of applause!!!Recommend
At Wasdan,
I condemn the behaviour of Jewish hardliners who are causing so much suffering to inocennt people in strongest manner. But I think one shouldnt forget get that Jews are not a curse or anything worse for that matter. Do you remember as Muslims we are meant to respect all the previous Prophets and many many of them were Jews e.g. Hazrat Musa(AS), Hazrat Suleman(AS), Hasrat Jusuf(AS).
Jews are humans first and Jews second, so Hitlers deeds can be never considered as praiseworthy. BTW, Hitler just didnt kill Jews, he also killed the disabled, the Poor etc. So he was really crazy, and can never ever be praised.Recommend
When will Israel learn that the entire world is watching them morph into the same kind of fascists that manufactured the Holocaust? A good lesson — we become like that we hate.Recommend
@Sania
I think either you don’t get my point or you don’t want to, there is no denying that Hitler is one of the greatest leader in the modern history, else not everyone would be reading and discussing him. Comparing him to Taliban or the terrorist groups working in Afghanistan and Pakistan is senseless, I don’t understand how one can compare a Person with an Ideology. One can not compare these two, Hitler was getting rid of the Jews as they were trouble maker in Germany or a potential threat to the country, probably doing the same what we should be doing with the Terrorist working in Pakistan. I hate racism and that’s exactly what Hitler was doing, so in person I might not like Hitler but I respect him for what he was. But as you have grown up and its hard to make you understand therefore I think its useless to keep explaining my ideas to you.
Plus watch the link I pasted above, this would give you an idea how media have brainwashed us.
So much I want to write but I think we should stick to the topic rather than getting personal and taunting each other.Recommend
It must be emphasized that Palestinian is not a Muslim issue – it is and will remain a human tragedy. That majority happen to be Muslim has little bearing on the basic issue – indeed bravest and outspoken voices have come from non Muslims Palestinians – Edward Said being the most steadfast of them all. It can be argued that posing the issue as injustice toward Muslims only does grave damage to the cause and dilutes the issue – that it promotes Muslims=Palestinians=Terrorist triangular equality is perhaps most devastating.Recommend
@Saeed Nadir.
I completely agree to what you have said. On many occasions Hitler have stated that British Government and British People are the natural allies of Nazi germany as both nations hold the same value and have a strong Bond. Many in the british aristocracy did believed that and tried hard to form an alliance between the Britania and 3rd Reich. But Churchill who him self was a racist and believed in White Mans supremacy disagreed with Hitler on several issues.Recommend
**@ Wajih Khattak**
i am glad you wrote back and you are right, your point simply doesnt get to me.
1.You believe the Jews were a potential threat to the country hence wiping them out through genoicide is actually sensible.
2. Still you hate racism, although genocide is okay. especially if its jews that are being killed.
3. You respect him for what Hitler was. I might have missed a huge poart of historical literature but… i am sure you could explain what Hitler really was? i mean other than an authoritarian, totalitarian, racist. Oh yes, he had a fiance, so he had a soft side. But did she ditch him or what? I might have grown up but i am open to learn any revealing facts about the GOOD hitler had in him. honestly.
It been good reading u, i would surely appreciate if u would enlighten a lot of people like me further on THE topic as you insist. Because rhetoric is discussions really doesnt work much, you might already know.Recommend
@ Khattak Sahab
Thanks for the link, i watched it, and i can assure you not many people in Pakistan are fooled by the media statistics. We as a nation feel more for the Palestinians than the Israelis. its the religious connection. the video-docu that u have uploaded might be eye opening for the americans who are befooled by their govrenmnets and media into believeing that the Muslims are the ones creating havoc any where. I am not saying Israelis or Jews are the victims Now. But they were victims then and it shouldnt have been. They are wrong now, but to say that Hitler was right then, is simply ludicruous. ChillRecommend
@Sania and Wajih Khattak
Both of your discussion was intersting to read and it’s difficult for me to decide who’s right.
But I tend to agree with Wajih Khattak’s point of view more. Hitler is being blamed because he lost the war. Had he won it, the situation would’ve been different.
Jews were the trouble makers so he killed them just like the terrorists in Pakistan and what Pakistani army is doing it.
Had it been Muslims or Christians or any other group of people at that time, Hitler would’ve killed them too!
Whatever Hitler did was wrong there’s no second opinion. But I’m just thinking if they were Muslims intead of Jews would this be such grave issue now? Why discussing it in Europe and the West is a taboo?
It shows the double standards of the West. When it comes to East Temor, a UN resolution takes place and peace force takes over it from Indonesia but UN is helpless when it comes to Palestenian. That’s what pains me.Recommend
@ shahid khan
“Jews were the trouble makers so he killed them just like the terrorists in Pakistan and what Pakistani army is doing it.”
Jews were trouble makers, so were their women, children and elderly, the refugees at the camps and Auschwitz, the prisoners of war and their families? Cant digest that.
“Had it been Muslims or Christians or any other group of people at that time, Hitler would’ve killed them too.” How true!! Whats so charming and respectable about that man left to admire, i am still keen to know.
“if they were Muslims intead of Jews would this be such grave issue now? Why discussing it in Europe and the West is a taboo?” Because Europe was the place which bore the most of the brunt of Hitler’s atrocities. My dad, a very liberal progressive minded man hated India because he had seen his family being killed during partition at the hands of Hindus and Sikhs. I, the second generation, have nothing against India. But its so understandable. They dont talk about Hitler because they have suffered at his hands.
“if they were Muslims intead of Jews would this be such grave issue now?” When we shall have a discussion about a column written on the suffering of Muslims, believe me we will discuss that. This column is about whether Hitler could be the Muslims’ messiah or not. Or did i miss something?
“Whatever Hitler did was wrong there’s no second opinion.” Clapping. Fall of Curtain. Thanks a lot.Recommend
As far as praising Hitler is concerned, I would say his sheer will power, the great rise of German nation and political abilities need to be considered. Great man yes but mad also.
The above statement can be made if you read history impartially without any prejudices. Holocaust I would again disagree, because they still have not found the proverbial 6 million (yes 6 million i read in one of the comments 17 but the actual figure is 6) dead Jews across Europe. Also Hitler was not the first persecutor of Jews. They were being persecuted all across Europe for centuries. Also Stalin killed more Jews than Hitler but we are not talking about that.
What I mean to say is that we cannot demonize one person and say all others were good. They are all equally bad. All countries must protect their NATIONAL INTEREST what ever it may be. This the rule of the game.
That being said Hitler represented Germany, and his agenda was always geared toward benefits to German people. He not only was on good terms with Mufti of Jerusalem, but also inducted Muslims in SS and for that matter Sikhs too. But there is no doubt if he would have succeed, Muslims would have received the short end of the stick.
We have a tendency of thinking that the enemy of my enemy is my friend but usually thats not the case for very long. If you disagree please see post World War 2 Europe.Recommend
‘Hitler’s actions are one of the enduring justifications for Israel’s continuing paranoia, one which has led to a repetition of history.’
Even though the name and image of Hitler and his irate and reckless sense of adventurism were galvanized as a singular scapegoat embodiment for the holocaust, there were others pulling the strings. But unfortunately the aforementioned excerpt by Fasi is what it has all boiled down to now.
‘The irony is that some Jews are now doing what was once done to them.’
As much as the hurt and pain one feels esp. in reference to the word ‘Jews’ used in this line, most unfortunately this has what it has come to. I wouldn’t quite like to put it that way though but at the same time I’m not even sure how to sum it all up in a single sentence.Recommend
@Sania
Simply my point is that when the great leader from Islam invaded other countries and killed many, they became our heroes, when Asoka killed a lot of innocent people he was a hero, history has many of them which are remembered for their greatness even when our very own 5 NLI battalion killed many innocents families in Wazirstan they were heroes. Why I am against the idea of jews being the victim is because this issue is overrated, when I said media brainwashing, the link was just an example. Its good that not most of Pakistani are dumb as Americans and trusting the media such as Fox, CNN etc. but you should think about all these movies and books, and see the subliminal messages and the rest of Hollywood movies, dont you think this does somehow affect are decision making, maybe I am resisting their idea so much that I tend to praise Hitler but that’s ok. If Hitler was to be Muslim, and would have fought for Pakistan (though the Germans suffered a lot) with the same passion, now in every Pakistan study exams a question about him would have been compulsory. Think about the way we respect Tariq-bin-Ziyad, do you think the European have the same feelings about him or the Ottoman Empire. I know I am banging my head with a wall and you would never agree with me as you have made up your mind, and neither would I agree to you. But its unfair with Hitler the way he is remembered, and very unfair that jews gets favor in everything. Probably not all the jews are the same, as not all the muslim are terrorist, but again are we not being stereotyped by the west. getting taunts even from the officials. Look at how we are treated at airports, they wont let of any chance of humiliating Muslims specially Pakistani. As far as your questions about the innocent childrens and womens, I used to had the same feelings and even would get into serious discussion with one of my best friend from Palestine. Condemning their attacks on schools and malls, and I never could understand him how he could say its fair. Some time one is left with no choice, even I have heard the same from a Pakistani who said if something would have happened to his son (a young kid bringing dinner to his father in Swat and Pakistan Army shot some fires at him) he would have attempted a suicide attack on them. Now that very unlikely that a common man can get to the Israeli commando but one wounded so much has got nothing to lose even sanity, so yes now its justified for me what the Palestinian was talking about. Two wrongs does not make a right, I know but we don’t know the feelings of the person who is shattered, and we should not even try to understand as we simple can not. Why did Radovan Karadzic never got made fun of in Hollywood movies, why dont we see many movies about him barbaric acts against Muslims, what happened to him? why is he out of the news?
The good side of Hitler is for the Germans who understood him and knew what he wanted, there are many personalities in history who have gone to the insane limits of doing something, than why overrate Hitler’s work, just because what he did affected jews in general. That is my problem with this issue not that I support killing of innocent people.
The debate will go on and on without a conclusion as both of us are rigid on our ideas and would not accept that either of us are wrong, and there is nothing wrong with that either.
I hope I have answered some of your questions.Recommend
Lets talk about successive Pakistani governments and Pakistanis and their failure in nation building. What Hitler did and what the Israeli governments do is create common causes & platforms for their people. Good or bad is relative to the times these events occur. Germans of that time used to think Hitler was best thing to happen to them since sliced bread, so do pro-government Israeli citizens when they think of their own political leadership. I agree all people from any race or ethnicity cannot be bad, it is the propaganda that gets them drunk. What can we get drunk on and become a nation Jinnah wanted? Religion has nothing to do with nations as the experts say, it crosses geographical and ethnic boundaries and suggests the concept of an Ummah -a global community. Therefore it doesn’t offer anything for people wanting or needing to be a nation. Is there a solution out there for this dilemma that doesn’t border on racism or fascism?Recommend
Adolf Hitler was a monster. An evil and vile person. How can any sane person think of him as a Saviour or a hero just beats me.
People in our country are essentially jahil and right now we are experiencing in some ways the fascism that Hitler employed, although it may be in the form of the Taliban. Ever try arguing with a Talib? He will let you know what he thinks of kafirs – sub-humans.
Hitler or Taliban or any other form evil ideology which aims to subjugate people through violence is bound to end up in the dustbin of history.Recommend
I watched a lecture by Imran Hosein yesterday, and I think most of you who have interest in the above discussion should watch it too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tv16WrqRtaU&feature=related
@Sania: I hope this lecture would be of interest to you.Recommend
@ Umer and Wajih
I don’t know whether the arguments convince me but yes, thanks for one thing although, I do feel extremely COAXED to read more. It might be true (now that i have detached myself from the issue after a couple of days) that my reading of Hitler comprises more of Literature and a bit less of History so probably a sensitive view of poets, novelists and playwrights might have reached to me, although i do admit books of history never made me admire that guy. Whatever that guy was, his political actions undermine all those qualities that he would have been born with. Anyway, it was good talking to you. And hey, i dont know your age but still, i suggest you should also try reading some more. One piece of the jigsaw never completes the whole picture you know. Take care.Recommend
@ Sania
:)Recommend
@ Wajih
p.s. you are NOT banging your head with a wall. Although thinking of you doing that did sound hilarious.Recommend
Standin Ovation Fasih!!!Recommend
You know, this is a perspective I’ve only ever seen in Pakistanis, that Jews are the cause of all the world’s problems. I guess then it serves us right that the entire world is so anti-Islam, when despite belonging to the oh so noble religion of peace, love and equality, we blame an entire race for simply existing in such a matter of fact manner.
Hitler did NOT annihilate Jews in WW2. He did however, murder someone’s son, someone’s father, someone’s husband, someone’s friend. That’s the way I see it at least, that they weren’t Jews but people, people with hopes and dreams and aspirations just like the rest of us. Which religion they chose to follow, well that’s really none of my business. My concern is with the 4 million humans murdered at Nazi hands. But then again, pardon me for being broad-minded.Recommend