Double standards

Published: October 31, 2012
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The writer is a retired lieutenant-general of the Pakistan Army and served as chairman of the Pakistan Ordnance Factories Board

The writer is a retired lieutenant-general of the Pakistan Army and served as chairman of the Pakistan Ordnance Factories Board

Imran Khan’s peaceful protest march has raised more questions than provided answers. The stated main purpose of the peace procession was to raise voice against US drone attacks. Very few would disagree that the use of drones undermines national sovereignty, is a violation of international law, lowers the image of the state in the eyes of its people, at times kills innocent people, instills a lurking fear in the population and aggravates anti-American sentiment. On the surface, these appear to be justifiable reasons even if one were to ignore their tactical advantage for opposing drone strikes. But the question of drones is far too complex as it is linked with several interconnected issues that need to be addressed along with it.

It should not be lost on Imran and all other critics of drones as what has in the first place given rise to the use of drones. The fact is that the Pakistani state has lost its writ over most parts of Fata and despite several military operations and the continued presence of the army and paramilitary forces in the region, it has not succeeded in regaining effective control. Not only is the Taliban’s power base getting entrenched in North and South Waziristan, where drones are mostly being deployed, but their ideology has also taken hold and is spreading widely. There could be no better demonstration of this hard reality than the peace procession being denied permission to go beyond Tank. The drones are, at least, containing the militants and it is for this reason that the military and the political leadership have been acquiescing to its use. In a drone-free environment, the Taliban power base would expand even more rapidly.

What we are seeing is that the tribal belt, which always had an autonomous character, is getting even further cut off from mainstream Pakistan and coming under the dominant influence of the Taliban.

Why is it that Imran and other right wing parties remain silent about the atrocities being committed by the terrorists? The Taliban are challenging the state, its Constitution and the very ideals that we cherish as followers of Mohammad Ali Jinnah’s vision. How many among them are raising their voices for the brutal attack on young Malala Yousufzai who stood valiantly, risking her life for the values that every Pakistani should be proud of? The Taliban are targeting schools, remain deadly opposed to girls’ education and consider women as chattels. By imposing their myopic medieval ideology through brute force, they are destroying the future of coming generations. To expect that the Taliban will abandon their goals of capturing power and spreading their ideology if only the US would abandon its policy of using drones would be stretching naivety to its limits. Moreover, they are using the tribal belt as a sanctuary to engage in all types of criminal activity within Pakistan and have developed a nexus with the Afghan Taliban, allowing our territory to be used for launching attacks on Nato and Afghan forces. This has been a major source of friction between the US and Pakistan and, given the former a valid reason to unilaterally target militant hideouts in Fata. The Taliban apologists would argue that it is the US occupation of Afghanistan that has given rise to this situation and once their forces withdraw, the Afghan militants, including the Haqqani network, would go back to Afghanistan. Firstly, it is highly doubtful that they would leave, but even if they did, the space they vacate will be quickly filled by the Tehreek-e-Taliban Pakistan (TTP).

The other reality is that the TTP’s activities have a serious impact on the overall security situation in Pakistan. This has had grave implications for the economy. Besides, there remains a constant threat that the Taliban could strike at our military installations, giving rise to fears that they could even target nuclear installations.

Some may argue that the Taliban are hitting at our military installations because we are fighting them in Fata. This is inverse logic because a country cannot allow its territory to be taken over by non-state actors. And how is it that the same people who are crying hoarse against drones do not have a word of condemnation for the Taliban when they usurp state authority, violate our sovereignty, kill innocent people, attempt a murderous attack on young Malala and strike at security installations?

Regrettably, the price of silence and political expediency could well prove to be the prelude to the first stage of Pakistan’s surrender to the Taliban and other jihadi forces, if our leaders do not listen to the wake-up call.

Published in The Express Tribune, November 1st, 2012.

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Reader Comments (45)

  • afzaalkhan
    Oct 31, 2012 - 11:29PM

    Another Drone apologist, just like you say there can’t be any excuse for TTP same way there can’t be any excuse for drones. So do that before preaching to others. Aftaab Sherpao just called for same strategy, I guess he is TTP sympathizer too.

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  • faraz
    Oct 31, 2012 - 11:44PM

    34 out of 318 drone strikes hit TTP Mehsud; rest targeted good Taliban. 85 percent strikes occurred in North Waziristan while TTP was based in South Waziristan. These simple facts show that TTP is neither a reaction to drone, nor will it cease its activities if drones are stopped

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  • Falcon
    Oct 31, 2012 - 11:52PM

    General Sahab –
    As someone mentioned before on ET, most of the ‘Taliban apologists’ by your standards won’t mind killing the person who attacked poor Malala with bare hands. Nobody is saying don’t go after Taliban. All IK is saying is deal with the issue strategically by denying militants the ideological space they are using to recruit people. We need to de-centralize the fight. Centrally managed anti-terrorism strategy by establishment is not turning out to be effective against a fluid network structure based enemy that has locals on its side. There is a saying in Pashtu, which means, why kill an enemy with the poison, when a sweet candy can do a better job. Lastly, if you get a chance, please do listen to IK’s recent interviews where he has explained his view of the root causes.

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  • adil javed
    Nov 1, 2012 - 12:02AM

    Nothing usual.blame game..”ttp ttp” these are the international funded grouping
    All teaming against the integrity of pakistan.my only question is why have they never attacked resturants food courts ceneimas or malls?schools and specifically girls school are their utmost targets.and by the way malala yusaf zai is nothing,but just a puppet and you know who is planning this whole play.although i dont like khan but even then admit at least he tried…

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  • shahid
    Nov 1, 2012 - 12:24AM

    The Taliban are challenging the state, its Constitution and the very ideals that we
    cherish as followers of Mohammad Ali Jinnah’s vision.

    So let us see what Jinnah Sahib’s policy was towards FATA. Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah’s addressed a Tribal Jirga at Government House, Peshawar, on 17 April, 1948:

    “Keeping in view your loyalty, help, assurances and declarations we ordered, as you know, the withdrawal of troops from Waziristan as a concrete and definite gesture on our part–that we treat you with absolute confidence and trust you as our Muslim brethren across the border. I am glad that there is full realization on your part that now the position is basically different. It is no longer a foreign Government as it was, but it is now a Muslim government and Muslim rule that holds the reigns of this great independent sovereign State of Pakistan. It is now the duty of every Mussalman, yours and mine, and every Pakistani to see that the State, which we have established, is strengthened in every department of life and made prosperous and happy for all, especially the poor and the needy.
    Pakistan has no desire to unduly interfere with your internal freedom. On the contrary; Pakistan wants to help you and make you, as far as it lies in our power, self-reliant and self-sufficient and help in your educational, social and economic uplift, and not be left as you are dependent on annual doles, as has been the practice hitherto which meant that at the end of the year you were no better off than beggars asking for allowances, if possible a little more.”

    People who these days wax eloquent about going back to Jinnah Sahib’s Pakistan, totally forget what he did to deal with the explosive situation in FATA at that time. British who had fought an unending war for nearly a century, at the time of partition were fighting the Faqir of Epi and his followers in FATA. Jinnah Sahib contrary, to the jingoism being preached these days by many, withdrew Pakistani forces from FATA.

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  • Nov 1, 2012 - 12:25AM

    “Why is it that Imran and other right wing parties remain silent about the atrocities being committed by the terrorists?”

    Presumably because one can verbally abuse the U.S. as one wishes but if you criticize the Talibs you have to worry about getting assassinated.

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  • Cautious
    Nov 1, 2012 - 12:37AM

    The reason for the dbl std is obvious. No one expects you to go to war with the American’s so ranting about the drones vents anger without resulting in Pakistan military casualties.

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  • Trudy Cooper
    Nov 1, 2012 - 1:02AM

    “And how is it that the same people who are crying hoarse against drones do not have a word of condemnation for the Taliban when they usurp state authority, violate our sovereignty, kill innocent people, attempt a murderous attack on young Malala and strike at security installations?”

    It would be helpful if you would show substantiation, Mr. Masood, for this allegation. Clearly, you are not talking about Imran Khan, because you (and any of us, using google) can find several instances when he spoke out directly about the Taliban’s responsibility for Malala’s death, and condemned it.

    Who are these others? Please name them. Otherwise your article just seems to be rhetoric without research.

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  • Lala Gee
    Nov 1, 2012 - 1:36AM

    @faraz:

    “85 percent strikes occurred in North Waziristan while TTP was based in South Waziristan. These simple facts show that TTP is neither a reaction to drone, nor will it cease its activities if drones are stopped”

    Why? Only 15% drones strikes on TTP targets. Are there good and bad Taliban for USA also? Of course, TTP is not a reaction to drones. Try to guess who is funding their ‘Tehreek’? Please don’t tell me they are self-financing.

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  • sabi
    Nov 1, 2012 - 1:53AM

    Talat Sahib
    Fact of the matter is our army is not figting with taliban the way it should.Since establishment has no logical resons for immence restraints that it has been showing for terrorists the only way left is to create schizophrenia.There is abundance of pseudo intelectuals to serve this purpose of establishment.This ghairat brigades comes up with stories, almost on daily basis, frightning the nation with worst come scenarios in case of military operations.These talibans have not even proper shoes and dresses still they are more powerfull than one million army which boast of teaching examplary lesson to india in case of war.How ridiculous.
    Regards and kudos for such thoughts.

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  • sabi
    Nov 1, 2012 - 2:20AM

    Talat Sahib
    Fact of the matter is our army is not figting with taliban the way it should.Since establishment has no logical resons for immence restraints that it has been showing for terrorists the only way left is to create schizophrenia.There is abundance of pseudo intelectuals to serve this purpose of establishment.This ghairat brigades comes up with stories, almost on daily basis, frightning the nation with worst come scenarios in case of military operations.These talibans have not even proper shoes and dresses still they are more powerfull than one million army which boast of teaching examplary lesson to india in case of war.How ridiculous.
    Regards and kudos for such thoughts.Recommend

  • usama
    Nov 1, 2012 - 3:20AM

    Fact is … come on ppl you no nothing about whats going on and u started ur statements like the fact is.
    the smiliest thing is who ever kill any other human he/she should be condem if TTP do that they should be condem and if drone do that they should be condem.
    but the problem if TTP kill ppl than we call them terrorist so i think we should also start calling USA a terrorist too. and if someone who call TTP terrorist and not USA then he/she is a double standard person …

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  • mahakaalchakra
    Nov 1, 2012 - 3:58AM

    @Lala Gee: You asked, “Try to guess who is funding their ‘Tehreek’? Please don’t tell me they are self-financing.”

    Could it not be the same network who are funding Afghan Taliban “Tehreek” which made them fight combined power of NATO and Afghan Army both for the last 10 years or so? Both, TTP and AT have Mullah Omar as their hero.

    TTP openly supported Pakistan military in a scenerio if Pakistan is attacked by India in 2008 in retaliation of Mumbai terrorist attack.

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  • numbersnumbers
    Nov 1, 2012 - 4:11AM

    @Lala Gee:
    WOW, you say “Try to guess who is funding their (TTP) ‘Tehreek’?” Don’t keep us in suspense, tell us WHO is funding the TTP!

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  • Something Clever
    Nov 1, 2012 - 5:30AM

    @usama:
    “I think we should also start calling USA a terrorist too.”
    You’re obviously among those who don’t know what terrorism is. Explaining it gets old and falls on deaf ears of those who just love to use that line like they love using “liberal fascist” even though it doesn’t make any sense. So, instead of the explaining I’ll go with putting up a sign in the form of a comment to point out your comment and reasoning skills are best ignored.

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  • FN
    Nov 1, 2012 - 8:22AM

    If IK thinks going to root cause would solve the problem, how about going to the root cause of drone attacks? Let’s see, why did drone attacks start in the first place? Was it because people were going from part of our territory, over which we have no control, into Afghanistan and attacked NATO forces? How about we launch an operation in North Waziristan and make sure our state’s writ is established? Once we stop infiltration into Afghanistan, and establish writ of the state, drone attacks would stop. Also, who is to say that all terrorism problems would be resolved once NATO forces leave Afghanistan? If we do nothing now, could they possibly get worse after NATO leaves? What if after the withdrawal terrorists cross over from Afghanistan, launch attacks on our soil and flee back as they did in Malala’s case? At least, right now, these attacks are rare as there is NATO to deal with them on the other side. For now, all we have to do is fight them on our side of the border.

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  • Nov 1, 2012 - 8:49AM

    @shahid:

    A lot of water has passed through the river Indus from the dae of speech of Mr. Jinnah till date. the Lot of things has undergone a change, ideology, socioeconomic and political situation and thought process . Hence i feel, with the change of circumstances, you need to modify your thinking suitably. .

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  • Akber
    Nov 1, 2012 - 9:34AM

    Great respect for Mr talat masood but is it a really far fetched idea to grasp, drones are not only against our sovereignty but its also anti humane for you kill suspect militants with their wife children and neighbours and than it comes back and kill those who come to help the burned the maimed injured of drone strike at times they strike on funeral prayers of drone victims , once they strike on a medrassah in damadolla where 60 children died and than you express your surprise why there is more radicalism in our society now than pre 9/11 , now more than what it was before 2004 when you started military offensive in tribal area and used artillery on villages from 10 – 15 miles away use gun ship helicopters in civilian areas, like bombs would know who is militant and who is innocent, talat sahab rightly identified we need to condemn, fight and stop this draconian ideology of Taliban with all do respect you cannot bomb ideology out of people you fight and defeat an ideology when you bring masses from the area to you side and you can’t do that by indiscriminately bombing the population or allow your ally to do it with little or no remorse for innocent lives of children women and non combatants lost. Imran khan is the only person who is giving you only workable solution to fight the ideology by isolating militants by bringing tribals to your side and than maybe a small targeted operation with the help of tribals to eliminate them completely. You have tried military operations for past 10 years and failed its time for new idea to clean up this mess

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  • gul bahadur
    Nov 1, 2012 - 9:40AM

    Who are these TALIBS? Would some one tell us about their identity and what they want from Pakistani people CHANGE OUR FAITH?

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  • observer
    Nov 1, 2012 - 9:41AM

    @Lala Gee:

    Try to guess who is funding their ‘Tehreek’? Please don’t tell me they are self-financing.

    May be General Hamid Gul, who believes that the TTP are true ‘mujahids of Pakistan’.
    Or may be the organisation once headed by Gen Gul.
    Try this for size and see if it fits.

    http://criticalppp.com/archives/20304

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  • gp65
    Nov 1, 2012 - 10:38AM

    @observer: You always provide really interesting links. Thanks. I even enjoyed the link related to Manto and Ashoke Kumar.

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  • Manoj Joshi, India
    Nov 1, 2012 - 10:51AM

    Pakistan as a nation is faced with the most serious challenges tackling which is certainly not an easy task. The greatest enemies of mankind in modern times the menace of terrorism and religious fundamentalism. The drone attacks by the US on the Afghan-Pak border have killed many innocent citizens of Pakistan as well as Afghanistan which is the price the innocent pay during such times of adversity. The concerns shared by Imran Khan and his party in this context is no doubt one of the populist sops being offered to the electorate of Pakistan with elections to the National Assembly of Pakistan being very near. The military operations on the borders are most essential to check the growing influence of the Talibans which although hard are inevitable. Political opportunism has been an ingredient feature in every democracy with political party or parties trying to extract political mileage out of issues in other words trying to fish in trouble waters and Imran Khan’s acts are no different in this regard. The question does arise as to why the former cricketer of Pakistan is staying silent with regard to the atrocities of the Taliban in North and South Waziristan? Infact as a part of development of any democratic system negative publicity of the opponent has been an aspect most poignant and as democracy is taking roots in The Islamic Republic of Pakistan wherein Imran Khan wants to make his position in Pakistani politics his acts are all indicating to the same political objective. The Pakistan army is facing one of the biggest challenges as an institution however they have been able to perform reasonably well as the nation has to be safeguarded from the threat of Talibans. The political parties in Pakistan must refrain from indulging in opportunism which is not in their and Pakistan’s national interest.

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  • Glaedr
    Nov 1, 2012 - 11:20AM

    @afzaalkhan

    I suggest that you actually read the article.

    Let me spell it out for you:

    The Taliban are challenging the writ of the state, blowing up schools and killing young girls seeking education.

    Since past peace agreements with these barbarians have failed and since surrendering all our ideals to them is not a viable option, you have mainly two choices:

    1) You can either stop them through a military operation, which would be costly, difficult and will result in considerable collateral damage.

    2) Or you can stop using drones, which would be cheaper, more convenient and will result in considerable collateral damage.

    Since there is going to be collateral damage either way, it is obvious which is more preferable. Which is why drones continue to operate with the Pakistani state’s approval, and why Pakistan is demanding that the US share its drone technology with it. And really, it is not so much the civilian casualties that bother Pakistan, but the fact that they are being used by the US.

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  • observer
    Nov 1, 2012 - 12:33PM

    @gp65:

    Thanks for the appreciation. I try to avoid the foot in the mouth syndrome.

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  • Manoj Joshi, India
    Nov 1, 2012 - 12:54PM

    Pakistan as a nation is faced with the most serious challenges tackling which is certainly not an easy task. The greatest enemies of mankind in modern times the menace of terrorism and religious fundamentalism. The drone attacks by the US on the Afghan-Pak border have killed many innocent citizens of Pakistan as well as Afghanistan which is the price the innocent pay during such times of adversity. The concerns shared by Imran Khan and his party in this context is no doubt on
    e of the populist sops being offered to the electorate of Pakistan with elections to the National Assembly of Pakistan being very near. The military operations on the borders are most essential to check the growing influence of the Talibans which although hard are inevitable. Political opportunism has been an ingredient feature in every democracy with political party or parties trying to extract political mileage out of issues in other words trying to fish in trouble waters and Imran Khan’s acts are no different in this regard. The question does arise as to why the former cricketer of Pakistan is staying silent with regard to the atrocities of the Taliban in North and South Waziristan? Infact as a part of development of any democratic system negative publicity of the opponent has been an aspect most poignant and as democracy is taking roots in The Islamic Republic of Pakistan wherein Imran Khan wants to make his position in Pakistani politics his acts are all indicating to the same political objective. The Pakistan army is facing one of the biggest challenges as an institution however they have been able to perform reasonably well as the nation has to be safeguarded from the threat of Talibans. The political parties in Pakistan must refrain from indulging in opportunism which is not in their and Pakistan’s national interest.

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  • Sultan
    Nov 1, 2012 - 4:31PM

    Talat Sahib,

    The drone program is perhaps the best way to turn a nation against itself! Let me explain. You will have to plug these numbers into a spreadsheet–I cannot attach mine to this post as it is not possible:

    Assumptions:

    1) 100 bad guys embedded in a 3 million population, concentrated in densely populated areas. This is a low assumption as the actual number of bad guys hiding there is a lot higher than 100.
    2) Each drone kills 10% of bad guys and an equal number of innocent civilians–(this is a pretty conservative estimate; in actuality, for every dead bad guy, 4-5 innocent bystanders are killed)
    3) Two men in the family of dead civilians take the vow of vengeance and join the bad guys. Given Pashtun culture, this is also on a lower side–the whole adult male population will take an oath to settle the “blood score.”

    Now you build a simple simulation model which projects 30 chronological drone attacks, each days, weeks or months apart from the previous one, where each strike kills 10% of bad guys, leaving 90% intact; also killing 10% of innocents, making two male adults from each family of dead join the bad guys and on and on it goes for 30 iterations.

    What the model will throw at you is shocking for Pakistanis. What starts as a 100 strong bad lot turns into a roughly 1,600 strong force, full of fury and revenge, over a span of just 30 drone strikes!!! This is called a geometric progression of hate and revenge–you plot it yourself to see the stiff slope! You can play around with the assumptions–change the death rate for bad guys, good guys, new revenge seekers, etc. and the results get even more shocking. For example, if the starting bad lot is increased to 1000 from 100, which is a lot closer to truth, the “army of fury” grows 16,000 men strong, looking for nothing else in life but REVENGE!

    I urge all the armchair warriors to do some work for a change: build this simple model, play around with the assumptions, and I am sure you will soon realize the futility of this campaign of terror. Numbers speak louder than words!

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  • Nov 1, 2012 - 4:46PM

    A superb article that should be made mandatory to read for every anti-drone campaigner out there.

    These campaigners have duped the entire nation into believing that it is not the drone program that is a reaction to terrorism, but rather terrorism is reactionary to the drones!

    In other words, the police wasn’t called in to deal with the bank robbery. The bank robbery happened because the police was called in!

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  • Jat
    Nov 1, 2012 - 5:08PM

    @observer: One notices how posters like Lala Gee and Sultan defend anything and everything related to, don’t hold your breath, (Taliban – Difa E Pakistan – Hamid Gul – jihadis), (PTI – Imran Khan – Religious parties – mullahs), and (Establishment – deep state – policy of strategic depth – Army Generals).

    So what is the common thread holding them together ? For all of them the only purpose in life is to be anti-India.

    This is the beginning and the end of their ideology and policy.

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  • Introspection
    Nov 1, 2012 - 5:52PM

    @Author
    It appears that it should rather be your ‘Double-Standard’ in the ‘KUTCHERY’ rather than Imran Khan’s. Here is an excerpt of CIA & other intelligence agencies’ figures:
    Total killed in Drone attacks: Estimated as between 1,879 and 3,240 (As of 24th July 2012). Weren’t they Human Beings and Muslims, Innocent Civilian Women, and Children, and hundreds of Malalas? Where were you then, and HRW on this issue?

    And please, don’t work yourself thin on turning Malala into a ‘Modern Joan of Arc’, it won’t work…

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  • ahmed
    Nov 1, 2012 - 6:13PM

    Agree 100% with Gen Talat. As usual he shows a great understanding of the real global and national issues. Imran khan is an opportunist, no question about it. What were his motives in marching towards wazirstan? All he did up there was make political speeches and another parrot like ranting, in order to capitalise on the misery of the local people. Amazing to see his convoys of some of the top of the range cars and jeeps. Where was the funding coming from?. He carries on about the West and yet he is there every week raising his funds for political activities. If this not double standards, what is?

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  • tariq
    Nov 1, 2012 - 6:42PM

    This old man has proved that our generals except hameed gul are american stooge.

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  • observer
    Nov 1, 2012 - 6:57PM

    @Sultan:
    Each drone kills 10% of bad guys and an equal number of innocent civilians–(this is a pretty conservative estimate; in actuality, for every dead bad guy, 4-5 innocent bystanders are killed)

    Following typical ‘Indian skulduggery’ I would like to see some data. The available data indicates differently.

    http://www.longwarjournal.org/pakistan-strikes.php

    Two men in the family of dead civilians take the vow of vengeance and join the bad guys.

    The Drones have killed about 3000 people in all.Let us say all of them were ‘innocent bystanders’. That makes a maximum of 6000 bad guys.(3000×2)

    The bad guys have killed 40000 Pakistanis, including about 10000 Pashtuns. So following your logic we should have 80,000 people joining the Good guys or at least 20,000 should join the Good guys.

    The Drones win.

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  • Sultan
    Nov 1, 2012 - 8:30PM

    @Jat:

    Do you know how to use Excel? Build the model I have discussed above, look at the results and then make a promise never to spout drivel again!

    And for the record, I hate all hatemongering monsters–Taliban, Difa e Pakistan, Shia killers, and indians posing as scholars in this forum–for making life miserable for patriotic, tax-paying, law abiding citizens like us. For each fanatic, derailed murderer using religion as his shield, we have ten jats, bhattis, dogars, and other inter-bred, brain dead mongrels using fake moral outrage, spouting open invitation to civil war. I can understand why our indian well wishers would egg us on to do that; what baffles me is why our own “patriotic” lot tows the same line blindly?

    Never accuse me again with depressing figments of your own imagination–you have no idea who I am and what I think. Now, get to work and build the simulation model, if you can!

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  • Sultan
    Nov 1, 2012 - 8:42PM

    @observer:

    Did not take long for @observer drone to strike! Do you know what the word assumptions means? Look it up in the dictionary. And I do not work with data that comes straight out of your rear end–look up the Stanford report, it tells you different numbers.

    And when did I say not to kill the bad guys? If the US can develop the intelligence to find OBL in a haystack and fly in undetected to take him out 10,000 miles away from D.C. then why, can’t we, within our own lands, have the intelligence network to identify and just take out the 100 bad guys without killing innocent people and more fuel to the fire?

    One, two, three….little indian, drone me again!

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  • dawood
    Nov 1, 2012 - 9:19PM

    With due respect i will say it was an article showing the coward,begging,slave mentality of a retired general.Drone attacks are violation of sovereignty.If Army cannot fight with militants(as gen talat stated)then handover FATA to US army.What was quaid’s vision about Pakistan,it is not hidden..Does Quaid ever wanted to intervene military in politics or make business corporations in Pakistan?

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  • Jat
    Nov 1, 2012 - 9:42PM

    @Sultan: You have begun wrong, you will end wrong. You were in such a hurry to complete the number of allotted posts, you didn’t even realize that am one of your “Indian well-wishers”.

    And I have never used Excel, as a matter of fact don’t need to, and it cramps my style. Oh and I have absolutely no desire to know who you are or what you do; your writings here give a fairly good idea. “Brain dead mongrels faking moral outrage”. Probably a data entry operator earning money on the side.

    Rest of what you put down, does not merit a reply.

    Moderators: I have a right to respond.

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  • Sultan
    Nov 1, 2012 - 10:03PM

    @Jat:

    I can picture a wounded animal, spitting mirth from his limp mouth, from a thousand computer terminals away–and it gives me great pleasure! Part of my data entry job has taught me to rip the guts out of pathetic, indian, pseudo slugs that troll these forums with just words ;). Want some neurophen for pain?

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  • Jat
    Nov 1, 2012 - 10:13PM

    @Sultan: Had already written “For all of them the only purpose in life is to be anti-India.” Can’t deny you the tiny pleasure you can still have. Have fun !

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  • observer
    Nov 1, 2012 - 11:04PM

    @Sultan:

    And I do not work with data that comes straight out of your rear end

    Congratulations on using data that comes out of your rear end. No wonder it stinks to high heaven.

    Now, the portion that you are apparently incapable of understanding.
    ASSUME- All the 3000 killed by Drones are innocent bystanders.
    ASSUME- Each leads to 2 bad guys-
    END RESULT- 6000 bad guys.

    KNOW- 40000 dead at the hands of Taliban.
    KNOW- 10000 of them are Pushtuns.
    APPLY your logic of 2 for 1 joining the other side.
    END RESULT- 20000 guys on the pro Drone side.

    Drones win.

    Now let your back side do your thinking for you.

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  • Sultan
    Nov 2, 2012 - 2:54PM

    @observer:

    Seems like none of the armchair analysts, including you, know how to create a simple simulation model in Excel nor do you understand a geometric progression/exponential growth. But what can one expect–the size of a pimple on a teenager’s cheek is bigger than the puss pretending to be a brain you carry in your rear end. Either you work for Lockheed Martin, singing drones win, drones win, drones win like a delirious parrot or are high on Ayn Rand induced morality (I suspect both).

    This is not a Chelsea vs. Man United football game–40,000 beats 6,000 (and your calculation, if it can be called that, is flawed–you ignore the bad guys altogether to start with and fail to follow the logic presented). Of course we have lost 40,000 people that we mourn but we cannot bring back to life. However, to not lose many more, we can implement a strategy that eliminates the problem, and not compounds it–you completely ignored my US taking out OBL analogy!

    If you had taken a minute to put the data in a spreadsheet, you could have seen what I was trying to get at. But your reflexive hatred gets the better of you each and every time and you end up spitting more intellectual placebo and useless drivel! Now, start parrotting the line again….

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  • Ali
    Nov 2, 2012 - 8:09PM

    To All the Anti drone crowd:
    1) Taliban are violating Pakistani sovereignty not American drones.
    2) If you think innocent women and children die because of drone collateral damage then please request your great leader Talibans to stop using them as human shields.

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  • observer
    Nov 2, 2012 - 9:06PM

    @Sultan:

    you completely ignored my US taking out OBL analogy!

    On the contrary, using this against you would have been as easy as taking candy from a child.Not being a Taliban admirer I am not so cruel,

    Coming back to the OBL analogy. What makes you think,(apart from love for Taliban that is) that the Drones are not operating with as precise information as possible. Or are you delusional enough to believe that Naik Mohammad, Mehsud, Al Libi, Ilyas Kashmiri et al were all flukes? Or even delusional enough to believe that all these names are names of ‘innocent bystanders’?

    Yes, there have been civilian deaths. And that has been on account of the monsters using women and children as human shields. And if driving these animals out of Swat has not led to ‘Geometrical progression’ of suicide bombings in Swat. The same will be the result in Waziristan.

    Try it.

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  • Sultan
    Nov 2, 2012 - 9:13PM

    @Ali:

    Scroll up, read my post and build the simulation model. Play around with the assumptions and then come back to the forum–hopefully, you will see the light, although chances are quite dim!

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  • Sultan
    Nov 3, 2012 - 5:34PM

    @observer:

    And if driving these animals out of Swat has not led to ‘Geometrical progression’ of suicide bombings in Swat. The same will be the result in Waziristan.

    More brainless drivel! Did Pak army ask the US to drone Swat? It was cleared by our own soldiers, who went house to house to find and kill these beasts–they did nor rain bombs on the entire valley!

    You remind me of the Dobby, the ghoul in Harry Potter: Dobby must serve master; Dobby must write hateful piffle; Dobby must earn his keep. Enjoy the annual Lockheed Martin “super” salesman awards in Boca Raton!!!

    What an utter waste of time…..

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  • Mustafa
    Nov 10, 2012 - 5:45AM

    Sultan@ The number of likes should have given you a fair idea that you are simply making a fool out of yourself. Now do you need a simulation model to understand that too?

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