Instead, there are two related issues that press me to refer to the water car that has seized the imagination of the nation: how much we know about things and causal paths and the purported causal link between the water-kit guy’s claim and our supposed non-scientific thinking, owed, ostensibly, to religion.
In January this year, Jonah Lehrer wrote a piece in Wired magazine, captioned, “Trials and Errors: Why Science is Failing Us”. His story opens on the morning of November 30, 2006 when “executives at Pfizer... held a meeting with investors at the firm’s research centre in Groton, Connecticut. Jeff Kindler, then CEO of Pfizer... was most excited about a new drug called torcetrapib, which had recently entered Phase III clinical trials, the last step before filing for FDA approval. He confidently declared that torcetrapib would be ‘one of the most important compounds of our generation’”.
Lehrer says that “Kindler’s enthusiasm was understandable: The potential market for the drug was enormous. Like Pfizer’s blockbuster medication, Lipitor... torcetrapib was designed to tweak the cholesterol pathway... [and] block a protein that converts HDL cholesterol into its more sinister sibling, LDL. In theory, this would cure our cholesterol problems, creating a surplus of the good stuff and a shortage of the bad. In his presentation, Kindler noted that torcetrapib had the potential to ‘redefine cardiovascular treatment’”.
“There was a vast amount of research behind Kindler’s bold proclamations. The cholesterol pathway is one of the best-understood biological feedback systems in the human body.... Furthermore, torcetrapib had already undergone a small clinical trial, which showed that the drug could increase HDL and decrease LDL. Kindler told his investors that, by the second half of 2007, Pfizer would begin applying for approval from the FDA. The success of the drug seemed like a sure thing.
“And then, just two days later, on December 2, 2006, Pfizer issued a stunning announcement: The torcetrapib Phase III clinical trial was being terminated. Although the compound was supposed to prevent heart disease, it was actually triggering higher rates of chest pain and heart failure and a 60 per cent increase in overall mortality. The drug appeared to be killing people.
“That week, Pfizer’s value plummeted by $21 billion.
“The story of torcetrapib is a tale of mistaken causation. Pfizer was operating on the assumption that raising levels of HDL cholesterol and lowering LDL would lead to a predictable outcome: Improved cardiovascular health. Less arterial plaque. Cleaner pipes. But that didn’t happen....
“[The] assumption — that understanding a system’s constituent parts means we also understand the causes within the system—is not limited to the pharmaceutical industry or even to biology. It defines modern science. In general, we believe that the so-called problem of causation can be cured by more information, by our ceaseless accumulation of facts. Scientists refer to this process as reductionism. By breaking down a process, we can see how everything fits together; the complex mystery is distilled into a list of ingredients. ... Every year, nearly $100 billion is invested in biomedical research in the US, all of it aimed at teasing apart the invisible bits of the body. We assume that these new details will finally reveal the causes of illness, pinning our maladies on small molecules and errant snippets of DNA. Once we find the cause, of course, we can begin working on a cure.” (For the full article see ">here).
Perhaps physics is more accurate in its determination of causal pathways. I don’t know. What I do know remotely, and in no systematic way, is that much in hard sciences has continued to change. Nature has a way of surprising us. But quite apart from this, the interesting aspect of the current controversy is the debate, if it can be called that, among the scientists and the rancour that shines through all of it. If physics — or is this related to chemistry: I’ll be damned if I knew — is as accurate as it is supposed to be, then the fraud should be easy to detect through the established scientific methods. Why the controversy?
The second aspect is even more interesting. If it is accepted that this fraud and the lack of understanding of science it manifests has to do with our irrational thinking begot of our supposed religiosity, then how does one explain a rather long list of scientific misconduct and fraud from China to Germany to Denmark to Great Britain to The Netherlands to Japan to Norway to you-name-it? Google it for yourself.
The question is important since we are on the issue of causality and the laws of thermo- and whatnotdynamics. The assertion that our Sindhi engineer has done what he has because of our national distaste for rationality, which is somehow a result of our collective sense of religiosity, doesn’t come across to me as a particularly impressive scientific method in determining causality especially when it comes with a condescendingly triumphant ‘case-closed’ attitude.
Just like it would be unscientific to challenge the supposedly immutable laws of thermodynamics, it seems to me to be rather unscientific to declare such linear causality to lead to a water-kit when one is dealing with human beings that, unlike the laws of thermodynamics, are not immutable and prone to doing things for reasons that range from the sublime to the ridiculous.
It is fashionable, of course, to do so but since when did the season’s pret-a-porter become the scientific method? Stupidity and fraudulent behaviour remain as much a property of the secular world as they were, and remain, of the religious one.
But then we can move from stressing the scientific method in one area to flouting it in another because that makes good copy and serves politico-ideological agendas. The Laws of Politicodynamics be praised!
Published in The Express Tribune, August 8th, 2012.
COMMENTS (74)
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@Toba Alu: Sure. I will definitely read it. Thanks.
@Toba Alu:
My belief system is as follows:
God can interfere and he chooses to interfere whenever he wills. The manner in which he interferes is not supernatural but a phenomenon verifiable through science. God is also capable to interfere supernaturally but he doesn't because then everybody will have to agree with his existence and that will beat the purpose of our existence. Humans can forget about supernatural interference of God for all practical purposes due to this reason. So in my view HIV, Black Death, natural disasters and scientific laws can be termed as those interferences of God that humans can rationalize.
About justice: Its basically upon God's will, if he wants he can ensure justice but if he doesn't want he does not have to. This choice is what makes him God. He is not bound by anything, moral values, obligations etc.
(I am a computer scientist and a man of science. My religious beliefs are driven from what I have understood after reading Quran and studying science. I believe in respecting others opinions and beliefs.)
@gp65 and @Mozart and many others.
Sorry friends, I call it quits for the time being. The moderator did not post several of my comments to you. I would like to thank all those who treated my comments with respect as I did/do respect yours. Again thank you all. As a final thought I give you just a few figures to think about.
A 2007 study found that only 8% of Egyptians, 11% of Malaysians, 14% of Pakistanis, 16% of Indonesians, and 22% of Turks agree that Darwin's theory is probably or most certainly true. Another study found that in Egypt and Pakistan, while the official high school curriculum does include evolution, many of the teachers there don’t believe in it themselves, and will often tell their students so. Saudi Arabia and Sudan have both banned the teaching of evolution in schools.
The figures for the US are: According to a 2001 Gallup poll, about 45% of Americans believe that "God created human beings pretty much in their present form at one time within the last 10,000 years or so." Another 37% believe that "human beings have developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life, but God guided this process", and 14% believe that "human beings have developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life, but God had no part in this process".
In Alabama and Mississippi – about half the people (in a poll) still believe President Obama is Muslim and about 1 in 4 believes his parents’ interracial marriage should have been illegal.
The lame is helping the blind?
@Mozart: "@gp65: What if I rephrase your first point and say that God’s Will can work through coincidence (or chance, probability) does it invalidate the system? "
I don't think so. Basically the 2 attributes that assign to God have no conflict with believing in science. In other words, if GOd left some things on autopilot to get worked out through probablity - that does not offend my belief in GOd's power to create.
A CEO in an organization has authority over any and every decision within the organization. This does not mean that the CEO necessarily actually gets involved in every decision. Some things may simply be allowed to run BAU witout CEO involvement. That does not invalidate CEO's authority. Same concept.
@elementary: "Your second point however I find difficutlt to agree with i.e “God ensures justice”.
World is so full of injustices : child born with AIDS ,dying of hunger ,innocents being killed,Might being right , and so on . To justify all this, religious people are then lead to believe into dogma that guilty will be punished later on ; re incarnation in Hinduism and Aakhrit(Judgement day ) in Islam..Having justified inequalities, injustices and excesses as God’s will such people are less willing and often opposed to fighting these evils.God does not ensure justice it is upto people on earth to do it.
"
I do not think we are disagreeing. You asked me what atributes I assigned to God whereby I could effoprtlessly beleve in science and God. IT is in reponse to that, that I mentioned the 2 attributes that I assign to God. And you are exactly right - the concept of aakhirat in Islam and rebirth in Hinduism are the concepts that allows us to reconcile the fact that GOD is just. My point is that there is nothing UNSCIENTIFIC if you belive in aakhirat or rebirth. Science has neither proved nor disprovd this. Thus the 2 attributes that I assign to God are in no way inconsistent with science.
BTW, I am impressed that you know about the concept of rebirth. In India where I gew up I had many Muslim friends/neighbours and one of my bhabhis is also a Muslim, so I am familiar with some beliefs and rituals. But it must have taken actual effort on your part to learn about the Hindu belief system.so - kudos to you.
@gp65: Got your first point. God you believe in, created this universe and it's laws but now does not interfere with it. Your second point however I find difficutlt to agree with i.e "God ensures justice".
World is so full of injustices : child born with AIDS ,dying of hunger ,innocents being killed,Might being right , and so on . To justify all this, religious people are then lead to believe into dogma that guilty will be punished later on ; re incarnation in Hinduism and Aakhrit(Judgement day ) in Islam..Having justified inequalities, injustices and excesses as God's will such people are less willing and often opposed to fighting these evils.God does not ensure justice it is upto people on earth to do it.
@gp65 @elementary Good points.
@gp65: What if I rephrase your first point and say that God's Will can work through coincidence (or chance, probability) does it invalidate the system?
@Toba Alu: God is there and he created the universe and the laws of science .He has the power to change the laws created by him. In his infinite wisdom he will do it if and when he thinks it is wise to do so, in the meantime the laws created by him hold learn to live by them.
@elementary: "Really depends on what kind of God you believe in and what attributes He has. A God which is still active and has a Will then that will being the wisest and absolute will need to be imposed; this will obviously interfere with everything including Science, rationality and politics etc."
Good point. Let me explain my belief system and why i believe that belief in science and belief in GOd are not mutually exclusive. 1. I believe God is the Creator. Thus GOD has designed the scientific laws that humans have simply discovered. Thus there is no need for God to interfere in laws thats/he created. 2. God ensures justice - not on a day to day basis but by nesuring that there are consequences for good and bad actions. How these consequences will be borne is described differently in different religion but each known religion acknowledges that there are consequences for on's actions. Westerners often use the word Karma what ite means is Actions. Bu in Hinduism, the law of karma is that you will have to pay for your actions.
Neither of these attributes conflicts with belief in science.I hope that clarifies.
@elementary
A God which is still active and has a Will then that will being the wisest and absolute will need to be imposed; this will obviously interfere with everything including Science, rationality and politics etc.
Including His messengers? Or in that department he is not so 'living'.
@gp65 "I will restate that belief in God and belief in science are not mutually exclusive"
Really depends on what kind of God you believe in and what attributes He has. A God which is still active and has a Will then that will being the wisest and absolute will need to be imposed; this will obviously interfere with everything including Science, rationality and politics etc.
You begin with a plaintive "how much we know about things and causal paths", a cry of a skeptic grounded very much in Hume's doctrine of cause-and-effect which goes something like: "When we judge that A causes B, what has in fact happened, so far as A and B are concerned, is that they have been frequently observed to be conjoined, i.e., A has been immediately, or very quickly, followed by B; we have no right to say that A must be followed by B, or will be followed by B on future occasions". The U-turn that was witnessed at Pfizer is one isolated instance which is supposed to validate this skepticism; here I think you've taken a flight of fancy, because within Biotech & Pharma, financial imperatives trump this 'cause-and-effect' fallacy, whereby studies, after being peer-reviewed, get published expeditiously, because there is an opportunity cost involved with protracted timelines...case in point, when Bayer tried to replicate the results of 67 studies that were already published in Nature Magazine, 2/3rd failed; Lack of reproducibility of studies is something structural within Big Pharma. Finally you've said that “the assertion that our Sindhi engineer has done what he has because of our national distaste for rationality, which is somehow a result of our collective sense of religiosity, doesn’t come across to me as a particularly impressive scientific method in determining causality”; which is fine, except that this assertion was never made. As a matter of fact, what was discussed at length was the widespread credulity witnessed as a response to this engineers marvel and that it was this response that ‘seemed’ to be a corollary of the society’s ‘distaste for rationality, collective sense of religiosity’ not the engineers motives. The article is more style than substance.
A nonsense article, total waste of time.
Science is a failure. Islam is the only success.
ISTE Stupid
What is the point of reading all physics books if the reader forgets the basic path?
@Toba Alu: I still don't understand. Your hypotheses look philosophical rather than scientific. Are you alluding to the paradigm of empirical verifiability?
What I don't understand is how my belief in religion restricts me from believing in the law of thermodynamics? Or for that matter in Higgs Boson?
I guess everytime Ejaz just writes an article with singular motive......get more comments, even if it means hate comments to himself.
@Sadia: My appologies for not writin his name correctly
@Toba Alu: Thank you for your detailed explanation. While I personally do have faith in GOd, I can definitely respect your opinion if you do not believe. I do not think GOd is a politician who neds our votes. If we believe, it is for our own sake and if we do not there is no harm done either. I have no desire to push my belief system on to you. However, I will restate that belief in God and belief in science are not mutually exclusive. I continue to have that opinion. As you must know converse is not necessarily true. In other words, it is not necessary that you believe in God in order to believe in science - neither is it necessary that you believe in science in order to believe in God.
Secondly while great acts of horrors can be committed by people who believe in organized religion, this can also be done by atheists e.g. Mao Tse Tung, Stalin etc.
And what exactly has veena maliks dressing to do with this article or with anything for that matter? You lost all your points in the first sentence only.
This article did not make sense. However I am waiting for the next one where you will propose how the Taliban and the Deep State take advantage of the Water Car and rout the Americans in Afghanistan.
@Mozart:
Sure I can. Maybe you could not fully understand what I meant as I had to write in vague terms, the clear terms were not accepted by the moderators.
First hypothesis: aspirin works in curing a headache. Second hypothesis is God exists (or we need a lawgiver to explain the universe).
Try to use the set of rules we are using to verify the first statement on the second statement.
Good luck.
@ gp65
I appreciate your reaction, but unfortunately I cannot be more specific. My comments have several times not been posted. I would love to comment and discuss with you your statement "That it is this power that designed all the natural laws which humans through scientific research discover." Is it not fair to ask you what the evidence is why we need a "lawgiver" = "this power" that designed all these laws. Modern science has moved on since Einstein and there is a lot of evidence that we do not need a lawgiver to explain the universe. You may of course, if you wish/believe, to let everything start with a lawgiver (without any evidence) but it is not essential to understand the universe and the origin of life. But I do not accept that using the concept of a lawgiver that the earth is only 10,000 years old. Many are using such a principle to deny evolution (and a lot more). The story is endless. Many are using one scripture or another to commit the most heinous crimes. The moment you define something as holy in whatever sense, there will be plenty of lunatics justifying their heinous acts, claiming that this is/was God's will. You cannot make however any logical link between atheism/agnosticism and heinous crimes in case they commit them. Just use one set of rules to verify hypotheses (mine or yours).
@It Is Economy Stupid: it is Prof. Salam, not Sattar. Sad that even the name of our only nolel laureate is not common knowledge because he was an ahmadi.
Deeply dissaponted in Mr. Haider of whom till now I held very high opinons. Misses he basic point. There is no comparision between a scientific experiment that went wrong and an outright attempt at fraud as with the 'Water Kit' for cars.
@psychedelic: He means, What if it is proven to be a fraud, don't jump to blame the reaction of people and media and father of bomb and minister of religious affairs and TV and internet jihadis on religious brainwashing of Pakistani society, because such things happen in non-Islamic countries too. There could be some other psychological, sociological cause behind it. The beghairat non-believers, the eternal fuel of hellfire, can discuss possibility of any sublime to the ridiculous theory to explain unprecedented response among Pakistanis, except religion, because it hurts his tender Islamic and patriotic feelings.
@kaalchakra: A Pakistani Muslim scientist did something original and world recognized him with a Noble Prize, highest honor a scientist can dream of. I am sure they did not teach you that in school. It is still not that late look him up online.
Great article. To the commenters: the response to the kit was as much driven by religion as accepting of corruption is based on religion or the habit of Pakistanis to slack off is based on religion. It's not like we are doing everything else right - we defend the indefensable, both our religious and 'liberal' crowds. To the commentor who dismissed the pfyzer claim as 'corporate greed', you should learn to draw linkages perhaps? Or perhaps you haven't needed the life-saving drugs - although I am pretty certain that someone close to you is alive today because of the very drugs that you criticize.
@Umer: That is a great stock tip
Laws of thermodynamics govern almost everything in observable universe; from behavior of planetary objects to chemical foundation of life. A failed research in Pfizer is in no way comparable to Agha Waqar's water kit. Therefore, either this kit is true or life cannot exist. Both cannot be true at the same time
I personally was saddened by the endorsements given to that kit by so called scientific bodies of Pakistan.
I checked the meaning of 'Thermostasis' on dictionary.com. They are yet to find out any meaning out of this word. :-)
@Toba Alu: "Please look up Einstein’s belief system. He can honestly not be called deeply religious. " I never indicated that Einstein was deeply religious, simply that he (and Maxwell) had deep faith in God. These were simply examples to support my earlier statement that belief in Science and belief in God are not mutually exclusive.
"Secondly, I commented on your statement “Believing in science and believing in God are not mutually exclusive states.” I argue that this only true if you use two different set of rules to test two different sets of hypotheses."
Belief in God does not imply belief in organized religion but rather faith that there is a superior power greater than humans. That it is this power that designed all the natural laws which humans through scientific research discover. In this scheme of things I am not sure you need to " use two different sets of rules to test two different hypotheses", as you indicated.
@Toba Alu: Can you quote any hypothesis where we will have to apply two different sets of rules?
Why have you taken upon yourselves to respond to an article written by someone accused of being secular/liberal. The two articles that appeared in this paper were the most read and the most commented-upon articles. The underlying cause was that people are extremely cautious and sensitive to know the truth. This water car though, the people saw with their own eyes plying on the roads and being driven by superstars, were still too good to be true. Had it not been for the scientists to have exposed this fraud, he would have made off with millions. A fraud was timely exposed so what is the fuss about. And by the way where religion has come in this equation? One fact though, that is staring us straight in the eyes is that the more obsessive religious orientation is turning out to be a hackle in every aspect of life. We need to find a delicate balance.
What the heck......he said he can get a car moving on water...he did it - period. Let the real scientists bother about the gain/loss/cost of energy etc etc. A small town guy got his imagination running and experimented with success on his own terms. Please say bravo to him so that others are encouraged and who know's someday somebody may do it. Science is full of surprises...........Well done brother....good wishes from India.
@gp65
I posted an extensive comment but it was again moderated away. I fully agree with your post except the last paragraph. Please look up Einstein's belief system. He can honestly not be called deeply religious. Secondly, I commented on your statement "Believing in science and believing in God are not mutually exclusive states." I argue that this only true if you use two different set of rules to test two different sets of hypotheses. I am not allowed to go in any further scientific details, sorry.
@psychedelic: neither did the author he was just making sure the pay checks keep coming in.
People have already pointed how the whole episode here in Pakistan was extra-special. The media frenzy, our "top" scientists revealing that they don't know basic science (they need to be fired), cabinet meetings, statements from the Ministry of Religious Affairs! All this can only happen in Pakistan I'm sure.
So how do we explain all this? Maybe its just that we are so desperate for something good to happen, we'll believe anything. If its good, it must be true. (And equally, if it is something that makes us look bad, it must be lies and conspiracies).
Mr Haider is clever! He deliberately dragged Veena into this because he knew the 'liberals' would not take too kindly to this defense of Agha Waqar, if it can be called that. 'Liberals' love Veena, the 'anti-liberals' love Agha Waqar. Very clever, Mr Haider, very clever! Very "centrist" and "realist" indeed!
@moderator: where is my first comment on this article ?
@white russian: My second comment (the only one mentioned above) is the summary of the article for Raz, not my view.
My view: Law of thermodynamics are not based on assumption as thought by author so we cannot say it supposedly immutable.
Waffle waffle waffel at its best !!!!
@Usman Shahid: Laws of thermodynamics are not supposedly immutable. These ARE immutable, and nothing to this day had been found to violate this. Ig Agha Waqar or Mr Haider have observed otherwise, they should share with scientific community in reproducible manner.
It is not correct to put these laws in same catrgory with conclusions drawn from random clinical data through statistical interpolation. One reason I distaste journalists is that they pretend to know everything under the sun despite having no known specialisation in anything under the sun.
greek.
Could someone give this guy a prize for flaunting his knowledge. He writes for himself.
@kaalchakra:
Invest in Agha Waqar's water car. Put your money where your mouth is.
There is no controversy! What if someone tells you one day that 1 + 1 = 3? Water Car claim is basically 1 + 1 = 3 in terms of physics.
I didn't know that physics has a religion. Stop projecting the idea that this travesty is only being opposed by the left-wingers.
@Ali tanoli: End of the day AQ Khan stole the design of centrifuge and brought to Pakistan. issue in the article is about scientific misconduct and he is guilty of that apart from proliferation. Why not accept the fact this was not his original scientific idea. The real hero of Pakistan is Dr Sattar who contributed to God Particle. Ejaz never pointed to a success story because Sattar was an Ahmadi. His name should be on dozens of school, scholarships and library.
Despite all the bashing that Agha Waqar has received, I must congratulate the man for sparking a debate and involving the nation in an intellectual exchange, for alerting media men from their slumber to be more responsible and for exposing renowned scientists for their unscientific attitudes. I hope this leads to honest reflection on everyones part.
Just coincidentially, news came that Martin Fleischmann died at 85. He made sensation in 1989 by claiming to have accomplished cold fusion in an electrochemical cell. The process of reproducing his results swiftly followed which eventually lead to discreditment of Fleischmann and ruining of his career.
Mr Haider, the accomplished creator of cold confusion, is right to claim that bad scientific practices also make a good part of our life. But then, same is true of procedures to debunk frauds. I still cannot understand what upsets Mr Haider most: fraud or debunking it?
@Riz: What i have got from this highly ambiguous article
Scientists take scientific laws as religion Laws of thermodynamics are supposedly immutable Their approach towards waterkit is without testing and case-closed type In medicines a recent case have proved that assumptions (or laws according to author) can be wrongBeautiful. I was waiting for someone to write this. Thanks.
Dear Agha Waqar, don't loose your courage from these silly articles.Entire world knows when Galileo put his theory before Church, the Church turned against him due to their arrogance. and when Right brothers went to make airplane people laughed them. they were called fool. and now when you discovered new way towards fill the energy gap. people are once again laughing at you. Remember that one day people opposite to you will sage towards you. so don;t loose your courage, go ahead, kep it up. our prayers are with you. My Allah bless you. May you Succeed.Entire talented people of the world with you.
Can somebody please translate the article into English? Thanks!
nice try to make ignorant people believe that the water kit might work. but like the water kit your logic doesn't work either.
@American Desi, what u or your kind peoples did for pakistan just explain to us but getting all the luxeries of pakistan free think about it man if this one man A q khan was not came back to the country that time and help build its defences then may be your kind and army right now was in worst than 1971 zalalath.
Did you not get the memo about Jonah Leherer? He too is an Agha Waqar, albeit the extremely upmarket variety. http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevedenning/2012/08/07/whose-words-are-these-anyway-the-sad-case-of-jonah-lehrer/
I could understand 'rampant religiosity' in this article.. Nothing more than that..
Dear Ejaz saab: "Stupidity and fraudulent behaviour remain as much a property of the secular world as they were, and remain, of the religious one."
If a person is not religious he can be either an agnostic or atheist. Secular IS NOT the opposite of religious. The term 'secular' is completely misunderstood in Pakistan and you have added to this. A secular state is simply one which will not distinguish between its citizens on the basis of their religion. Both India and USA are secular states but that does not mean people living within these countries do not have deep religious beliefs. Frauds can exist in any country. But how many countries does the Scientific Council endorse such frauds without carrying any experiments? How many places are people who are considered as heroes of science (like A Q Khan is in Pakistan) also endorse such fraud? In how many countries does the cabinet hold 4 meetings based on a media report without having any proof whatsoever? It is not the presence of fraud but the society's reaction to fraud where Pakistan is somewhat unique. Believing in science and believing in God are not mutually exclusive states. Albert Einstein and Maxwell, arguably 2 of the most renowned scientists in the last 100 years had deep faith in God.I don't exactly agree with you conclusion. The comparison you drew between experiments done by Pfizer can't be compared with Aghar Waqar. Pfizer took scientifically rational approach in finding the solution to the problem.. if things didn't work it doesn't mean it was a wastage.. atleast they know there is a flaw in this approach and would make amendments to fix it.
I party agree with you that scientific community is not blemish free but nowhere in the world people are made hero for the kind of research Agha Waqar did.. I would have given him some points if he had some thing complicated and misjudged some parameters. But what he did was gross violation of basic laws of science and that is what surprising scientific community which I happen to be part of.
I believe atleast science should be kept away from religion lens. Let the people be rational, logical and creative. Religion (sometimes) put a bound by not allowing to ask questions. That's precisely the problem scientists have with religion.
For one thing, you can't compare studies of the human body and physics. You can obsessively and thoroughly test physics, beating uncertainties to the ground. If you did that with the human body it would require using people as test subjects. Torturing both mentally and physically, killing, deforming... Basically, you would have to make something like the holocaust pale in comparison and that's an understatement to narrow things down that far like you can with physics. The other, nobody has said religion was backing most of the situation. They said it has simply led to irrational evaluation and making fools of yourselves internationally due to how extreme the reaction was such as saying for sure it works and calling him a hero when reasons for not doing so are plenty and easy to access. They say religion is the reason that you ignored that other information, resulting in humiliation, when it could have, and should have been either ignored or dis-proven almost on the spot if you were evaluating it from a logical perspective instead of a "we're so special and devoted that God gives us super powers to manipulate the world in ways no others can" perspective.
These 'scientists' protesting so loudly are running scared for their lives. They know full well that one day Islam will prove all their theories wrong. So whenever any Muslim achieves something that appears 'miraculous' to them they hear the sound of an approaching train which will crush them out of its way.
Ejaaz bhai you are at it again - going out on a limb to defend indefensible just because the secular or liberals oppose it. Only you can bring religion and religiosity to this fraud.
What was is the issue here is not whether there are fraud and misconduct is other countries, as it is there every where, but the proportion and magnitude. I don't see any country's cabinet discussing such ridiculous kit or main stream media going gaga over such obvious fraud case. If we are mistaken please google it and enlighten us.
Agha Waqar might be challenging laws of thermodynamics but you are challenging laws of proportionality, which is equally ludicrous.
Confusing and waste of time.
The example of Pfizer is not the appropriate one. The level of understanding we have about the human body is miniscule when comapred with the certainity of laws in the domain of Physics and chemistry.
The frontiers of science that are still being explored are in the astronomical scale at the star, black hole, dark matter level or in the subatomic particle scale. Most of the stuff in-between has been mastered.
All the car guy has to do is prove that he has indeed invented a process where he can generate more than three times the volume of Hydrogen using a unit of energy than what is being done today. It could either be by electrolysis or by any other means. That is it.
Please note that I do not discount his capabilities.
So to paraphrase Ejaz, too much religiosity did not cause Agha Waqar to make fraudulent claim about WaterKit. Maybe it was Djinns.
Or perhaps, WaterKit is the last refuge of patriots?
True that charlatans exist all over the world. But only in Pakistan such people are honored! Think about endorsers of this small time fraudsters, AQ Khan and his ilk, who are really the biggest Frauds perpetuated on hapless people of Pakistan.
I have no idea what this article meant.
Very well written article sir.
What absolute tosh! How can one compare greedy pharmaceutical companies with something akin to a sudden state of national hysteria - well as far as the media, the government and some other notables are concerned.
One relates to corporate greed and the other to a national state of ignorance caused by an abysmal standard of education (which remains permeated with historical falsehoods and an infantile sense of grandeur).
ijaaz, you have a very bad habit of jumping unnecessarily into things, on which decisions and discussions have already become stale.....earlier you did the same on AATISH TASEER article, then on beghairat article of PERVEZ HOODBHOY, and now into it..
also your abstruse analysis above, is simply mind-boggling, and an attempt to score some points, and show your scholarship.
plz. refrain from it.