NEW DELHI:
Having already captured the imagination of many in Pakistan, Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar arrived in New Delhi on Tuesday to a warm welcome, and on the back of a slew of confidence-building measures. However, her meeting with nationalist leaders from Indian Kashmir almost immediately after arriving, hit a few nerves – and put the enormity of today’s talks, and the waning Kashmir issue, back onto the centre stage.
Khar’s meetings with veteran Kashmiri leader Syed Ali Shah Geelani and then Mirwaiz Omar Farooq on Tuesday evening sent out a clear symbolic message about Pakistan’s continuing support for a cause that has suffered a setback in the wake of the arrest of US national Dr Ghulam Nabi Fai, a Kashmir lobbyist booked last week in Washington for not disclosing the sources of his funding.
“We discussed a wide range of issues and pressed for making Kashmir a core issue during any negotiations between India and Pakistan,” Geelani told reporters following the meeting.
He said that it was conveyed to Islamabad that no solution will be accepted by the people of Jammu and Kashmir even though both India and Pakistan might agree to it. “Jammu and Kashmir is not a border dispute between India and Pakistan and as such it’s for the people of Jammu and Kashmir to decide their fate,” he said.
Spokesperson of the Geelani-led All-Parties Hurriyet Conference (APHC) faction Ayaz Akbar said that the party also pressed Islamabad to use diplomatic channels to secure the release of Kashmir lobbyist Dr Fai.
Members from the other APHC faction, led by Mirwaiz Omar Farooq, who had come from Srinagar, also met Khar at the Pakistan High Commission in New Delhi. Khar assured the delegation that Pakistan sought a resolution of the Kashmir issue in accordance with the aspirations of the Kashmiri people.
Khar’s consulting of the Kashmiri leadership prior to her talks with her Indian counterpart SM Krishna on Wednesday (today) were not well-received by many in India. They felt that Khar’s meetings on Indian soil with groups avowedly against the unity and integrity of India was disrespectful and against the spirit in which the India-Pakistan ‘reengagement’ had started after a long hiatus following the 2008 Mumbai attacks.
However, advocates of India-Pakistan friendship such as MP Ram Jethmalani and retired foreign service officer MK Bhadrakumar urged a more relaxed view of the meetings, saying it was not the meeting that was important but the outcome.
“I have not had the pleasure of meeting Khar. But I think we have to take the meetings (with Kashmiri leaders) in the context of her statement when she arrived,” Jethmalani said, referring to Khar’s statement that both countries understand their responsibilities towards and within the region.
Rao-Bashir meetings
As Khar met the Kashmiri leaders, foreign secretaries Nirupama Rao and Salman Bashir finalised a slew of confidence-building measures designed to expand intra-Kashmir travel and trade apart from holding discussions on terror, including progress in 26/11 attacks probe.
India handed over to the Pakistani delegation the revised list of ‘most wanted’ fugitives which contains 48 names. Interior Minister Rehman Malik, however, said that according to the Evidence Law governing Pakistan, it will not be possible to take voice samples of those India charges as being conspirators in the Mumbai attack.
At this Indian Home Minister P Chidambaram pointed out that there was no difference between the Indian and Pakistani Evidence Act and suggested to Malik that there were several ways of taking voice samples without influencing the trial.
But Indian home ministry sources said that Malik was adamant that it could be a violation of Pakistan’s constitution.
He said that the Pakistani government had appealed to the high court for permission to take these samples. “The moment the court permits us, we will definitely send (the voice samples to India). If the high court rejects it, we will go to the Supreme Court. We will exhaust every possible stage. We are doing (it) transparently and you can examine the law,” he said, adding that the delays were not because of Pakistan but because the incident had happened in another country.
Today’s talks
The issue of the Mumbai trial notwithstanding, there are high hopes from the foreign ministers’ meeting tomorrow.
Pakistan is the only South Asian country with which India does not have a Most Favoured Nation (MFN) status. While MFN status is a mere courtesy between nations, Islamabad had earlier linked it with a resolution of the Kashmir issue. The other issue is the 1,938 items on Pakistan’s “positive list”, again the only country in South Asia which has instituted such a list for India. This means that Pakistan will import only those items on the list and nothing else. Of these, only a hundred-odd items are allowed to be exported via Wagah.
In addition to her official meeting with Krishna on Wednesday, Khar will meet Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh, Congress President Sonia Gandhi, Bharatiya Janata Party leader LK Advani as well as opposition leader in Indian lower house of Parliament Sushma Swaraj. Khar will leave India on July 28.
Meanwhile, before leaving for New Delhi, a confident Khar told reporters at the Lahore airport that she believed that India and Pakistan are reasonable nations and the dialogue process will not only favour the people of the two countries but also the entire region.
“Time is not stagnant; every opportunity is a new opportunity and every challenge is a new challenge.” (With additional reporting by Abdul Manan in Lahore)
Published in The Express Tribune, July 27th, 2011.
COMMENTS (64)
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@Anuj Mehta: As U say Pakistan cannot do anything Regarding Kashmir? My question to U, than why India is negociating and accepting the Kashmir as the core Problem between India and Pakistan??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
@BruteForce: Frank has already had similar lecture with valid points from me !! Unfortunately, his mindset has been messed up with education provided in Pakistan, hence don't expect too much from our brethren from across the border !! Its really wasted on them! As all they know is "Kashmir is theirs"" however i bet none of them have ever been there or have any interactions with Kashmiris !!!
Hina baby You are as my daghter if i have in power some give you gift not for you for ever pakistani. Becouse Indian and Pakistani real Brother .all brothers querls but do not break relation.Pakistan is Indians small brother .If he not acepted india Is Big Brither But You are our daghter.
@Frank,
India is a Democracy and by definition the people are supreme. That would mean Kashmiris are their own masters. 80% of Kashmir voted for the Panchayat elections recently. 80%!!!
If the Kashmiris have anything to say they will talk through the ballot, not the bullet. Now, on what basis are you making these fantastic claims that Kashmiris dont have a choice?
Ms Khar, you may shout Kashmir in public. No problem. But don’t raise issue in bilateral negotiations as Pakistan has no locus standi on this issue. You and Mr. Bashir have rightly done so. Thanks.
@xohaib: It does not even take a penny to make it disputed. People have claimed lands which are hundreds of years old. Our shared history is less than seventy. So don't count on it.
The Pakistani FM should have the liberty to meet any one including the separatist leaders. . However if they where sincere about the problem of Kashmiri people then she should have also met the elected Representative of Jammu & Kashimir. . Her meeting only with the separatist leaders indicates that Pakistan is interested in its own agenda and not interested in understanding or solving the real problem of Kashimiri people. . No wonder Indian leadership is happy.
Ms. Hina meeting the separatists leaders is in line with the Pakistani foreign policy of saying one thing and doing the contrary. It has come handy to India for whom talks with the Pakistani or the separatists is just an eye wash to appease international opinion. It has served every ones pretensions. The common people in Kashmir are having a hey time with tourists influx as terrorism is down because of Pakistan's preoccupations with US. Happy time in India Ms. Hina.
Guys, Baluchistan is an integral part of Pakistan while Kashmir is disputed territory. Whether you stole it ten years ago or ten thousand, stolen it remains. I have my doubts about Hina Khar but she has done the right thing by taking Kashmiri freedom fighters into her confidence first. There can be no peace without the approval of the Kashmiris and until India honours its commitments in Kashmir. Otherwise these are just much-needed photo ops for Pakistan and nothing more.
@xohaib: I agree that UN resolution should be followed. But there is a BIG BUT here. UN resolution was suggestion and not mandate on India and Pakistan. And one f the main clause of this resolution that until the issue is resolve neither India or Pakistan will change the demography of Kashmir. Something which India has done so far, no Indians who are not born in Kashmir is allowed to buy a property or settle in Kashmir. While in Pakistan Kashmir there is a huge settlement of Punjabis and Sindhis. The elected government and leaders in Indian Kashmir is Kashmiri while the recent elected leader in Pakistan Kashmir is not a Kashmiri, he is a Chudhary. To add the complexity you gifted a part of your Kashmir to China. Will you get that part back ? Will all the pundits who were forced out of territory and their possible population in past 65 yrs be accounted ? It was my pathetic government which does not bring forth the plight of displaced pundits, but it was their land too in all equality and they have a say too. You might find my argument as pro Indian, but please focus on just the points I mentioned irrespective of what my nationality is. Kashmir would not have been an issue if Jinnah did not had ordered to march to Kashmir and to capture it. Today Kashmiri "might" have been free country and there might have been better relations between India and Pakistan. But this one strategic mistake and both f countries are doomed to this enmity and Kashmiris suffered the most in our fight.
I am amaze to see foreign minister of a country which is in a debt of over 50 billion dollars carrying a HERMES bag I guess ladies knows how much does this bag costs,I am sure over 5 lakh rupees.
I wish her all the success
@No: as well Pakistan should give independence to Baluchistan as they are demanding to it. and leave the people of sindh province for their own rule and leave the tribes of SWAT region for their tribal rule as they historically disliked any other rulers. the name itself indicates you know nothing , in between do you really know what Arunachal means. in what time it was a part of china.
what a picture. just recalling the days when we use to own "two nation theory"
@No:
People of Afghanistan has right to form their own government so, why don't Pakistan just butt out of Afghanistan?
@xohaib:
Where is this UN resolution? Show me?
I bet you can't.
@Vicram Singh: nice work mate .. now go claim SRI-lanka as well
I think it was important to meet Huriyat leaders ...however that could have been done after meeting the Indian FM. Anyways, what else can you expect from a Foreign Minister who has negligible experience on International Relations ?
@slick When has ET become a Pak newspaper. On so many occasions, Paki has been damning ET to be an American voice.
Excellent news! Now SM Krishna can meet with the Marri and Bugti clan leaders when he visits Pakistan. Heck, maybe the TTP beards can try and squeeze in a quick meeting with him. .. Good work Ms. Khar!
I wonder if there are so many Pakistanis commenting on an Indian newspaper too!!
I personally feel these pre-meetings were a deliberate mis-calculation.
A time has come for people of both countries to live in peace and improve their quality of life through investments in social sectors.
Jammu & Kashmir has many voices, Both Pakistan and India like to hear the voice which suits them best. I guess the Indians had no objection for the FM to meet the separatist leaders, but it would have been diplomatically correct, if she had met them after meeting her Indian counterparts.
Why are the Pakistanis, not wondering why there was 80% turnout in the recent elections, in spite of the separatists warning to the people to boycott the polls. The convenient answer would by them would be that it was about Governance not about Independence, but still the point to be remembered is that separatists had given a call to boycott the elections, and the masses voted in spite of the violent threats.
WoW ... i am little surprised that the Zardari mindset is playing another game here.Making sensational headlines by telling her to meet those so-called seperatists, we all have see the havoc they have wrekaed in palestine but still would continue to support them bliondly at any cost (and we have started paying the huge cost here in pakistan by the way).
I am muslim and I am Pakistani and make no mistake, people here are sick and tired of this political mockery. Let us live in peace and start thinking about people who represent this land of pure. Afterwards you can go and help buy freedom for other people / nations.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zwHHun95_A
India acceptance for a meeting between Ms.Khar and separatist leader proves certain point.
1>India is a true democracy and still gives freedom of speach,to hoist meeting at any part of India.
2>India's stand on Kasmir and POK including GB .
3>India's no care attitude for anyone on this issue.
.Pakistani leaders should get this other-side message also and schedule their future meeting accordingly.
What was the purpose of FM Hina Khar in meeting the Kashmiri leaders?
How would we feel if Indian FM on a visit to Pakistan was to meet with the
Baloch separatist leaders?
Some of these "separatists" were under house arrestt but let out by the Govt. for their meeting.This was to show that India is not afarid of anything Pak tries to hatch.
@Kailash "why is this lady being allowed to meet these separatists?"
As if you are naive that you dont know Why Ms.Hina Khar was allowed to meet APHC Leaders.Reason being. 1.To allow them to collect their salary. 2.at present India is ruled by an Italian and a Pakistani combo. :)
Let her do whatever she want it doesn't matter. So result of Indop-pak meet- 1] Schedule for future meetings 2] Visa concession 3] Increase in people to people contact 4] opening another trade route from another place from India and pakistan 5] opening another trade route from pak kashmir to Indian kashmir. 6] Formation of Indopak forums 7] cultural and business exchange activity. 8] Solving water problem as per indus water treaty 9] Reducing trust deficit 10] knowledge sharing in terrorist activity. 11] Solving all problems include kashmir, siachen etc through dialog process. I don't think the result will be different as I said here. So get ready for next year talk. Cheers!!
@No: Thanks for your great comment, we will rightly set up a commission to work on the suggestion
Good gesture towards Kashmiri separatists Ms. Khar …??? You are capable of satisfying ego of crowd back at home … !!! The rant has no place in diplomacy. Whatever you blubber, Pakistan has to succumb and accept India’s demand of CBMs and terrorism issues initially for benefit of both nations. The reality will be stark for ranting crowd back at home. Well done India in providing solace to Kashmiri on both sides.
@ kailash balochistan is not a disputed territory , Kashmir is disputed and according to the UN resolution ,this must be solved according to wishes of kashmiri people. You guys also agreed with this and then ran away from the commitments. whats wrong if we both leave kashmir and make them an independent state.
@Anuj Mehta: But it is a fact that Pakistan is not weak, Pakistan support Kashmir and it shows on Indian soil also. Becoming furious on this issue is useless and just neglecting the a fact (Navishta-eDiwar) that not only Kashmir, Pakistan who can perhaps break whole India into pieces. A heart breaking comment but think just IM (Ind Mujahidin & many other also) how they are embedded in whole India, active and frustrated with Indians attitude towards Muslims. There is no neutron to keep together electron & Proton hence Fission is ultimate.
India is growing at 10%, is the fastest growing economy in the World, is bringing out more people out of poverty faster than any nation in the whole wide world(Kashmiris included), is a Democracy, Freedom, Respect from the other big powers, 4th largest economy in the World in PPP terms.
This meeting of HIna with people who she considers as leaders have never contested an election and not proven their worth or their popularity. Even Bal Thakarey can claim himself as a Marathi leader, but he can never win an election, which is the true barometer of popularity.
The reason of my writing the first paragraph is to show how immaterial the issue of Kashmir is when it comes to its growth and its overall trajectory. Can you say the same thing about Pakistan, World's 12th most failed state and has the lowest GDP growth rate in South Asia? Pakistan is also a Country which has no Democracy, constantly interrupted by the Military, which gains strength from its Kashmiri obsession.
The mirage of Kashmir has ruined an entire country.
Sometimes, one feels, all secular nations should come together on a platform and stop dealing with religious nations.
Anyone who thinks "kashmir issue" can be solved without addressing the partition itself is living in fool's paradise. No special favours for a people of particular ethencity. Period.
Freedom is the right of Kashmiri people. India should respect their demand for freedom. India should also give freedom to the North Eastern Indian states. Asam and Arunachal should be handed over to China as they are a part of China; historically and culturally.
Sooner or later Kashmir will be free; with or without Pakistani help.
So we will not get voice samples.. Mani Shankar of Aiyars of india please take note.. let us see where this new mantra that dialogue should be uninterrupted and uniterruptible (while we train militants make guys like hafiz saeed our most honoured guest) leads us.
Moving on.. no one is against peace but Pakistan's external affairs minister comes and meets the seperatist thugs. That in itself is a reflection of new pakistan's minister and mindset. These seperatist thugs are the same people who who at the height of militancy supported terrorists sent by Pakistan and they have the gall to champion the cause of kashmir. They just fuel the fire of miniscule few who shout for kashmir not becuase of any injustice but because of religion.
@dr afzal khan: I agree completeley. We must give freedom to the people of Azad Kashmir and Balochistan and then India will have to follow suit.
Nanavaty,
there is a big difference between Baluchi separists and Kashmiri leader, no offence but Kashmir is a disputed territory and meeting the leader of a disputed territory is very different to meeting a insurgent leader.
Meeting the Kashmiri leadership is a good step by the President appointed FM. They're opinions are the most important.
pundits, which ran way at the insistence of an installed governor of occupied Kashmir, won't be in the conversation relating to Kashmir as we the pundits are a miniscule (less than 3 percent) part of the Kashmiri population. A vast minority cannot hold the democratic rights of Kashmiris hostage for a foreign country. Pundits need to start being Kashmiris.
Meanwhile, as an indian, i will recommend myself, refresh, and recommend again because that is what we hindutva internet warriors do.
Nice editorializing of reportage. No one in Pak really cares if indian feathers were ruffled. Hina did a good job setting the dialogue in line with Pak interests. It is apparent that the indians are obsessed with her every movement as evidenced by their reportage on her very step and jaw movement. On the issue of Kashmir, it is the people of indian occupied Kashmir that will be the center of a resolution in accordance to their democratic rights. Khar is to be complimented to meet the legitimate and recognized Kashmiri leadership as seen by the Kashmiris. They are to be at the forefront in anything relating to Kashmir. The so-called territorial disputes between Pak and india and its subsequent genocide of Kashmiris by the indians are a distraction from the real issue of Kashmiris having a say in their political, economic, security, and cultural future. CBMs along the LOC are a must so the Kashmiris can better get on with their lives while the final resolution is realized.
What is disheartening is the same old tired line from the new delhi regime. Actually, really pathetic. The south block establishment must change their confrontational approach if relations are to change between the two countries.
@Anuj Mehta: if they (as said by your policticians) can do so much in Mumbai. y not in Kashmir or any other part of ur country? which city are u from btw!
Does Pakistan really want good relations with India? If that's the case, meeting with Kashmiri seperatists before any official meeting is clearly very disrespectful for Khar. At the time of Indian partition, Kashmir held enormous strategic importance for both countries, but in the age of Nuclear deterrence, it doesn't and shouldn't matter as much.
Fixation with Kashmir has caused nothing but economic drain and radicalization of Pakistani socienty--it's time to let go and work on creating economic opportunities for people.
The Kashmiri people are being slaughtered by the Indian armed forces. There are outstanding UNSC resolutions on Kashmir that need to be abided by.
It would have far better had Ms. Khar met with Kashmiri leaders after her meetings with her Indian counterpart. This is a diplomatic faux pas. Mr. Saman Bashir, the experienced Foreign Secretary should have seen to it that talks with India go smoothly and result in a positive outcome. Instead, the Indian media is having a field day about her meeting with Kashmiri leaders.
If both India and Pakistan wish to achieve real peace, a new thinking is needed on both sides.
I just do not understand why India gives any legitimacy to these leaders and allows them the full freedom of expression, speech and organizing political activities against India. India has lot to learn from Pakistan, China and rest of the world about handling these elements.
Shows how far Indian democracy has progressed...would the Indian FM be able to meet Baluchi separists in Pakistan ???
@Anuj Mehta: may b we should see this point without considerin our nationalites.. among those direct and indirect wars kamiris r the real ones who have suffered.. n in my opinion the wole population of the subcontinet is been a hostage of kashmir for the past 63 years.. we should let kashmiris decide there own fate.. we should consider humanity above nationality.. stay blessesd.. :)
Pak Foreign Minister should have also met Kashmiri Pundits as they have also right to decide the future of Kashmir valley.
I wish us Pakistanis would give up this Kashmir issue. How many lives must our country lose and how many terrorists must we create before we give up? The Kashmiri people have taken two gigantic countries for a ride. Let's build a wall around Kashmir - both parts, and leave these ungrateful people to themselves. Let's see how they feel about having China as their "big brother".
Self Determination is a very Big Word here !!! There is a Message their for Pakistan !!! Nothing special, it did not get the Media exposure in India, as it has in Pakistan !! Shows, who classes this issue as important at present!!!
Freedom for Kashmiris..!!! God Bless Ali Gillani for loving Pakistan even after what Musharraf did to Hurriyat conference.
She did not meet Kashmit leaders. She simply met Kashmiri separatist leaders. J&K has an elected chief minister. A few months back it had pnahcayat (logal gvernent ) elections and there was a 80% turnout in J&K. All the elected representatives are als J&K leaders. Yet Hina did not meet them. This kind of behavior proves that the foreign policy continues to be owned by military and the Pak peace eforts are not sincere.
At this point such lack of sincerity does not impact India as much as Pakistan who has already opened 5 separate fronts against terrorists on its Wesern borders.
all these issues are so lame for India that we let this meeting go unnoticed.....Pakistani FM meeting our separatist in India and assuring them freedom...so funny......Pakistan can not do anything about Kashmir.....