Uneasy neighbours: Pakistani experts to discuss water dispute in India
“We are hopeful that India will show some flexibility on [Pakistan’s] reservations over the building of new dams in India,” Baig told reporters at Wagah border before crossing into India. During the five-day trip, the delegation will also visit four controversial sites on the Chenab River where New Delhi is planning to construct new dams. Reiterating that Pakistan’s objections over the design of Kishanganga dam were logical, Baig said that some serious doubts pertaining to the controversial project – particularly regarding the Neelum distributary point – and other dams on the Chenab River have already been allayed.
Experts, however, believe there is little or no hope of a breakthrough in talks as India is unwilling to entertain any Pakistani demands. Islamabad would have to move the International Court of Justice (ICJ) to settle the dispute, they say. Baig said that his delegation would try their best to resolve all issues during their stay in India. But at the same time, he admitted that Islamabad would have no choice but to approach the ICJ if New Delhi did not entertain their ‘fair’ demands.
Last week, a 10-member delegation from India visited Pakistan to discuss the thorny water issues between the two nations. The talks, however, failed to make any headway as the Indian side refused to accept Pakistan’s demand for changing the design of Kishanganga dam.
Published in The Express Tribune, September 21st, 2014.
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Does Pakistan not have enough water? If you want to conserve water build your own dams ! Don't blame other nations for your own ineptitude.
" Islamabad would have no choice but to approach the ICJ if New Delhi did not entertain their ‘fair’ demands." +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Only a fool discloses his strategy!
India may not sell Electricity to Pakistan... ++++++++++++.+++++++++++++++++ But with its rate of population growth in Pakistan .....it will soon be begging India for Water
@Imtiaz ahmad: Indians. If you think Punjab and northern India where bunch of Turks and Afghans ruled was All of India then you are mistaken. Pakistan had no role in that. Your forefathers were just forcefully converted to Islam and were ruled by these outsiders because they failed to offer any resistance. Those who resisted are still following same old religion. So don't gloat on this fake sense of ummah. Your ummah despises you and is busy killing each other world over.
We should show compassion toward the pakistanis and not take out any jaan from the water. Since we take out all the bijli from the water that flows to pakistan, how can pakistan build dams to generate bijli? The pakistani water has no bijli because of chanakya hindus we sends bijli-less water..
What a ungrateful country ? It's time to put an end to these agreements and divert the rivers to Indian main land .
How shamefully Pakistani corrupt politicians have made the dams' construction's issue the matter of life and death for themselves and criticize India for not releasing the water.First construct dams in Pakistan so that flood water could be saved and used for cheap and low-priced electricity's generation and irrigation then criticize India that India is forcibly occupied on Pakistani water's share......
@Sunil: and who were ruling upon India?
If Pakistan keeps crying 'wolf' every time about India stealing 'it's water', maybe there will be a day when it really happens and Pakistan will be left licking its chops.
ET mods - this person clearly seems to be aware of the actual settlement unlike many of the Pakistani commentators. Yet he says, we Indians have our facts wrong. Please allow a discussion based on facts.
@mansoor hashmi: In Kishenganga case, Pakistan wanted the court to halt building of dam. Building the dam was permitted by the court. It did require a modification to the design of the dam which India has. agreed to incorporate. If you consider that as a fair judgment, fine. India is already complying with the fair judgment. What Pakistan wants is above and beyond the Kishenganga settlement which India has not contested at all. Naturally, after having gone to the arbitration panel at Pakistan's behest, India is under no obligation to do anything above and beyond the fair settlement - wouldn't you agree?
It is Pakistani news channels and even respectd newspapers like ET that talk about India stealing water. Please tell me has any international court ruled that India has stolen water?it is Pakistani anchors - educated ones mind you, that say that floods were caused due to Kishenganga dam releasing water without notice. Please tell me is it possible for a run of the river dam to 'release water unexpectedly'?
Who is misinformed? Who is misinforming? Is it right to accuse India of stealing water when it has honored IWT even during wars?
Dipak@Gp65: So right you are. Pakistan is getting the same amount of water that it got as West Pakistan in 1947. Those people say that India is stealing our water but not saying that the population has increased six times and they never tried to store so much water that is going into the ocean.
Pakistan how long u will live in fools paradise.Come out of hallucination
I am surprised to see so many from India making such negative remarks about Pakistan concerns. They are either ignorant or naive to the about the facts of Baglihar and Kishengaga case. Instead of relying on statements of politicians and government media, they should read judgments in both cases. In case of Baglihar, the Neutral expert allowed India to construct low level outlets which was overturned by ICJ in Kishenganga case. On other issue, ICJ decided evenly for both countries. India was allowed to divert water but mandated to release minimum environmental flows casing 15% reduction in their power generation. Similarly, the diversion allowed 15% reduction in Pakistans Hydropower generation in its NJ project downstream of KG. Pl read John Brisco's article who is a professor at Harvard on this issue.
@Parvez: Yielding to the bullying of a petulant, violent neighbour who wants to have his way after losing a court case is not responsible behavior. It is cowardice.
India has honoured IWT even when the two countries were at war. Instead of recognizing that, India is being accused of stealing water. Such lies cannoT and should nott be rewarded.
@Syed Jalal Kashmiri: Pakistan cannot do anything byt itself. Either it can be side kick of USA or China or will try to be international court and now dreaming to join hands with any country ? Please name one nation which has joined hands with Pakistan for anything. Don't say China, since China is doing business with you not "joining" hands for anything :P
The deal with india should be very straightforward! stop disrupting our water ways and we open the central asian gas depots for you
@Syed Jalal Kashmiri:
"India is also stealing water from Occupied Kashmir, Bangladesh, and other countries."
You forgot to add China and the Indian ocean.
" Pakistan should join hands with all nations which are the victims of Indian theft and bullying."
Of course you should Why have you been waiting for 68 years without acting on this grand plan?
This just reminds me of the water issues of Canada/USA where Canada has a water surplus while the USA has a water shortage. They are considering in diverting the water from Canada to the USA to meet the USA's ever growing water needs. Many Canadians are anxious about this and think Americans are wasteful/greedy with resources. India/Pakistan or USA/Canada. Either way it is not going to easy in terms of maintaining a good relationship.
@Khalistan Zindabad: Consequently, if now I have to choose between a deadly snake and an Indian, I would definitely choose the former.
Thats what you did in 1947
India is also stealing water from Occupied Kashmir, Bangladesh, and other countries. This is a thieving lying nation. Pakistan should join hands with all nations which are the victims of Indian theft and bullying.
@Rudra: do you reaalize how easy it is for us to destroy ur energy lines? huh? @zen no mate this actually is my name! try doing some research in amritsar you mite find some there too
@TUNG: It is good to see that being a Pakistani, you have converted yourself into a Chinese.
@Khalistan Zindabad You wrote I have to choose between a deadly snake and an Indian, I would definitely choose the former.
The moderator must have allowed your comments to show every one your kind of "people" also live in Pakistan. Among those who don't read ET, there must be many more, perhaps several million.
On a different note, any establishment of Khalistan-the new country should have Lahore, the capital of Sikh Empire as its new capital and should also include Nankhana Sahib. Strange screen name for you. Try at least Pakistan Zindabad.
@TUNG: Lol ever heard of Chhabar port Iran? Or india's Sea routes? Wake up body.. It's high time.
@Khalistan Zindabad: Your comment has finally convinced my that you have chosen the right choice. That is the reason why Pakistan is in a mess. PLEASE keep on choicing snakes.
we shud not care about kashmir for our future energy needs! we shud know that it is india which will bow down to us eventually since we are the only way for its future needs in central asia and the middle east
ET, your comment policy wont do you any good, Internet Indians just gonna yap all the time and keep firing from their hips without having an iota of actual situation on the ground. It only gonna confuse the average Pak reader who already have limited sources of information available.
For those of you who "thinks" Pakistan has lost and India have "won" then hit link below and read the piece written by Lawyer who represents the very case in ICJ.
The reason both sides are keeping hush hush about their respective commissioners on water issues is that, India is straining to the leash to break ICJ verdict and She wants to have a maximum leverage from Pakistan without much noise or halabalu under the table and Pak current government does want to get embraced in already politically charged Pakistan cuz even sympathizers let alone opponents will question the current administration softy policy on India while India blatantly violets IWC Treaty.
http://newsweekpakistan.com/dam-age-control/
(PS ET, seriously, revisit ur comments policy or changes to HT)
regards,
i still don't understand, what exactly pakistan bringing to the table.. siachen,water,kashmir in each of those, it is india which has to give something in return of nothing,what kind of a preposterous transaction that would be.how can pakistanis miss this logic.in fact there is nothing pakistanis can do to make india budge on any of these issues..
One line is more important is India will show some flexibility on Pakistan on dam building in India now you want to dictate how to and how much height of dam where your country show total negligence on water even your country never build dam after 65 years and giving threatening to bring to ICJ now days has gone where US and other country support Pakistan for their purpose now they need India so you are most welcome and you can approach to ICJ how ever if you see street beggar first they ask for help and if you are not giving he start threatening on name of God i feel like last line pakistan follow
Thank you ET for publishing all the fallacious, twisted, deceptive, dishonest, and hateful comments of Indians, especially the one by "Sri Varahadev" and then the large number of Indians clicking on 'Recommend'. Over a short time, such comments have really helped me to correct myself. Now my decades long yearning for good brotherly relations with India has changed to something which is truly reciprocal in nature, only much stronger though. Consequently, if now I have to choose between a deadly snake and an Indian, I would definitely choose the former.
For more water..blame India For less water....blame India For terrorism.......blame USA For sectarian violence...blame Ira,, Saudi Arabia For other problems, blame Afghanistan, Israel and the West the entire world is out to get Pakistan because the entire world cannot digest the rise of this country my dear neighbours...when will you get real?
There are certain situations that are dictated by nature and this is one of them........at best Pakistan can expect that India behave responsibly and respond accordingly. In other words hope for the best but prepare for the worst.
@Momin: "Riparian law does not apply here." Why not. Riparian Rights The rights, which belong to landowners through whose property a natural watercourse runs, to the benefit of such stream for all purposes to which it can be applied.
@Raj Kafir: U r wrong when u say "do whatever she wants".
Under the riparian principle, all landowners whose property adjoins a body of water have the right to make reasonable use of it as it flows through or over their property. If there is not enough water to satisfy all users, allotments are generally fixed in proportion to frontage on the water source. These rights cannot be sold or transferred other than with the adjoining land and only in reasonable quantities associated with that land. The water cannot be transferred out of the watershed without due consideration as to the rights of the downstream riparian landowners.
Riparian rights include such things as the right to access for swimming, boating and fishing; the right to wharf out to a point of navigability; the right to erect structures such as docks, piers, and boat lifts; the right to use the water for domestic purposes; the right to accretions caused by water level fluctuations; the right to exclusive use if the waterbody is non-navigable. Riparian rights also depend upon "reasonable use" as it relates to other riparian owners to ensure that the rights of one riparian owner are weighed fairly and equitably with the rights of adjacent riparian owners.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riparianwaterrights
Why ET ... why you are doing that. India just transferred water from one tributary to another. Both still drain to Pakistan. Why you are not showing the full picture ..?
All politicians in Pakistan are trying to pass their blame on India for their own faults which is not building any dam on their side. An honest and unbiased assessment would establish that even if India agrees to all that Pakistan wants, there will be absolutely no benefit to Pakistan and will only harm India. The water will only go waste without benefiting either India or Pakistan. Someone should really research and find out the facts on what I have said here.
Riparian law does not apply here.
Does Pakistan has any water resources expert? They have failed at every level.
Pakistan had already taken Ondia to an independent arbitration panel on Kishenganga dam and it lost. To expect that India should yield even after having won the case is absurd.
There is no purpose other than riling up Pakistanis against India using some excuse. Even the earlier case regarding Baglihar dam was lost by Pakistan.
In fact The Indus Water Treaty is far more favorable to Pakistan than most similar treaties around the world are to the lower riparian country. That treaty was signed by India under duress of World Bank in 1960. If Pakistan is foolish enough to abrogate this treaty, it will never get anything remotely as good as what it has now because India is no lnger as vulnerable as it was in 1960.
If water was the only issue that has bedeviled our bilateral relations, that could be resolved with relative ease. But when it becomes one more contentious issue along with a long list of Pakistani hostilities against India, resolution becomes elusive.
Fomenting insurgency and militancy in J&K, State actively participating in several terrorist acts perpetrated against India, sheltering international terrorists and actors that have the blood of countless innocent lives on their hands, unprovoked aggression along the LOC, providing tactical and logistical support to the terrorist training camps operating in POK, they are all impediments to serious negotiations and a fruitful resolution to the water issue.
A protocol blunder - Basit meeting with the J&K separatists against the declared wishes of India, and Bilawal's recent ranting are no way to express gratitude for India's benevolence to let the water flow to Pakistan.
If Mirza Asif Baig is threatening to take the baseless issue to the ICJ, his statement is immature. What does he go next, the International Criminal Court?
@ajeet: @Raj Kafir: @Sri Varahadev: Dear fellow Indians...thank you very much for your early morning comments on tribune to let us know how much incapable we are and how much innocent India is...we are taking care of our floods and didn't ask for your help...now you should also take care of Indian occupied Kashmir which is in disaster
Pakistan case will be strengthened only with more water reservoirs and more storage capacity. Pakistan has failed to do that so far and shouldn't hope to win its case with India.
Pakistani need to know they can do nothing, we will not give an inch. Whole of Pakistan is occupied India and we have not forgotten.
No use of showing KHEP in picture. It is a settled issue. Explain viewers about new projects ... :-)
THey went to the World Bank who are neutral and lost.
This article does not mention this little fact.
Hafeez Sayeed should be invited to these Talks +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++= Otherwise there is no laughter.
Pakistan should be grateful to India for all the dams in Kashmir +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Sooner or later , when Pakistan gets entire Kashmir it will come with all these dams ready and functional. Or u dont believe in 'Kashmir Banega Pakistan?'
“We are hopeful that India will show some flexibility on [Pakistan’s] reservations over the building of new dams in India,” ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ On behalf of India I am ready to concede that the height of all dams under design would be reduced by full 2 mm. Thats about all Pakistan has ever gained by litigation.
IWT limits the quantity of water that Pakistan can get. On an average India has been giving 30% more than that. Pakistan has already been to ICJ and lost the case.
" he admitted that Islamabad would have no choice but to approach the ICJ if New Delhi did not entertain their ‘fair’ demands." ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Ditto for the 'fair' demands of IK & TUQ.
" Khawaja Asif terms PCA award on Kishenganga dam a 'big victory' for Pakistan" +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Read" "http://tribune.com.pk/story/648754/khwaja-asif-terms-pca-award-on-kishenganga-dam-a-big-victory-for-pakistan/" And today the 'victorious' country is complaining!!
Bilawal has promised that he will take back Kashmir from India ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ thats the end of water issues .......I suggest Pakistan ensure that Bilawal delivers....
India is the only country in the world which is giving water to her neighbour country Pakistan sacrificing her own water needs. As per riparian law India can do whatever she wants to do with her water sources. Pakistan should be thankful to India for not diverting the rivers to meet India's own water demand.
Once again, Pakistan is going to waste its mearge foriegn currency to fight a case against India and loose.
Pakistan will do well to learn from history before indulging in empty talk of taking India to the International Court of Justice.
India excludes all disputes involving India from the jurisdiction of International Court of Justice in respect of any country which is or has been a Member of the Commonwealth of Nations. The ICJ has accepted India’s jurisdiction exclusionary right when Pakistan’s August 1999 case was thrown out of the ICJ by the ICJ themselves in their June 2000 judgment.
Sindh, Balochistan and Pakistan Occupied Jammu & Kashmir may not have the capability to stand up against Pakistani Punjab Provinces water gluttony and theft, but be assured that India on the other hand will ensure that Indian citizens in Jammu and Kashmir are not deprived because of Pakistani Punjab Provinces water gluttony and theft.