Don’t act surprised

Published: August 24, 2010

Oh, the shock! Oh, the disgust! Oh, the outrage over the barbaric killings in Sialkot! The media, the blogosphere, facebookers have been going into hyperactive overdrive to out condemn one another over the senseless killings of the two teenage boys. Some have frothed with self-righteous anger, some have put the blame on poverty and illiteracy (a self-serving defence that ignores the violent solutions advocated in many a swanky drawing room discussion), some on the breakdown of the social contract between the state and the individual. But all seem shocked by the barbarity on display. But why are we surprised? Why the denial? Hasn’t it always been thus?

We are, and have always been, a barbaric, degenerate nation revelling in bloodlust. Our nation was forged during a bloody partition — in which up to one million people were massacred. One just has to read eyewitness accounts of the riots, the train butchery, the brutal rapes and slaughter of that period to get a feel of the heady, almost orgasmic, delight that the perpetrators of these crimes revelled in as the nation was born.

The lynching itself is nothing new. Read any report by the Human Rights Commission of Pakistan and you will see that this is a fairly regular occurrence. Christians, Hindus, homosexuals, suspected paedophiles and robbers have been killed at the hands of mob justice. And what about Zulfikar Ali Bhutto and his daughter Benazir? Were they not just killed by a more sophisticated form of mob justice?

Our culture celebrates barbarity and vengeance. Is the Sialkot killing that shocking when you consider the macho culture of the Punjab? Maula Jatt, Punjab cinema’s most famous film, is a three-hour advertorial for vigilante justice. The film celebrates revenge, honour killing and violence. It is entertainment for severely warped minds. One scene has our hero, Maula Jatt, axing off a leg and an arm and then catching the severed limb as it flew through the air in his bare hands! Another has Maula’s axe ripping open a man’s guts to have the intestines fly out spectacularly. This is what passes for entertainment in our land. So don’t act surprised when the red mist from a teenage boy’s head appears on your TV screens.

Barbarity and sadism are ever present in our society. We are a nation where politicians like Senator Sardar Israrullah Zehri can openly condone the burying of women alive by declaring it part of his culture. Our religious discourse often celebrates the brutality and violence of medieval Arabia. We are a nation that laps up the bile of ‘Dr’ Aamir Liaquat as he describes Ahmadis as wajab-ul-qatal (punishable by death).

And we are a nation which collectively stands watching — like the mob in Sialkot — as those very same Ahmadis are massacred by gunmen.

A friend of a friend recently announced that he would be off to Sialkot with a bunch of tough friends to avenge the murder of the boys, unaware of the irony of what he was suggesting. He was planning to commit murder and administer vigilante justice to the very same people who had committed murder and administered their form of vigilante justice. And so the cycle goes on.

So don’t act surprised. The Sialkot murders are as Pakistani as truck art, biryani and loadshedding. This has always been an ugly reality of Pakistan and always will be. The Islamic Republic of Pakistan is a misnomer. Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. And it never will be. Rather than drawing inspiration from the Holy Quran, our nation models itself on another book — a book in which children become savages. Pakistan is not the land of the pure — we are Lord of the Flies.

Published in The Express Tribune, August 25th, 2010.

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Reader Comments (354)

  • hassan
    Aug 24, 2010 - 11:53PM


  • Khadija Masood
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:12AM

    Brilliant article GeorgeRecommend

  • Amin H.
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:14AM

    Defintely food for thought. Well written.Recommend

  • kashif malik
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:33AM

    “we are a barbaric nation” – Yes your nation – the English are! The British were responsible for the bloodshed and choas at partition. Get your facts straight – read Shameful Flight and parting Kicks. Dont just rely on your simplistic views on this country. Dont speak for “us” – you have barely been in Pakistan for a few years George so let’s us not have your patronising condescension. I am sick of foreigners telling us what we are and what we are not. We know its a heinous crime.Recommend

  • Hamood
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:33AM

    I agree. We inherited such a pure and beautiful land and we are destroying it and everybody in it. One of the reasons I left Pakistan in mid-90s was because of my personality clash with over 50% of the Pakistanis. I found them barbaric, uncivilized, ill mannered, uneducated and 2 number. I found it shocking because I was none of those even though I was born and raised there. I guess its what your parents teach you. I wasn’t gonna spend my life in such an environment. If some people say its a cowards way out so be it. I still visit from time to time and send money which is the second largest source of income for the country. But unless and until the people in Pakistan become civilized I will never ever come back and settle down there.Recommend

  • AA
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:37AM

    Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. And it never will be

    Has any Islamic state been pure and peaceful, other than those mentioned in the Arabian Nights?Recommend

  • Sharjeel Jawaid
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:39AM

    Quite unfortunate but true!Recommend

  • Usman
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:41AM

    George, nice article but I find it hard to digest when coming from someone who arrived in Pakistan a few years ago. I mean no disrespect to you or your journalistic abilities but I hope you understand what I mean. This would be similar to someone migrating to the US and after a couple of years referring to himself as a Yankee and an expert on American history and way of life.
    I agree with you that this nation was ‘forged during a bloody partition’ but the Hindus, Muslims, and the British were all equally responsible for the bloodshed. We may have been violent in the past (and in the present too) but there are also hundreds of examples of compassion and mercy exhibited by us. Also, it may be easy for you to label Pakistan as “not the land of the pure” but you cannot relate to the horrors faced by the ancestors at the hands of the British Raj when creating this nation. Let us not forget the gruesome and inhumane violence inflicted by the British. Recommend

  • Haider
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:45AM

    Very harsh. Can we stop condemning the Pakistani society? We are also from the same society. Pakistan will become a nation of peace but it takes time. Lynching has been a part of human history not just a part of Pakistan. Yes we have problems, but we can overcome them with a can do attitude, not with a you-suck-so-just-accept-it attitude.

    We need to do a lot of self reflection, but we should not lose hope, we should not forgo and forget the sacrifices that our countrymen have made and are making. We are in this togather.Recommend

  • Nomi
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:56AM

    Well said.Recommend

  • Alina
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:57AM

    Couldnt agree with you more! This is exactly what we are; barbaric to the core!Recommend

  • Nicheoflights
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:09AM

    Didn’t expect this from you George, outright Pakistan bashing, hatred for the existence of the country. Right now we are all bleeding, and looking for answers, and people do get answers when they look for them. We are hurting badly for these two boys – for this country and for our own mistakes. Yet out of all this brutality, the sacrifice of these innocent lives and many other such cases, we can reflect and take corrective measures as a society, as a nation, as a people. There is hope, there is chance. We can learn what we did wrong, correct it and try to make a better country out of this. Would you not support it. We should send a message of peace to all humanity, irrespective of cast, creed, religion. We should build a memorial in the city of Sialkot, of love, peace, the sacrifice of these two innocent boys. We should try to win the hearts of the people by reaching out to them with our intellect, our resources. Kindness, love and sharing change hearts, societies, nations. Let’ try to do that first before we condemn this nation completely.Recommend

  • Aftab Kenneth Wilson
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:16AM

    A bitter reality. You have dragged the history back to the time of partition which is equally true. As far as members of the minorities are concerned they are simply “Siting Ducks”. The present government boasts that the 18th amendment has brought back the 1973 constitution to its real shape, what a joke. Zia ul Haque is still grinning at the minorities with a wry smile. We do our politics on the “Faces of Death”. Text books are full with hate against others. We need to reconstruct all areas of Character Building and must be educated on Moral Theology. Stop thinking that we are the best. It is time to learn something from other nations who are not theocratic.Recommend

  • Rashid Saleem
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:24AM

    Indeed a slap on our so called societal values which have become highly violent sue to constant influx from religious clergy. When we make brutality as an everyday happening, it will go unnoticed and this is what the rational and liberal minds need to unite against. The very crumbling fabric of our society can only be rescued by liberal values.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 1:26AM

    A Brave Article. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 1:29AM

    Truth to its core..very rightly saidRecommend

  • Dr. Altaf ul Hassan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:34AM

    You are true Sir.Recommend

  • Syed
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:37AM

    Sad and true..the cameras are capturing these moments only now. But it has always been thus…Recommend

  • Khurram
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:38AM

    A strange day

    Whole day has passed
    But nothing bad has happened
    I met lot of persons
    None of them insulted me
    Today was a day of honest talk
    Nobody hated the truth
    I trusted everybody
    And nobody betrayed me
    The biggest surprise came in the evening
    The person who returned home
    Was none else but me
    Complete and in one piece!Recommend

  • Naushad Shafkat
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:46AM

    Sad but true. Recommend

  • Usama
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:00AM

    This is what passes for entertainment in our land.

    Yeah you are right this is what goes on in our entertainment except that this was not just another piece of entertainment this was a part of reality…which obviously evokes some reaction from the people!! So please come up with some good reason because such forms of entertainment are common everywhere. Go and watch any action movie of Hollywood and they would be showing the same kind of stuff. Killings…violence…barbarism etc I agree that we have always been barbaric in nature but you see that is not the reason why people aree shocked. What is surprising is the reaction of the people who were there watching the show and the role of the police which was also present there None of the people present or neither the police stepped forward to save those boys from such a brutal act!! That is what has shocked the entire nation that how low have we gone as a society and how ashamed we all should be!!Recommend

  • ET
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:13AM

    We? Our Nation? Waste of space on Tribune… George, dont mean to be rude to you but expect you not to be rude to millions of people by saying “We are, and have always been, a barbaric, degenerate nation revelling in bloodlust” . . . you have NO right to say this when you’ve been here for nothing beyond a mere few years…Recommend

  • Annie
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:24AM

    Nice one!
    I like it that a 5 yr old Pakistani citizen i.e George knows more about Pakistan than 60 old State. And how he relates himself to Pakistanis although he is new to us all. He is a good example of ‘Integration’ and shows a good face of Pakistani society. Recommend

  • Uzair.Javaid
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:40AM

    My GOD, you are so true about as to how you paint us. This explanation couldn’t be any fairer than this. We really are a nation who enjoys entertainment; be it a car crash on a road, a fight, a biker having an argument with a cop over a traffic violation. Unimaginably you would witness people actually pulling over and peeking into what’s going on. Just today before Iftar I witnessed a minute accident on a road, a young boy not seemingly having any driving permit came out and slapped the bike he had hit into and eventually a fight popped out of the scene. Nobody came near to try and calm the scene down, instead there were people again having their cellphones in hands making videos of the great action stunt there. Had we been a nation, people would have done something about the lynching of the youthsRecommend

  • Alia
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:44AM

    Welcome to Barbaristan, George!Recommend

  • Holy Rockerzzz
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:50AM

    Wicked article George.Recommend

  • Holy Rockerzzz
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:52AM

    George i am sure you wont be a Proud Pakistani anymore, come back to Britian mate…Islamic Republic of Holy Pakistan tutututututuututRecommend

  • Aizey
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:52AM

    As much as I am appalled at the barbaric murders in Ahmadi mosques and Sialkot, I cant but express my disagreement at the authors intent to make us all seem like lunatics. Yes, it was a horrible murder, but why should a nation of 180 million feel like murderers? After all, Suni and Shia mosques have been bombed, not just the Ahmadis. We are ALL being held hostage by a very minute but violent section of our society.

    No one I know supported the Sialkot murderers. Most of us are reasonable, moderate people, and feel scared at the turn our country is taking socially and economically, and the virtual hijacking of our minds by a small group of frustrated sociopaths and terrorists. As a nation, we have never elected Mullahs. That is because we know the direction they might take. Instead, we have alway voted for democracy, and have always been humiliated by our elected leaders. So, where does the mistake lie? We all condemn the murderers, and the author reserves no right to humiliate us for someone els’s sins! This has got to stop, otherwise, pretty soon, you will start ranting about Pakistanis being responsible for the cold blooded murders of the Tootsi and HuTu tribes!Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 3:14AM

    How many years will it take to refurbish our humanity. That’s a question I am asking from the winds, perhaps.

    No wonder if the western world is afraid of us — Pakistanis. Justified! Recommend

  • adnan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:16AM

    George, i completely agree with your article. we should all hang our heads in shame.Recommend

  • hejab
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:38AM

    Strong article, unfortunately very truthful as well. It’s a shame but that’s what the self cultural genocide and the last few years of political rape of the masses does to a country.Recommend

  • Khurram Bukhari (Rotterdam)
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:54AM

    George! I share 1000% your point of view that our whole nation is rotten and blood thirsty like the Roman era crowd who loved to watch bloody fights of gladiators or burning Christian alive on the cross or throwing them in front of hungry beasts. This was part of entertainment and now what the crow did by clubbing the two innocent brothers to death also reflects the deep routed violence and intolerance we exercise to each other worse than animals.
    And still we people of Pakistan want recognition among the civilized world??? What a shame for our country and its people.

  • Ayesha Ijaz Khan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:57AM

    First of all, the fact that George has only been in Pakistan a few years should not be a reason to deny him a Pakistani identity, should he want it. If George considers himself Pakistani, he is welcome in our country. However, I do not appreciate the Pakistan-bashing in this article. Apart from the paragraph about our propensity towards mob justice, which is a valid point, and the article would have been very relevant if it had focused on that alone, the rest of the reasons are either tenuous (ZAB and Benazir’s deaths were both very troubling but are a far cry from the Sialkot killings) or out of place (partition). What would one say then about the French or Russian Revolutions? Recommend

  • Yusaf Khan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 4:16AM

    Some parts of the article are valid (re: minority killings etc) but the rest sounds like an emotional rant. The article makes it sound as if Pakistani genetic make up has an active violence gene. In fact, I would make the case, that all human beings have that propensity for extreme violence which will exhibit itself in certain circumstances. In Pakistan, the lack of rule of law, the fact that the average Pakistani does not expect to get justice, and the fact that mob violence has historically not been prosecuted in Pakistan created those circumstances which resulted in the killings in Sialkot. Which is why it is so important that we prosecute the perpetrators of this heinous incident.Recommend

  • Mobeen raza
    Aug 25, 2010 - 4:25AM

    Well said. Pakistan is a imploding right in front of us, a country mired in corruption and lawless ran by the illiterate and loved by the poor. It is a tragic romantic in that it has so much to offer yet takes more than it can carry and still asks for more.
    Never has the state been as far away from it’s ideals as it is today. Born in sin, thecountry lives in it’s self created sty of filth and corruption with a government asking forever the immortal “please sir, may I have some more”
    Rip Pakistan Recommend

  • Khobar from UK
    Aug 25, 2010 - 4:46AM

    It makes me sick when I witness two young man being beaten to death in front of crowd. I sincerely hope that the men who were clearly visible in the footage should be apprehended and brought to justice. So should the police officer who is seen in the footage witnessing this barbaric act.

    In the end I would like to say that George has written a nice article.
    Well done George.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 4:52AM

    Absolutely True !!! I was wondering why was there no million march? long March? or even a small rally about it? No Not at all…… shameful nation…. Honor Killing, Karo Kari, Wani who can forget these deeds. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 5:08AM

    The dominant archetypes in our society subvert the rule of law, and shifts power to the individual. The stereotype put forward in movies, dramas and the stage, frame the individual as the victim, with the whole monolith of the state acting against him. Everyone is corrupt, while the individual gains social esteem by bearing down his own form of justice. In a society, where an eye for an eye has its own meaning, its no surprise that we crave blood.Recommend

  • sarah
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:11AM

    George!! I had no idea that you write so well. Amazing words of wisdom. Thank you for being so blunt and making the obvious more obvious. We need more nationals like you in order to educate our nation. Thank you for your wise words. Couldn’t have said it better myself. U nailed it with your reference to LORD OF THE FLIES.Recommend

  • Imran
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:18AM

    the reason ppl have gone into overdrive in condemning this event is that hope still survives… except in your article…

    “without hope we have nothing”

    give us something to celebrate georgeRecommend

  • haq
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:25AM

    dpo sialkot should be hanged till death.Recommend

  • Qirat
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:50AM

    Ignorant and arrogant clerics have led the people on the wrong path. These cleric were against the creation of Pakistan and now refuse to condemn suicide bombings. They openly label Ahmadis as wajib-ul-qatil and many others. They believe in stoning to death adulterers, a punishment not mentioned in the Quran. Recommend

  • Schazad
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:08AM

    I am so ashamed at all this happening. I can’t seem to digest what has been happening in my country but I guess I am just too naive to not known all this.Recommend

  • Shawn Smith
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:22AM


    People like u r your nations biggest down fall, every one else is responsible for all your nations short comings, It was probably the British that asked the shameless crowd to watch the atrocity without so much of a voice in protest, that crowd was a very good representation of your nation, no one needs to read to come to the conclusion that a nation of shameless people watched these children being victimized, why are you so concerned about Georges views as a human being, yet your nation has no shame in begging the foreignors for charity, I recall a request for restructuring of 10 Billion dollars of Aid. Tomorrow it could be your mother or daughter that gets victimized, I would like to see your reaction to voices of reason at that point.

    An intellectual is able to entertain thoughts and criticisms from any person without consideration of his religion or nationality. If the British were such evil doers, why then did you choose to go to great lengths in trying to excel in their mother tounge, you probably gloat about your command of the English language.

    By attacking people for their ideas you have aptly proven Georges point that you are a nation of intolerant hypocrites….Recommend

  • LC
    Aug 25, 2010 - 7:00AM

    George, what a rant! It’s shocking that the express tribune has such non-existent standards and publishes all this angst-y stuff. You insult Pakistan at great lengths without providing any solution whatsoever. ‘The Sialkot murders are as Pakistani as truck art, biryani and loadshedding’- ha! i fear the heat has gotten to your head. . You also forget that these brothers who were so brutually murdered were Pakistani themselves. By your logic, the line between victim and perpetrator is quite blurred. People need to learn to stop generalizing and that too so mindlessly. On a tangent i think some of the comments are quite unfair, George’s Pakistani-ness should not be questioned, if he feels Pakistani, he is Pakistani.
    It is true that Pakistani society as a whole needs to engage in some serious self-reflection but wallowing in this self-pity of we were born, are and will always remain barbarians is pathetic. Recommend

  • mussarat ahmedzeb swat
    Aug 25, 2010 - 7:29AM

    bitter but true,excellent piece.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 8:40AM

    A very good article by George who is a true Pakistani because he has been on a tour of the nation and understands what the country is like. However, like all of us, George is obviously angry and emotional. Though it is difficult, what we need to do is think about ways in which we can bring about change in Pakistan. We are better than such incidents and we must rise and show the world that we are good people. What has happened is not new and has been going on for years. But we want the future to be different and we must look forward to a better Pakistan. Recommend

  • Arif
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:41AM

    Pakistan is going where…? In a barbaric, pre-historic arena. And it may be their destiny due to Mollaism.Recommend

  • Dia
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:58AM

    Well written but with an undeniable streak of prejudice. While mentioning movies like Maula jatt, how can you forget Saw and Wrong Turn? They didnt have contribution of paki wits!! Bollywood is as well into movies like ganga jal why point finger at us alone? The movie bit seems out of place here georgie!! Recommend

  • Random Reader
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:18AM

    I appreciate the sincerity with which you have written this article, George. You truly feel part of the Pakaistani nation, and as such feel it your responsibility to honestly critique the wrongs of society. You are not the politically correct foreigner-turned-Pakistani who turns away from some of the more shameful facets of this society. You are a brother.Recommend

  • ArifQ
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:35AM

    Dear George

    From cockroach (Fasi Zaka) to fly in just one day, now that is an achievement for the state of Pakistan.

    The outrage and condemnations are certainly welcome but very new when it comes to Pakistani society being appalled by mob justice. For too long we (including people like George) have chosen to be silent for different reasons, its about time civil society declares ALL forms of violence unacceptable irrespective of religion, caste, ethnicity, nationality or crime. Let the courts decide, but here lies the real problem, people have no confidence in the honorable judges who have chosen to don the role of Maula Jat. I am a cynic when it comes to pakistani prospects as a civilized nation, we have too many skeletons and way too much religion which masks the ugliness. Recommend

  • Dr. Muhammad
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:39AM

    I am a recently graduated Pakistani medical doctor in Bahrain, and have always been strongly agnostic/humanist/secular. I have not been able to live with myself after seeing video shots of what those 2 young boys, in the prime of their youth, had to face until they died. Honestly, if I may ask all Pakistani readers here, can’t you see the obvious, the killing is nothing but confirmation that our culture is based on village feudal culture, where we follow the line set by the landlord, and beat and kill whoever the landlord wants dead, no questions asked.
    Everyone, I mean, everyone, including myself, deserve to commit suicide at the graves of those 2 poor young boys.As I am abroad, can I just ask all, repeat, all Pakistanis, to stop pretending that you and your culture is better than everyone else, it is not, and I won’t hesitate to pass urine on our culture and way of life everyday until I die.
    Nothing will bring those 2 boys home alive to their mother’s arms. I have downloaded Geo TV’s Crisis Cell and Dr Shahid Masood’s coverage of the Sialkot massacre. After hearing,seeing and feeling the grief of the boys’ family, I really don’t know how we will all live as if nothing ever happened.
    I want to ask Pakistanis that if something cruel and horrible like this can happen in Sialkot, I wonder what else must go on in the feudal rural farms and villages, far away from cameras and prying eyes.
    Losing one son for any family is bad enough, but losing 2 sons to a mad mob, for no reason other than being at the wrong place, and at the wrong time, I just cannot imagine. I also have 2 brothers, of 21 and 15 years of age. Someone amongst the crowd watching the brothers being bashed again and again, must have had brothers of their own. Why did they not come forward to stop the violence and save the 2 brothers?
    Can I ask my fellow Pakistanis, if the criminals were hitting and kicking copies of the Holy Quran instead of the 2 brothers, would the crowd have been so silent?
    Every person in the crowd was a Muslim, but none were even men to step forward and stop what was clearly wrong.

  • Karima
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:55AM

    Everyone enjoys entertainment of violent forms be it a bond movie or WWF. This however does not mean people enjoy seeing people being killed. It is cowardly to stand back and watch people being beaten to death but we’v become used to this pressure and uncertainty from authoritative figures and I feel this Article with all its evidence of similar history will really not help suppress this emotion. Accepting things or maybe even mocking people is not the way. As Gandhi said, ‘You must be the change you wish to see in this world’- maybe you should try and stop your friend’s friend. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 9:58AM

    “Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. And it never will be.”

    Agree with the first statement, but not with the second. Our history is awash with bloodshed and barbarism. And we enjoy it. Any excuse is a reason to shed blood. a child is born? Ziba a goat, shed some blood. a boy is born? Two goats! In mourning? Sacrifice some animals to make yourself feel better. The islamic world sheds blood at every occassion the way the first world drinks alcohol (when merry or drowning their sorrows).

    So no, the lynching is not surprising.

    However, I do still have hope that things will change. The shock, outrage, and (hopefully) ultimate justice will slowly turn the tide against barbarity. Maybe I’m an eternal optimist, maybe I’m stupid, but I still have hope.Recommend

  • Azeem
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:08AM

    I think proper retribution would be hanging all the participants, 11-22 Police etc etc in that very same spot. string them all up I say. make it a public hanging. Our people want a spectacle lets give it to them. let them see their loved ones hang before their eyes. that should make them think twice before pulling such stunts again.

    The Saudis have it spot on. Make peopel watch beheadings. cuts down on crime when you know the outcome.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 10:08AM

    I think a lot of people will think “hey, this is a gora guy talking to us about Pakistan, what does HE know??” but really you hit the nail on the head. What a metaphor, Lord of the Rings. Never thought of it that way but that is spot on. Well, then, if it is Lord of the Rings, what is the future of Pakistan? I don’t think democracy will work until we can educate the people. Until then, martial law? What choice do we have? It is sometimes hard to believe how Pakistan survives amongst corruption, bureaucracy and sheer ignorance. All I have is prayers for my beloved country, now something unrecognizable from my childhood.Recommend

  • salutations
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:14AM

    @Aizey – if you feel so strongly against all this pakistan bashing, maybe you and others around you need to reflect on what happened and start a revolution. Sitting there and just saying “no” to these acts gets you nowhere. You need to stand up and voice your opinions to the government and leaders, that are elected by the people of Pakistan. You chose these people as your leaders, so don’t try to turn back now. Please don’t start with the Shias get persecuted and Sunnis do also. The kind of persecution that Ahmadis are living through is no different than the death of the Sialkoti brothers. Ahmadis are condemned for worshipping in their mosques (yes, they are mosques) and the media calls them ibadat-gahs, scared of the mullahs. Give me a break.

    What happened with the 2 brothers is a heinous crime and continuous murders of INNOCENT lives and acts like these show the world how “uneducated” and backward the pakistani society is. Pakistani society needs to reflect on their thinking, their actions and their image worldwide. It is surely not making Islam look good in the eyes of the world.Recommend

  • Shaharyar
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:16AM

    I wish I could disagree but I can’t turn myself from facing this reality. I mentioned in on of my responses, We have never been an Islamic state simply because we do not follow Islamic Laws, so to say we are Islamic Republic is an abosulute False. We need a leader like Hazrat Muhammad (pbuh), who with his teachings can change our heart, mind and soul. I hope we as a nation can realize now but this nation is busy doing some important work, this nation is SLEEPING, do not wake them.

    May Allah (swt) bless us and guide us to the right path. Recommend

  • MNA
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:28AM

    What a shame we are calling into question the author’s patriotism and allegiance just because he was not born in this land. Brilliant article George, your anger shows that you care about your country and is justified.Recommend

  • Mango man
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:33AM

    An Eye opener????
    Don’t you guys think we should change??? Stop hating, stop thinking like we are the only saviors of ISLAM in the world…
    Have the courage to stop the wrong or atleast criticize it… Discourage the Islamic extremism and the social injustice starting from our home… in our offices in our shops…
    sighhhhhhh.. when will we grow up … very very sad. I am ashamed Recommend

  • Haris Chaudhry
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:45AM


    Each word is true. Some of the comments are the typical knee-jerk reaction one gets from the pseudo right where accepting blame is cowardice and looking for scapegoats being the norm.

    We are a violence prone and blood thirsty nation but hate to admit it.

    Indeed, shame on us.Recommend

  • SJ
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:55AM

    George, very well said. I think we should give a ‘Gandasa’ to all new Pakistanis in their citizenship ceremony. Did you get one? Recommend

  • Ali Haider
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:19AM

    Very true. We are barbaric. This is what feudal do and it goes un-noticed because police is their keep. It would have gone un-noticed this time too had it not been captured on video. What a bad state of affairs. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 11:29AM

    “One just has to read eyewitness accounts of the riots, the train butchery, the brutal rapes and slaughter of that period to get a feel of the heady, almost orgasmic, delight that the perpetrators of these crimes revelled in…”

    Yes, that’s true. But is it very different from the American Indians, the Holocaust, the Eurasian raids and wars, Darfur, Nigeria, Gujarat, KKK, Ireland? I think it’s the ‘real’ human factor that comes up in each and everyone of these cases. Pakistan is really bad, I agree. But we are no worse than many others at similar times.

    The proper thing is How Do We Change This. Education is one (and I don’t mean only Schooling or College but all forms of Education). TV and Media are other ways. Plays are another. It’ll take years, but this has to be done if we want an ideal world.Recommend

  • Zap
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:29AM

    Its unfortunate but true not only for pakistan but the entire Indian subcontinent that the people of this region possess a mentality that glorifies violence and pays a heroic homage to brutal justice. This should be a wake up call for everyone in this region to not be swayed by blind emotions which results in the death of the legal system, morality and social structure.Recommend

  • Amna Zaman
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:37AM

    @hamood. I would agree with u. A bunch of un civilized people being collected in a beautiful piece of land and now they destroy this with feudal system and violence in the country. No wonder the terrorist feel confident over the civilians.Recommend

  • Noor
    Aug 25, 2010 - 12:19PM

    Condemn the content not the WRITER.The reality of our problem is that we find fault with everyone whether the speak right or wrong.. GET OFF YOUR HIGH HORSES people.. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 12:25PM

    This intolerance, barbarism, hatred and street anger has been instilled into the minds of the general public for decades by our own clergy. Almost every mosque has multiple sermons every year on we hate USA, Ahmadis, Christians, dictators, blasphemers, apostates, Shias, Barelvis etc. Is this how the Holy Prophet(saw) delivered his sermons? The tragedy is that the government has given these mullahs free reign and at times actively help them in their ‘spread of hatred’. The cases in point being the infamous ‘anti-Ahmadiyya laws’ of Pakistan and the declaration of being a Muslim when filling out passport. Every ‘Muslim’ Pakistani is forced to insult a person revered by millions around the world and declare their followers as non-Mulsims. Imagine if the passport filling form of UK or USA contained a statement of and with God forbid a denouncement of Prophet Muhammad(saw). This is what Pakistan is teaching the world. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 12:56PM

    I am shocked too – at George Fulton about his trying to set himself apart from the rest in claiming they are trying to ‘out condemn one another over the senseless killings.’

    Let me tell you how he is no different.

    “We are, and have always been, a barbaric, degenerate nation revelling in bloodlust,” claimed Fullton before presenting the evidence in form of a tale of million men butchery.

    Now, first, there goes out through the window his assertion about himself being different on ‘out condemning’ others. Also, that is because his presentation in the foregoing sentence is nothing short of misrepresentation.

    The ‘barbaric, degenerate nation’ Fulton mentions actually represents only one part ‘we’ and five part those whom we gained separation from ‘during a bloody partition.’

    Therefore, in Fulton’s statement, “Our nation was forged during a bloody partition — in which up to one million people were massacred,” is obviously not where the problem started because we were on the ‘massacred’ end of the affair.

    If the author wants to help his readers trace the reasoning to today’s waive of barbarism, why people have grown insensitive to death and destruction, why people make open calls to kill Ahmadis, or why nearly 100 Ahmadi’s were massacred in Lahore on May 28, he needs to start with the first victory of mullah-ism through a certain resolution adopted on March 12, 1949 within only a few month of Jinnah’s untimely death.

    Mr. Fulton can then guide the search forward to 1953’s anti-Ahmadiyya riots and mullah’s hand therein and through the 1955 Munir Inquiry report, to 1974 where a democratically elected leader’s cowardliness and self-serving efforts was on display and an illiterate nation stood by in making mockery of the constitution and of the Islamic principle. Some say the efforts bought him three extra months in power.

    Next, Mr. Fulton can bring up the 1984’s dictator who was hell-bent on pleasing a particular Islamist extremist terrorists’ party and was responsible for the creation of Jehadi Taliban externally and strict anti-minority blasphemy laws and anti-ahmadiyya laws internally. By the way Mr Fulton can have his readers estimate how many lives lost worldwide can be pinned to the existence of Taliban? A certain Islami jamat was most instrumental in that wonderful cause for Islam. If the name fits, wear it!.

    And finally, have them go in search of the several breeds of lice hanging around n the long beards of certain mullahs of today. You can easily spot them as they are usually seen on TV being addressed as ‘Ulma-e Kara’am’.

    Now, this would certainly set the record right.Recommend

  • abdul
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:01PM

    Dear george,
    am so pleased by your article and great words.the pakistan youths is the worst youth i have seen in the entire world,they never shun evil but always support evil.they never stand up for good or truth but always love to spread hatred and wickedness and not ready to learn from other country but always claiming to know it all when they know nothing.
    what is the work of our parents at home?they are not properly brought up the kids in good behaviour,so when they grew up they start misbehaving.i used to see the same situation like saikot each day in street of pakistan.our religious leaders here are busy preaching and planting hatred in the heart of our people here,ready to blame goverment in everything or west.pakistan need change from our religion and home.Recommend

  • Ilmana Fasih
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:01PM

    Quite unfortunate,a lot of truth but a bit of exaggeration too.
    The west first went through the dark ages and then came the renaissance.For us Muslims (not just in Pakistan but world over),we began with an awakening and then went into a deep sleep and continue to do so.Recommend

  • FezaKhanYusufzai
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:17PM

    Lord of the flies indeed, only worst.Recommend

  • Dan S
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:17PM

    Your hand is a part of your body like every other part of your body. Just like that a group of a few hundred people( i say again ) a group of few hundred people represent us pakistanis as a whole! Sialkot lyniching wasnt a one man show or a two man show or for that matter a 10 man show, it was a crowd of scores and more which represent the average pakistani. What happened in Sialkot is tragic, it is sad, it is inhumane and it is a representation of us, you and me and every other person who is from the Great Pakistan . SO lets for a change accept that we have faults, so lets for a change put our good for nothing pride and ego aside and accept what we are, realization is what we need.
    So whats wrong with a british pakistani telling you what we really are? he isnt wrong or is he? it is this very ignorant attitude that we have had for the past 60 odd years that we are here.
    Fasi and George are doing the very right thing. We need this character bashing in as harsh words as we can coz we are a nation whos “dheet” , who is sleeping under the illusion that we are a sleeping giant when in reality we are nothing even close to it.

    one of the readers commented that lynching is a part of history?? so is sex, so is drugs, so is prostituion, so is liqor? so what do we do, oh yeah lets make everything that was part of history legal and public? kuddos!! every nation makes is own history and we are making ours.

    anyother of my fellow readers said, not only ahmadis are killed everyone is killed?? so that justifies the killing of ahmadis??

    Rise before the water is above your neck, rise before its too late.

    P.S didnt find a solution above? you wont! coz you havent realized that there is something wrong with us.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 1:26PM

    Its a society of immoral hypocrities. Lal Masjid goons taking law into their hands, while the danda in the other hand, are the heroes of this herd but when the same culture of state within a state grows out of hand, they act all surprised.

    2 Ahmedis were killed in the same week as of Sialkot incident but none of the TV channels bother reporting it or making cue and cry of simialr scale for them. Were they lesser Pakistanis?

    Our society has been facing a gradual breakdown and we have reached a state where even our sympathies are selective.

    We might not be a failed state but are a failed socioety for sure.Recommend

  • Sumbul A
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:30PM

    what the nation fails to realize is the simple fact of tolerance. who gave anyone the right to touch let alone murder another individual? that too without knowing what the debate was actually about? and i haven’t read all the comments but I’m pretty sure some besides me too have thought about the fact that even if the uneducated masses were watching the so called justice what were those “educated journalists” doing gawking at the entire scene? their duty is to report but not at the expense of loosing their streak of humanity. y didn’t they step up???? also regarding your friend i hope he realizes the folly of his actions.
    an eye for an eye will only render the entire world blind and not do much good.Recommend

  • Imran Khan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:53PM

    In a purely Islamic and peaceful Republic, scenes such as this one (if not worse than this) would be sanctioned by court, i.e. the stoning of people to death. Recommend

  • F.Rajani
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:53PM

    I am disgusting by the comments that say Mr.Fulton has been in this country for a short period of time, and therefore has no right to comment. To those who agree with this, I would like to say:

    Don’t you get it? Our country is such a mess, that a man doesnt have to live here very long to identify the wrongdoings of our people. Hats off to him for bothering to write about it and getting us to take notice of the core issue.

    Instead of accusing him of doing something wrong, please understand what he is saying. What difference does it make, where he is from and how long he has been in Pakistan for? He’s giving you food for thought. Just be intellectual for once and accept your fault.Recommend

  • Zafar
    Aug 25, 2010 - 1:54PM

    George dont blame whole Pakistan Culture ,Religion or People of Pakistan by the acts of few. In History British people have done alot more hideous and brutal public killings but back then there was no camera footage so please act little mature and dont blame whole nation for what few illiterates did on that day in Sialkot . I personally know people going to the house of the brothers and sharing there pain with there family. Alot of the youth is channelized after that event to bring justice as soon as possible for these two brothers they dont even knew. Thats a nation which showing signs of purity and belief . I am really disappointed by your article and sorry to say that your have not dont your home work on it.Recommend

  • AK
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:04PM

    does it really matter who says it? i mean so what the writer has been in pakistan for a couple of years. i am a pakistan and i have been away from pakistan for a long time and i recently returned, and i share the same sentiments. these are views oof every common man and woman of pakistan, wether they’re a foreigner or a national it doesn’t matter. we have pakistani immigrants in britian who are vocal about matters there, no one tells them they cant speak out cause they’re immigrants. Recommend

  • Saleha Khan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:10PM

    Mentioning “The Lord of the Flies” just sums up the article, and what we are!!! Recommend

  • Munazza
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:10PM

    Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. And it never will be!

    well George, who are you to tell us at what Pakistan will ever will be! the guy Kashif and LC are fairly right in all that they say! have you ever wondered what sort of nation are you from! good and bad time come on all nations and we have seen barbarity in all cultures including your british culture to be one of the most barbaric of its times! what is your problem and who are you to tell us what will become of Pakistan in future? anyway. id like to suggest to you that despite trying to demean us, you should do something to help us, and if you cant you’re not needed here!

    the killing in sialkot is a brutally criminal act, ad many facts you state about the Punjabi movie macho culture were right, but you have no right trying to rid us of the hope we still have and we will foster inshaAllah! please engage your brain in some constructive activity, or at-least try to use a constructive tone if you wish to help us, we dunt want your british bias here!Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 2:16PM

    And again, excellent stuff!Recommend

  • Manoj
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:16PM

    One persons crime does not make whole nation or community the criminal. But at the same time, I feel countries like Pakistan, which was founding idealogy was based on the hatered against a particular coumunity, needs to relook the whole idealogy. It can potry itself a separate nation, without instilling poison of hatered in young mind.It can find many more bonding glue for it’s citizen, to replace hatered, because once hate becomes core value, it creates many more basket people to be hated, may be in the name of religion, language, geogarphy, sect, subsect etc. Pakistan lost Bangaldesh because it’s people thought bengali inferior and hated them. They fought three wars with india, because they Hindus. Objective teaching of History to young may correct many ills of Pakistani social fabric.Recommend

  • Munazza
    Aug 25, 2010 - 2:24PM


    well Kashif is not denying what happened in sialkot, I think you have a problem with your understanding in what is being said, probably blinded by bias and prejudice towards pakistan, how very british! you’re seemingly more intolerant out here! cant even take the truth about your own british culture of ‘robbing off’ other nations of their resources for centuries! about the english language thing you say, we dunt speak it for the love of it! and no one in the world does for that sake! it is your ancestors who went round the whole world on the loot rampage and introduced it to the locals, and it has thus become a communication tool as it is widely understood in the world! so nevermind, and dunt get confused by any superiority complexes that you british tend to have historically!Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 2:59PM

    Much of the content of your article is unfortunately true, but to write such a piece when millions of Pakistanis are homeless and drowning shows a huge lack of sensitivity. Could you not have held yr tongue a while?Recommend

  • hadia Khan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:15PM

    I am 43 years old and have always lived in Pakistan. Does that give me the right wholly and solely to criticize Pakistan? Do we not spend hours criticizing how the western countries have destroyed us, how immoral they are and the best one “un ki han to koi values hi nahi hain”!!! And then comes George, this gora, who tells us “here is a mirror, please have a look and identify your faults” and all hell breaks loose!! How dare this gora, who has only been here for 5 odd years, judge us!!! We are this pure nation, with not a blemish on our record…..well wake up fellow Paki’s….we are covered in blemishes!!! Read the newspaper and you will come across the most atrocious stories about crimes, corruption, rape, molestation. True it happens in the rest of the world but this kind of brutality is mostly witnessed in failed states like ours!!! Listen to criticism please!! These should be taken as opportunities to build ourselves as a nation. From articles like this one, I have learnt that it will be my life’s mission to ensure that every child in Pakistan should be taught, as a separate subject, human rights. What have you learnt?

    And for all of you out there disrespecting George, read this piece.
    Since it’s written by a pure blood Pakistani, your sensibility will be less hurt.’s-human-cockroaches/Recommend

  • Adarsh
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:19PM

    I understand your viewpoint; but I have a few observations on your piece, which I would like to share. The shock horror expressed by so many is necessary, it shows that we still have some humanity left. It is when we stop being appalled by these things, that’s when we should worry. Apportioning part of the blame to illiteracy and poverty is also not wholly incorrect. Granted literacy does not necessarily lead to principles of decency or ethics. It does however reduce occurrences of such heinous atrocities. Literacy promotes reasoning and rationality, thus giving a person an added variety of options rather than reacting with brut force or primal instinct.
    Similarly poverty cannot be overlooked as a contributing factor. Self actualisation and the will to make ones self a better human being are all philosophies of the full stomach. When the daily trials and tribulations of acquiring sustenance and providing security for ones family are immensely difficult, thoughts of mercy and goodwill to mankind are not top of the list. Rather the daily frustrations slowly build up to a virtual ticking bomb.
    The breakdown of social contract between state and individual is not so much the absence of governance as it is the absence of hope; the latter being far more dangerous. It is the realisation that nobody cares and by extension nobody is going to make it better. Like an orphan you must look out for yourself because it’s a dog eat dog world and only the meanest rottweiler is going to survive.
    As for our past, some have commented that it was the British divide and rule tactics that lead to the massacres. Others have pointed out to the past atrocities of the now proud nations. The violence towards the African American in USA and the brutality meted out to the Northern Irish by the British are a part of history. The difference is, these nations have put behind them those dark days whereas we are going through ours. Whatever the reasons for our sadistic past, the outcry over this incident just might be a sign of our evolution.
    I have already touched upon the brutal marginalisation of minorities at the hands of the public in now progressive nations. As for the Bhuttos, they weren’t killed by a mob rather they were murdered against the will of the mob.
    If violence in cinema was the primary catalyst in inspiring people to acts of the same, then Japan would be a bloody graveyard. Revenge action films are a popular genre in all countries. Remember “Death Wish”. Maybe Quentin Tarantino should be put behind bars for instigating violence.
    Where there is an evil deed of burying women in Balochistan there is an equally gut wrenching act of the French woman who suffocated and buried nine of her newborns. For every venom spewing Aamir Liaquat there is an evangelist preacher or Rabbi churning out his own brand of poison. In the same way for every Ahmadi executed here there is a Roma person torched in Europe. The difference is that the people in those countries are shocked and surprised by such acts and thus are driven to remonstration. Isn’t that what we are doing here, now?Recommend

  • Rafiq
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:29PM

    Very well said, and very true, keep it coming George …Recommend

  • Niddah Samih Virk
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:32PM

    very good… the truth speaks out… this, what happened, is nothing new… it’s our blood ‘n when it cames out, ‘n the whole world make an issue of that.. then v say, that it’s wrong…Recommend

  • Umer Farooq Baloch
    Aug 25, 2010 - 3:49PM

    Unfortunately i cannot deny what you have said George(otherwise we are in the state of denial),
    let me add one more thing here; These natural catastrophes like earthquakes, floods, avalanches, cyclones etc are reactions of our own deeds. It is the unhappiness of God(quite sure of that!) and may i ask you people that were we send here to remain inhumane for years? though we are taught as the Semites what responsibilities we have to adhere with.
    Think Again.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 3:53PM

    SOOO awesome Recommend

  • tughral
    Aug 25, 2010 - 4:04PM

    Good article George! And spot on as well.

    To all those trying to make excuses again about the rot in our national character: just shut up. Please. im fed up of hearing “we are not all like this” “dont generalize” etc etc. Havent you been following the news? This country has gone to the dogs in the last few years.. literally! Violence, suicide bombings and decapitations, gang rapes as forms of communal justice, indiscrimiate killings on ethinic lines in karachi and quetta, a thoroughly corrupt and bigoted population and illiterate clerics.. for Gods sake when do you plan to wake up and accept we’ve screwed it up royally as a nation?? WE.. not zardari.. not zia ul haq.. not anyone.. but EVERYONE. all of us.

    however its not enough to sit here and whine and moan. This is my objection with George’s article as well. We need a way forward.. to fix this mess and make sure it doesnt happen again. The question is how? first step though is admiting we have a problem to begin with. Now whats step two…?Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 4:28PM

    Very nice, George I am your fan … mmm .. pedestal fanRecommend

  • Ali babar
    Aug 25, 2010 - 4:50PM

    I think its fantastic that something like this got reported. I hope more and more of the masses get cellphones with video capture capability so that we can expose more of the disgusting crimes that occur every day. Cheap, readily available technology like this together with the spread of privately run satellite channels appears to be one of our few remaining hopes to combat the 100 odd families who run this country like a child’s play ground.

    Somehwere in Pakistan there is a great leader to inspire this country out of darkness. I wish he finds himself.Recommend

  • Arsalan J. Sheikh
    Aug 25, 2010 - 4:58PM

    George’s point of view is difficult to digest, but inevitable to accept for any rational Pakistani. There are savages in every nation, and a savage in all of us. The question is what institutions have we put to guard against the maddening howls of savagery that arise from within us? Are they strong enough to reign in our worst impulses?

    Sadly, such constraints and institutions can only be held in place by those with a fundamental foundation of legitimacy and authority. Our recent savage outbursts are only the most recent symptoms of a long-drawn out disease. The disease is the failure to find a stable formula for governing and ruling ourselves in line with the best interest of the public.

    Till we solve that problem, be prepared for more Sialkot incidents.Recommend

  • Saad Khan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:03PM

    George what’s the point in writing this article? The people you are addressing on this forum are completely aware of this act of brutality. No one is condoning it – There is only condemnation. Why don’t you step out on the streets of Sialkot and take your lecture to those who were involved in this crime. Or have you also converted to the arm-chair Pakistani concerned citizen? If you feel that your article will galvanize the readers of Express Tribune to lead a revolution and change Pakistan – perhaps you need to find another way. Meanwhile. give Pakistan a break – It deserves it and give yourself a break too – Take a vacation.
    Saad KhanRecommend

  • fatima
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:41PM

    I do not agree. this might b a way of looking at it. it is not the mater of being surprised. it is time to wake up for every one. if u look at the world history,these things happen where ever ppl r left with out guidance , knowledge, and most of all without law enforcement. people doing things without realizing its implications and impacts,is called ignorance . only thing in the world that can save us and our nation is EDUCATION and a true leadership otherwise we will remain like misguided missiles.As we say in urdu “shutar-e-bay muhar”.that can only bring destruction.Recommend

  • Nasir
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:49PM

    @ Nicheoflights : Very Nice optimism in acerbic truth Recommend

  • Faizan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 5:57PM

    Great Article! I say make George the Prime Minister / President of Pakistan! Bring back the good old days of the British Raj. On a serious note, I think he is more Pakistani than many of our politicians and sons / daughters of politiciansRecommend

  • sana
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:02PM

    we’re barbaric cuz we made maula jatt? seriously, dude. way to offend multiple sensibilities in george ka pakistan.Recommend

  • A Bashir
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:04PM

    Its amazing that after a few years of living in Pakistan you call yourself as one of “us”. Please dont bother… we have too many problems of our own and dont need to add you on to our plate of issues. Yes, we are a tribal nation who live in within our cultural bounds and value which people like you call barbaric, outdated and shameful ( and I agree), however we are a compassionate people and do a lot of good too. People like you never come forward and say something nice about Pakistan, because it doesnt sell…so to sell yourslef you just throw slurs at Pakistan. I totally agree that what happened in Sialkot is unpardonable, but to say that we are all like that??? is it fair? I find your peice to be extremely racist.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 6:18PM

    One of my friend was killed in London by some racist Britishers. They killed him with hockey sticks. So should I raise my finger on all Britishers?Recommend

  • 17 year old youth
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:24PM

    I don’t think George wrote the article with malicious intentions; more as an eye-opener or perhaps even a channel to vent. So for people to say that he is a foreigner and is no one to judge the goings on in Pakistan merely proves his point that we as a nation lack tolerance. Having said that, however, I do think the last paragraph was a little too salient in it’s condescension and the rather despondent (somewhat holier than thou?) tone that suggests that Pakistan is broken beyond repair. To pass such a grave statement is not really fair to the nation. I think there is still hope. It’s just up to us to actually get up and do something – rather than updating our facebook statuses and commenting on this article.
    P.S. Loved the LOTF reference. That was at the back of my mind throughout the article – before I read it. Though, that does not mean I condone it. I still think your last paragraph was far too extreme and border-line rude. Recommend

  • ahmad
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:25PM

    Some replies to this article suggest George is new and has no idea of our society. But we all know deep inside our hearts he is right. has everyone seen the youtube video? how can we defend ourselves??!!! We are not peaceful or islamic or civilzed. Shame on us. Recommend

  • Sahar Niazi
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:35PM

    It is easy to stand back and judge us and say brutality is our national charecter. It most certainly is not.What human society had not been cruel and unjust? One just has to refer to world history to site examples of similar brutality. The day we stop acting surprised when someone is senselessly murdered that is the day we stop calling ourselves human.Recommend

  • hakeem
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:40PM

    We are no match to the commonly existing humility and humanity in the societies of the world but things are changing and will further change if litrary circles keep writing like this in loath of voilance.Recommend

  • Arif Khan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:42PM

    very well executed- ‘we’ needed to hear this and we, unfortunately, knew this all along. The DENIAL has to go and reality needs to be embraced. We are, no doubt, a monstrous ethinic group with no prosperous outlook on life. we are a joke!Recommend

  • Aisha
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:47PM

    Well said George.We as a NATION need to wake up..Its about time.Recommend

  • kk
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:57PM

    I don’t question George’s desire to integrate into a society which is rife with violence, corruption and extremism. Yet, its a welcoming, charitable and hospitable society. Or you wouldn’t be there Georgie ! No one is holding a gun to your head, or are they?

    Yet, as an outsider I’d be careful NOT to blame or criticize the nation as a whole. Its silly to say we r genetically inclined to bloodshed or any such nonsense. This was an exception, NOT an everyday occurrence. It is rightly being condemned. Also agree with many who have commented that its time for solutions not further ctiticism.
    The present government and the level of corruption does play a part in this unfortunate incident. The common man is frustrated, hungry and thus angry. Mob lynching is pathetic yet the entire world is guilty of such heinous crimes at some point. Here in the USA serial killers are mere messed up individual. But to generalize and say its their culture, their history and in their blood would be unfair. Or the racial killing in Britain of young teenagers ….or going back in time and the Salem witch hunt.
    Can pull out many many incidents from every nation which will shame the socks off their citizens. Cannot paint the entire nation with the same brush. NO fair !!! Also consider the literacy level.
    We r NOT a bad people just going thru a BAD time. Majority of us condemn such unfortunate incidents. The stupid crowd (herd mentality) was made to think these poor kids were robbers and murderers. I am not trying to justify the barbaric n sadistic bystanders and in my mind as responsible as the ones wielding the blows BUT its lack of law n justice which led to it…NOT some stupid notion that Pakistanis love gore and violence.Recommend

  • Muhammad Osman
    Aug 25, 2010 - 6:58PM

    George, I couldn’t agree to you more on the idea presented that we have always been like this. Such incidents have always occured in the past, but the only difference is the media coverage this incident got and that has been the main reason for the violent response from the general public. As for our qualifications of entertainment, yes that plays a vital role as well since we tend to act according to what we see, and if this is what we are seeing then our acts are a direct mirror-image of what we see. When things like this happen and the Sialkot incident being just one of the many incidents that have taken place (somehow not reported to the common man), we still wonder why we dont progress as a nation or as a society. Social progress requires you to stand up as united and not act as a least-bothered video-recording spectator who watches teenagers die being killed in the most inhumane fashion. Much to think about guys.Recommend

  • Saad Chaudhry
    Aug 25, 2010 - 7:48PM

    Our nation was forged during a bloody partition” Are most modern nations not formed under the same conditions? Was the American war of independence led by Gandhi-like leaders achieving freedom via hunger-strikes?

    “And the rockets’ red glare, the bombs bursting in air, gave proof through the night, that our flag was still there.” I doubt strongly that our national anthem is referring to fireworks when speaking of rockets and bombs.

    Face it George, infant nations are forged into more mature and stable ones through turmoil, violence, and war. That’s the call of the times, as unfortunate as it may be.

    Yes, incidents like this occur again and again (and most go unnoticed) in Pakistan… but the fact that every once in a while people can look at themselves and become horrified of what happens within the country tells us that humanity yet remains within those borders. It tells us that even though some may stray, they are not completely lost. That one day, if they try hard enough, they may just be able to pull themselves out of this downward spiral.Recommend

  • Hamid Ahmed Khan.
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:00PM

    Even though some of the references made were rather hollow and out of context [ Maula Jatt ? I could give you a whole list of extremely popular western movies with much more horrific action ], and given the fact that it’s coming from a hard to accept Pakistani. It’s not so much of you coming to live in Pakistan, more the mode through which. Maybe if there were a sequel to George ka Pakistan, in which you actually did something positive about the country moving forward, it would be somewhat sensible to see you thrashing Pakistan’s history and culture. Anyway, in spite of that, the gist of it makes sense. We are numb, and it’s best to use incidents such as this as a wake up call, rather than blame it on our history as a nation.Recommend

  • ayesha
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:01PM

    i agree with things written here but no one ever suggests a solution??? or for that matter do anything. we are good at protesting by words, joining groups on facebook etc etc but never do anything practically. if by luck anyone stands up to such people, he/she is threatened, their relatives are either injured or even killed. we need SENSIBLE taliban style people who would not kill every other person but only the few (70%) who do such things as done at sialkot or we should become a colony of a stable, strong coutry ;) because WE ARE USELESS and we need help, no offense to anyone.Recommend

  • Khurram
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:08PM

    Sialkot Incident was indeed should have had happened and it did made everyone in the country sad.but u said Pakistani nation enjoys is nowhere to be true.Hollywood shows maximum violence.There are many websites from USA and Russia which only show these gore videos and generates lots of traffic from the same countries.What does Pakistani ideology has to do with this?

    You go and watch “three guys one hammer” video(the most gruesome ever video on internet of a murder of a russian).and label the whole russian Nation as wolves. Recommend

  • R Ahmed
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:15PM

    This article in essence articulates my feelings from A to Z. And I am a Pakistani who is familiar with the history of the country. Most of the responses to this article attempt on shifting the blame and are typical of “we are not the only people capable of this, this also happens/has happened elsewhere”, but no one else claims to be the flag bearers of Islam as much as we do. @ LC – this is not George insulting Pakistan, this is us insulting humanity and in the process betraying Pakistan and the reason for which it was made. Have you forgotten the burying of women in Baluchistan or the daily grind of peasents’ life on the feudal society we live in? We are being shown our faces and they are so ugly that we blame it on the mirror.Recommend

  • Mrs Khattak
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:21PM

    I must say George what you have stated about mob killings is true. What I cannot agree with is you talking for the people of Pakistan. Granted, you have made Pakistan your home, and well done to you for taking on the culture. The truth of the matter is these ‘mobs’ are BRED to be that way. Pakistan as a country does not breed them to be these backward trailer trash people-their parents do-just like many parents raise their children in England to favour the BNP/NF. Do you see where the line becomes blurry?
    Pakistan, like England has issues. The weird thing is there are many countries in the world with barbaric acts like mob killings going on yet it’s easier to cover Pakistan because the uneducated support what their ancestors supported. What about all the barbaric acts that happen in China? What about Iran? What about what is happening to the minority hispanics in certain areas of America? Noone seems to associate their crimes with their culture because it is not their culture-it’s the signs of a misspent youth and no education.
    Mob related murders George are no more a part of Pakistani culture than teen pregnancies in England-both are in the minority yet get so much publicity and we are led to believe they are the norm. Biryani isn’t the rice dish I would connect to Pakistan-and loadshedding is a government policy issue.
    If Pakistanis start accepting this as a part of being Pakistani/the culture we might as well auction off Pakistan to the highest bidder on ebay and get it over and done with now.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 8:22PM

    Five Fingers are never the same, for this you can’t blame all Pakistanis in one say neither this is due to bloody partition of Pakistan. Possible Strong reasons for this violent behavior is:
    1-No justice in the society
    2-Corruption, Poverty, Multiple standards
    3-Presenting religion in a wrong way (all the religions)
    4-Harebrained people, confused b/w religion,ethics & the world
    5-bloodshed the country is covered in, more than 9 years now.Recommend

  • Wasio Ali Khan Abbasi
    Aug 25, 2010 - 8:44PM

    Nations fall when the leaders become vision-less and the people have no idea where things lead. We as a nation had, unfortunately, very few visionaries. In fact, apart from Mr. Bhutto, there hasn’t been any visionary leader in Pakistan since Jinnah’s death.

    The only way for the people to recover and take back control of their country is by accepting reality. Once you start accepting reality, only then will you decide for the future of your country. George is right, we as a nation loves barbarity. There are cases within the rural sectors of society which are mind-boggling. There is one in which a feud is between two families since last 40 years when a goat of one person had entered the house of another. Arguments broke out, fights took place and people got killed. Nearly 50 people had died in various clashes between the two families in last 40 years.

    Then again there is a blood feud between another two families whose members had gone to Dubai and while returning, an argument broke out over 1 Dirham … ONE DIRHAM … and the ensuing fight resulted in death of one member. Ever since then, there has been bloody battles claiming innocent lives between families.

    It is not shocking to know the human rights situation in Pakistan and the murder of two boys is just one of many that happens. During Musharraf’s era the police were expressly forbidden to register cases of “Burn Victims” (acid thrown that resulted in victim suffering burns) just so that Pakistan’s Human Rights report would show a decline in such incidents.

    They never declined … they were just not brought to notice.

    When lawyers movement took place, the pessimists at urban centers with no vision for the country (particularly those in Karachi) were critical of this movement, citing flimsiest reasons such as “A mother couldn’t get her son bailed because there was no lawyer or judge”, conveniently forgetting that 100s of mothers and fathers and sisters and brothers were in tears when, despite the presence of top judges and lawyers, their loved ones were no where to be found (read: the missing people).

    The lawyers had realized the dire needs of that time. They had seen the destruction that was taking place of the judicial system that had started to recover from a point of being an Army slave to a more independent pillar of nation. This lead to a collective movement and thus the successful restoration of judiciary.

    If we go back to history, the creation of Pakistan was also because of realizing the need. The Muslims of India had realized that the inter-faith differences between Muslims and Hindus will not result in peaceful settlement. Only after this realization did Muslims understood the importance of a separate homeland and finally the resulting movement lead to the creation of Pakistan.

    In the same way, unless the people of Pakistan open up to the reality around them, get out of the dreamy lives they are trying to live, leave the cocoon of urban comfort and go and see what’s really happening in towns and villages, not in some other part of the country but within the same province they live, the reality will speak for itself.

    Only then will the humanity will start to rise back into the spines and hearts of Pakistanis.Recommend

  • Ahsan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:12PM

    either you have written this out of desperation and true sadness for Pakistan or its another of the drawing room vibes over a cup of coffee you refer to in your own article. In either case the tone is too sarcastic and I am sorry I don’t agree to it.

    We are not a nation as you suggest we are, we are dominated by a mob who acts like that, the mob that won’t read these articles and won’t be affected by it. The lesser minority of us needs to stay focussed and positive and do whatever little we can to stay as close to the path as possible and thats our only chance of recovery.

    The response to sialkot incident is a glimpse of hope that not all is lost. The massacres you refer to at partition are a bitter reality but nonetheless it was the brave movement led by Jinnah that led to us being Pakistanis and though the mob spoiled the victory then we should never forget true Pakistanis have existed and will exist and one day will throw out these mobs and their mentality. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 9:26PM

    oh oh oh wait a second there George! let’s take things a bit slow here. First off, I am a great fan of yours and I think your article ‘we are the problem’ was a master piece. Now coming back to this one, I must say I am disappointed and I am sure all Pakistanis who have some self-respect will be.

    One incident forced you to declare that the Islamic Republic can never be a peaceful state. Can I just for a second just for the sake of argument bring in a western nation here?

    What about the United States? Do you think given the enormous power it carries on its shoulders, it can ever be a peaceful nation or let others remain peaceful? Forget the US, what about Israel?

    In every nation, unfortunate incidents happen. You can not use a particular incident to decide its fate! you can say our country has always been this way and you might be right, but you can not determine our future. We are the architects of our future and if we right the wrongs in Pakistan, I don’t see it not being a peaceful state.

    Here two brothers are brutally murdered and you start bashing my country. When Israelis kill thousands of innocent civilians in Gaza in front of the world, no one says anything! where is justice?

    Why is only my country being left for such words. We do have problems and we do need to fix them but that doesn’t mean my country can never be peaceful. You can’t take away hope from our people! That’s one of the few things the people of this country are left with! Recommend

  • Asim
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:48PM

    I would really not agree. I strongly condemn this article which call us a barbaric nation. Are we barbaric? we are really not barbaric at all. WE ARE MUCH LESS BARBARIC THAN MOST OF THE DEVELOPED COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD. Just take example of europe. Was Hitler a Pakistani? Is Israel part of Pakistan who crushed 100s of thousands of childern and women? Is Pakistan providing weapons to Israel? Did pakistan went to kill millions of innocent childern and women in Iraq and Afghanistan and bombarded wedding parties? Did Pakistan use atomic bombs? Is pakistan responsible for racial violences in America? Is there any developed and the so called civilized country whose history is better than that of pakistan. how can george forget all the really barbarism of the west.Recommend

  • Mohammad Farhan Riaz
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:53PM

    Well I agree that as a nation we have lots of shortcomings, but I would request MR. George to self reflect just a little bit when he is referring to the Maula Jutt thingy,(I am not at all justifying that cheap violent B grade movie)
    But What about the fact that Gore Movies like SAW are doing so well with crazy enough response from the box office to produce 6 sequels of it.What does that say about the western taste???Recommend

  • Bahram
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:54PM

    gorgee i cudnt disagree with u more … !Recommend

  • salutations
    Aug 25, 2010 - 9:55PM

    Thank you Mr. Tauseef Khan, very very well said. I appreciate your sentiments.Recommend

  • A Pakistani
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:01PM

    George you need to be careful because these ‘Pakistani’s’ who are questioning and condemning you for writing something which is an absolute truth are the reason we are what we are today… Let me ask all my fellow countrymen if this article was written by someone who was born and bred here would your reaction still be the same… I think not.. Its just because George is a ‘gora’ and he so rightly pointed out our barbaric nature thus the condemnation… Stop it you all, Because what you are doing is exactly what George has written about.. We are a bunch of barbarians who have no place for tolerance…Recommend

  • Rizwan
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:06PM

    well I can only say “little knowledge is dangerous” go and read the history of all nations, what happened when christopher columbus invade America, or what happened with jews in world war and what they are doing in Palestine from past 60 years. Atom bomb on japan was just an experiment? what happened in Vietnam, what happened in Gujrat (India) i think in 2006. Go and search how hindu students treats muslims students in small cities of India, you will see same kind of footages.
    We all are ashamed of what happened in our country but get you facts right and try to write with open perspective. Recommend

  • Nisar
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:06PM

    I have problems with this article for producing such a misleading & vested conclusion from such a brutal & unfortunate incident based on the following points
    – Partition was mishandled by the British causing India & Pakistan fighting & losing lives ever after
    – No one is happy over the incident, every one of us is disturbed over it thus showing that we dont like it as a nation so please do not insult us
    – Using Punjabi movies & inferring that we like violence is very naive on your part, what do you think of Bollywood & Hollywood movies, WWF Wrestling…… do they promote something different
    – When we are hit by any terrorist, we are equally hurt & sad over the losses regardless of the faith or belief of victims( last year we lost more than 3500 people in Pakistan & a huge majority of them were people from main stream faith)……and we were equally sad for the killing of Ahmadis…..You please do not add salt to their wounds!!!!
    – What do you say of the trigger happy CIA drone operators, they have killed more than 700 innocent people in our country….are they barbaric… that Ok with you
    – We cant claim that we dont have problems in our country, and you are not helping by creating such a passimistic view using this incident…..

    Please spread some positiveness because such a message will only make us more negative, thank you!Recommend

  • saad
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:10PM

    Either you are a not aware of the facts or you are trying to distort the facts and i think it the 2nd case. and excuse me, “we ARE”! after your this article i don’t its “WE”, it YOU only not US. I am not blinded by my nations love neither i do ignore the problems and bad things of my nation. i do think about it everyday that is why i exactly know what your motive is. how can you put sialkot case and partition cases in the same bucket. Bad people were always there every where and all the time in UR UK at the moment as well. and here i can easily see that you are noway pointing out the bad social situation of Pakistani nation, you are trying to degrade and demotivate people and spreading hopeless. this is what exactly your this means. so get a life, and dont think that WE Pakistani people dont understand your words exactly. Recommend

  • saad
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:17PM

    This incident is an eyeopener for us where do we stand socially. we are in a very horible stage where an innocent person is being killed in front of many people and NONE tried to stop anything. no-one can be socially more worst than that. we have to look at the causes and how can we improve our social culture. But the way George you painted it, you should be ashamed of yourself. I no-way better than those people who are spreading hopless within our NATION. and please don’t think you are one of us as your words and your lack of knowledge depicts.Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 10:18PM

    And Faizan Sb, go fly a kite or do something better than bloody well suggesting that George should be appointed the Prime Minister! He may be more pakistani than you are!Recommend

  • cerminizay
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:28PM

    George I’m glad u wrote this article because articles like this unite us Pakistanis together. i wonder if you have an identity because you opted to live in a barbaric nation yourself. we are as loving and as caring as you will find any people anywhere in the world. labeling criminals as “Muslims” and “Pakistanis” is very easy. let us reflect and research on how many nations and how many religions and which countries never acted this barbarically and still don’t do??? weather it be a public killing, a domestic violence or an unjust sentence, where in the world is it not done to this day??? and as for being in your peaceful land Britain, a common man cannot walk the streets at night in fear for his life, fear of at least getting “brutally injured” would u not agree??? and if you are as intelligent as i take you for, you wrote this article on purpose to get people’s reactions.
    to condemn this act of violence and label the ones responsible for this as “criminals” and not muslims and pakistanis would be just as criminals are the same anywhere in the world, without a conscience and a soul as these men who beat these two innocent boys were. I, as a human being and a Pakistani citizen condemn these acts and don’t feel any “delight” on them.
    may their souls rest in peace ameen.Recommend

  • fatima
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:37PM

    well versed ending! “Pakistan is not the land of the pure — we r lord of the flies..
    call me conservative- but the course of events being witnessed especially in the last couple of months could be called Almighty,s vengeance on the nation who proudly founded it in His name, But miserably failed to make it a land of pure. Ruling elite alone is not to be blamed.
    y the naive bore the brunt of His avenge? – it is a warning, a signal for the unaffected to mend their ways.Those who are still unaffected should beg for his forgiveness and surrender before him, apart from managing the chaos in every possible way. Recommend

  • Aug 25, 2010 - 10:39PM

    Before we all forget, the incident came to limelight only when the Chief Justice of Pakistan took a suo moto notice.Recommend

  • Revolution
    Aug 25, 2010 - 10:41PM

    I dont agree with George at all. British and American films are filled with Violence and what not but they still attack on other countries dont they? so why do they call other countries TERRORISTS? Aren’t they are the real terrorists?

    Right now we need support of the people and i think this is the right time to bring an end to this barbarism forever and our so called writers are doing all this and not supporting the innocent kids. tsk tsk. No not all people are barbarians its the writers who are barbarians who doesnt support the Truth when it is needed.

    I want to which Writer has ever done anything to change Pakistan? sitting infront of this box and writing an article is not going to change anything.

    good day but your article is really bad and holds no value.Recommend

  • Mazna Abrar
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:07PM

    well written George… but as you just said we are just criticizing the system….even in your article you have criticized…we all are no different from those who stood their watching those brothers being beaten to death…Pakistan has given us an identity, if we cant say anything good about it we dont have the right to say anything bad about it even…i truly appreciate your concern about trying to bring in the change but not at the sake of saying bad things to MY country…YES our movies suck big time because of lack of education…and educating such a big lot of people is not an easy task….all the countries standing as super powers have had their bad times even…and im pretty sure Pakistan will flourish and its people will learn from their mistakes…lets not say anything to the name of our country at least it hurts =)….lets hope pray and try to bring in change by educating people….Recommend

  • Rameez
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:12PM

    Yet another reason things like this continue to happen is that we collectively delude ourselves into thinking that we are somehow better than the rest of the world, all the while wallowing in what is actually a sea of uncivilized backwardness. For example I remember reading an article by you yourself George- called ‘at least we aren’t dubai’ or something to that effect… Today you’ve used the entire blog to blast every aspect of our culture and lifestyle.
    Both articles actually have more In common than not. They are both expressions of an extreme reactionary opinion which is based in no part on any actual honest self reflection and contemplation. And as such are just forms of self gratification, which do more harm than good. Recommend

  • Ahmad Mirza
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:12PM

    George, I did not like a bit what you wrote about Pakistan in this article though you have shaken the pillars of logic by shedding light on this subject; but i will tell you one thing only, everyone knows what we people are capable of; after all the years of struggle no one has been able to form any system in PAkistan, we have not been able to utilise our resources; generate income from it and minimise the economic & trade deficit; which is also due to our internal weakness and permission from PAKISTANI’s to let external forces interfere in Pakistan. It has always been pure PAKISTANI to be UNPREDICTABLE. Which might be dangerous but keeps the enemies dissillusioned.


  • Aug 25, 2010 - 11:17PM

    OMG – another eye opener, Sad but True, each and every other word :( Recommend

  • waqas
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:23PM

    Gud Article on the whole..
    But the voice whch nation rose and protests which were made might help in stopping such incidents in future…
    But wat u said , incidents lyk it had been happening in past and da stuff u said aba nation is absltly right ..We really need to chnge ourselves.Recommend

  • Adnan jamali
    Aug 25, 2010 - 11:45PM


  • shafik
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:07AM

    excellent writing , true to the core most . I hope and wish the writer continue more often , depict the very true nature of the arab mediaval code ,which every one in this land of the fack pures surge for always .Recommend

  • AA
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:12AM

    I submit my support for George’s write-up. If nothing else, he is showing a mirror to the fact that religiosity does nothing to the development of the psyche of the nation, but culture does. All the efforts of Zia and his Islamic Pakistan has culminated into nothing but a savage and hardened heart society of present day Pakistanis. The religiosity of the Pakistani, massacred the culture of Pakistani, resulting in such a monster who is still out there spewing fire.Recommend

  • Ahad Jamil
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:39AM

    i found this article very harsh, u hv mentioned the brutality with which dat event took place but hw shrewdly u overshadowed the condemnation of the act which came from all the parts of the country.
    Secondly y r we blamed for being such barbarics on killing of two boys(note i am not justifying it), dun u remember wat happened in gujrat(india) where thousand of muslims were butchered and that was even worse than this, dont u remember wat europe and other so called civilizations had been doing, killing millions of people only 60 yrs back. than y it is dat when such events happen in pakistan dat we are highlighted so much.
    mr george i think every great nation pass through such conditions whetehr u look at the history of France or America, they were not what they are nw it took them hundred of years to be civilized. hw the hell did u call us barbaric only positioning on such events, wat abt America, Britian and her allies who has killed millions of muslims in Afghanistan and Iraq, so u ppl are barbaric not us, we are a frustrated set of a people, frustrated becoz of lack of leadership, lack of justice.
    sir i know my country is nt perfect and we need improvement in all the fields of life, but i beleive 1 day we will evolve as a great nation learning from the past, rising from ashes and will c in the eyes of the world and will say Yes WE R THE PAKISTANIS. that day i hope we are not civilzed as u ppl are nw.Recommend

  • Maryam mehtab
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:42AM

    “The Sialkot murders are as Pakistani as truck art, biryani and loadshedding.”

    Really George? You want to brand us all into eternal hopelessness just like that? You have been given a platform to reach so many people through your word and this is the best you can come up with? Some senseless bile about the whole country being worthless, barbaric and corrupt? Your citations of history are not wrong but the perspective is certainly one that saddens me. Not only do you make generalizations you also make it all as normal biryani and loadshedding. So you mean to say its acceptable? That the outrage makes no sense and we should all shake our heads and move on with our lives? Your callousness George, is beyond me. Perhaps as outrageous as that of the bystanders of the event.Recommend

  • Adil
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:42AM

    By the way If we can rush to western world ..n become a part of it in an instant..Similarly,George have evry right to say what ever he wants cause he is a national citizen of Pakistan.He is feeling the same pain n misery ..all he he wrote nothing but the truth…We r going to the times of stone ages…n Sorry to say this but we truly Deserve evrything which is happening with us .
    Quiet Frankly George i ll advice u to leave this part of the world n live ur life in much better n peacful envoirment.Recommend

  • IZ
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:51AM

    “This has always been an ugly reality of Pakistan and always will be

    Careful George, you’re slipping into racisim. While your general sentiment about the deep-rooted pathology in Pakistani culture may be on the money, please avoid essentialising.Recommend

  • cache
    Aug 26, 2010 - 1:08AM

    george, you look slim. Doing cardio?Recommend

  • Asad Rana
    Aug 26, 2010 - 1:18AM

    Dude you want to go back to history, listen to this. Alexander, kushans, hunz, white hunz, arianz, afghans, central Asians, Arabs, Persians, turks, British and Americans and few more masters of butchery came to the subcontinent and enjoyed their fair share of slaughter of the marathas, Bengali, Punjabi, Sindhi and so on. Modern nation and the followers of many religions used their weaponry to their maximum use.
    Pagans butchered Hindus, Muslims butchered Hindus, Hindus betrayed all, British Christians butchered Muslims with the help of Hindus, than came 1947 Hindus and Sikhs with the blessings of British butchered Muslims, Hindus and Bengali butchered biharis in east Pakistan Hindus butchered Christians in orrisa and other states recently and the point i am trying to make is that if there was no invasion of any type there was never going to be any killings UNDERSTAND DUDE?Recommend

  • Munazza
    Aug 26, 2010 - 1:19AM

    so all of you giving george a credit for all that he has said, with mixed truth and unwanted despair! why are you not out on streets? why are you sitting in your homes!? I dunt see people mobilize or strike back at such atrocities no matter in whatever city! the big thing is, it is easy to criticize a system, but it is very difficult and needs real effort to change it! so much for all of the lip service of all the ‘ashamed of themselves’ Pakistanis who believe that they have ‘barbaric’ blood according to george! I agree you are barbaric because you admit it & you have given in. it is because of all of such as you the system has gone perverse, all of us are responsible for it. mere sitting and commenting while such incidents go on, which is shameless and cowardly. come onto the streets and show us your ability to change the current state of affairs rather than demoralizing others who are working towards a hope and self-pitying yourselves!!!Recommend

  • Ali
    Aug 26, 2010 - 1:54AM

    Yes, I agree up to a certain point. We are in denial all times this is our biggest mistake we all are in lala land We chose the leaders who had robbed us blind and then they come to power The son goes to see President of United State with his dad where the country stake is on line But when some on writes about over wrong doings we all say you are not patriot. Putting your had in the sand will not make problems disappear or blame it to the person who wrote it If your house is not clean how will you clean your streetsRecommend

    Aug 26, 2010 - 2:21AM

    George, what makes you analysis worse than your movie reviews is the fact that you write your movie reviews after you have watched the whole movie while your unsubstantiated analysis of the Sialkot incident is based on hearsay and imagination. I would suggest a proper homework before writing teh column. Recommend

  • Furqan Ahmed
    Aug 26, 2010 - 2:27AM

    True but one thing that should be mentioned here is that you will find 90% of this brutality and extermist behaviours in our rural areas. Why is that so?? Because of the ignorance and Mulla dominance. You can also observe that most of the suicide bombers also belong to these rural areas. Villagers were thought to be innocent in the past but now the perception,atleast mine, is completely changed. You will find such a heartless community only in villages.Recommend

  • Siraj Khan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 2:45AM

    Greetings George
    This is your ex-neighbour in Galaxy. 10th floor

    I hope you Kiran and junior are well. I think in this article you have hit the nail on its head. This is straight talk. It would have been more effective if you had also given any pointers n how you think we could work our way out of the trenches. We are not a failed state but a state of failure, but surely all cannot be gloom and doom

    I know that our own Nero continues to fiddle while Rome burns and we are living in a gun culture and with trigger-happy people, but don’t you think we can get out from this mess by reinventing and reengineering ourselves, assuming we get better leadership.

    After all, its George ka Pakistan!Recommend

  • Waqas
    Aug 26, 2010 - 3:02AM

    George well done for pointing out the obvious. Dont listen to those who are quick to point out your english heritage.. You are a Pakistani and more than welcome to state the obvious.

    Yes we have to change and to change we have to start by accepting the responsiblity from national to individual level. As they say if you are not part of the solution you are the problem.Recommend

  • khan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 3:09AM

    Well i dont get the point. Even if we are a barbaric nation and even if our history talks about barbarism, does’nt mean that we have to be sitting ducks and witness such gruesome acts and not show any concerns or retaliate. We always disrespect and talk bad about our country without doing anything to make it a better and peaceful place to live for our childrens and grandchildren. Our youth being the most braggers and not caring about the future of pakistan, sitting in their drawing rooms and discusing the fate of pakistan isnt gona help us move farward, If we dont feel the pain of our country inside our hearts. So what the author is saying is that we have to accept that these things are happening for the past 60 years and we dont have to condemn these acts of brutality and to learn how to live with it? Well I reject your point of view sir cause being an ostrage wont help us out, The great west that we talk about and how evolved they are now as they were 50 years ago when they use to burn women alive for the suspicion of being a witch, well we are not the only barbaric nation after all. And Yes sir nations do evolve and violence suppressed when we learn from our mistakes rather than letting it go. Pakistan is our identity and our saviour we cant let it be in times of her greatest need.Recommend

  • sana
    Aug 26, 2010 - 3:45AM


  • saima adnan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:16AM

    George having just moved ot pakistan a few years ago has absolutley no right to direct such harsh rude insults towards the entire nation.All nations ahve shortcomings, we have ours, nobody is denying that,but we dont need useless articles like this.There is absolutley no positive outcome coming from such articles,thus there is no need for them.Instead ppl shud try to getotgether and do whatever little they can and bring abt a change in themselves.When we talk abt pakistanis…we talk abt ourslef.SO self refliection is wht we all need,and not some well written piece of journalism.
    When such incidents take place in other countries,jounalists dont’t use them as an excuse to write off their minds.
    We need positive projection,and our media needs to help us get that!Recommend

  • Abdul
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:36AM

    Excellent article George. You are always an astute commentator.

    I am in the UK and my parents are from Pakistan. I regret to say Pakistan is generally a sick, barbarous nation. Everybody looked on as this horrific crime was committed against these innocent boys.

    I stay away from Pakistanis at every opportunity possible as a large segment – not all, but some people – are the most dysfunctional, uneducated and corrupt people I have ever come across.

    The British should never have left Pakistan; without colonialists to look over them and keep them in line, some Pakistanis are unable to behave as civilised human beings.Recommend

  • maria
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:42AM

    yes you r right.. not to be shocked…no surprise we have been thus..
    remarkable piece of writing.Recommend

  • Fawad zafar
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:53AM

    with all due respect george,picking up one small aspect of the whole pakistani temperament ,you cant judge pakistan. if i say that 70 % of ladies in world’s largest air force USAF are sexually harrassed as per there own records, should i relate the same to the whole country and declare the americans the most barbaric country? no sir i cant. same is the case here.Yes we are amongst the most corrupt nation but we are also the most donation giving country in the whole world. The massacres done during the partition were not because of us it was the britishers who made this happen.I feel ashemed for what happenend in sialkot,but this is not it,We will do anything and everything to make this thing not happen againRecommend

  • Faiza Qureshi
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:07AM

    Mr. Fulton, there was a time when I had fallen in love with your simplistic manner in the hope of learning something. However I may have jumped the gun! Yes we are barbaric – specially so when we want to protect whatever sanctity remains of our nation! There is a saying in urdu ‘pait bharay ki dakar!’ Look it up, you would need to now that you’ve had your desi meal!
    And food for thought to save face don’t bother saying I just said what I did to get the Pakistani people to react, thats a line we are used to from our true desi politicians! You stick to what you know best, firangipan! G’luck!Recommend

  • AZ
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:10AM

    Much of what you wrote is true. We have been indifferent, we have also been oblivious! Yes atrocities have happened in Pakistan for decades. The partition was bloody, but mostly because of the festered hatered built up and promoted by the British Raj. That is where the divide and rule mentality came from and unfortunately permeated into the very fabric of our society. Yes lynching has been around forever, yes, women have been buried arrive for centuries, and yes ahmadis have been persecuted- but never in our own living rooms. We have never seen the blood splash on our own TV screens. We have never heard the screams with our own ears. By WE I mean the ” drawing room” inhabitants that comprise most of your readership. The question is, what will we do now? Now that its all so real, will we return to life as usual once there is a new story? If we do, then everything that you said about us collectively as a nation is correct. I no longer live in Pakistan, and I feel that my patriotism has increased while I have been away. Living in the middle of misery, seeing it looking back at me through my glossy car windows and designer shades made one oblivious to it. Yet, everytime I return, my heart breaks as I see the sights I grew up with. Being away from Pakistan, I see floods and earthquakes, poverty and starvation, beheadings and lynchings- but I also see Imran Khan and the Lawyers movement. I see people I grew up with step up and take a stand. I see trucks full of food being driven to affected areas by my friends. Most of all I see outrage and realization and a will to change. This brings me hope. Maybe we as an people will finally decide to take matters into our own hands. Maybe the educated elite will finally get off their hand carved sofas and stand for office. Maybe we will finally understand that this is our home and we must fix it. And maybe, those of us who want to retaliate and lynch the offenders will learn that the way to repair a broken system is not to kick it- but to investigate, find the corruption and replace it with a good piece.
    As for the people who think you shouldn’t voice your views because you are a foreigner- well, I guess so am I! As are all the expatriots who left for money, amenities and peace of mind.Recommend

  • Kanza Nadeem
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:16AM

    George has written very well. And I cannot understand why people do not accept the reality? It has been more than 60 years since our independence. If things had to change, they would have decades ago. However, like you said, barbarity, incivility- and I’d add illiteracy- are those parasites that feed on our nation naturally.
    We must come to accept the realities around us; only then might we strive for betterment.
    I’d also add that we all must display tolerance, not hide away from harsh analyses.It is we who have formed this society and its norms. It shows our own narrow-mindedness to try to condemn someone from a foreign background, who is but showing a genuine concern for the Pakistani nation.Recommend

  • Syed Yasin Shah
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:20AM

    It’s the truth, and it hurts!Recommend

  • Abdul Moiz Jaferii
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:27AM

    well written. but isn’t this you frothing with the ‘self righteous anger’ that you speak of people feeling? is this entire article not voicing the ‘shock disgust and outrage’ in a more sedate and acidic manner?

    and for someone who claims to understand the historical intolerance in our society, I fear that you do not understand the intolerance that has already been witnessed in some of the comments made about your article.

    George, you need to realise what many white Americans have realised. no matter how much you champion the cause of the black man, you cannot use the ‘N’ word unless you are black. similarly, no matter how much you advocate the nation that is Pakistan, you cannot mock it unless you were born here.

    I am not saying that it is right for things to be this way, it is just that they are this way. we are as intolerant as you paint us to be. and that means that we will start pointing you out to be an immigrant the moment we feel insecure. Recommend

  • maryam tarek
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:29AM

    i agree with part of this article..but not entirely. violence has always been a part of HUMAN NATURE! way back in old days, men would bury their women or new-born daughters alive in arab countries. as for violence for entertainment, people take to it everywhere! for example, the movie ‘saw’. in 5 PARTS! i mean seriously, who watches that kind of disturbing stuff! =| n i agree.. pakistan is so NOT an islamic state. i think KSa is the only country in this world to be called a muslim country. but i believe pakistan is pure n peaceful. there are still pure and peaceful people and i still believe there is hope for pakistan. we all just have to change our point of views, concentrate on the positive rather than the negative. i think we will survive!Recommend

  • Doa
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:40AM

    Stop it guys. George’s right. =(Recommend

  • Misha
    Aug 26, 2010 - 6:08AM

    what solution is there? How do you change the mindset of a large majority of this nation? People are calling for the perpetrators of this vicious crime to be dealt with in much the same way, publicly hanging them; how do you change that?
    Isn’t the first step towards that exposing this nation for what it truely is? George has done no more Pakistan-bashing than Fasi Zaka has by referring to us as a nation of cockroaches, much less in fact. And i find it hard pressed to disagree with either of them.
    To everyone calling George’s being Pakistani into question, he is much more Pakistani than those of us choosing to live abroad (Hamood). At least he lives amongst his fellow countrymen no matter what they are like, and he can give much more to Pakistan by being here than you are by being abroad. George has written this article including himself in the ‘We’ he refers to. How long he has been here is irrelevant, it’s his wish to be Pakistani that counts.
    Munazza, the difference between us and other nations that have violent pasts is they at least have evolved and changed.
    And yes, we are much worse than hammer wielding Russians or Britishers with hockey sticks because we stood around, watched and did nothing to stop this from happening.
    Pakistan has been on eternal vacation and we have held our tongues enough. Wake up and smell the coffee people. Denial comes easy, it’s facing the issues that we have trouble with.Recommend

  • Hammad Bukhari
    Aug 26, 2010 - 6:22AM

    Does no one see the sarcasm in George’s writing? Most of it is anger, frustration and disgust out of sympathy for the brutal killings rolled up in sarcasm (for lack of a better word?). Just the point he is making guys and gals, get a grip on yourselves – what’s with the temper problem? So many of you are giving him a lecture on how he just came to Pakistan and he isn’t one of us? What is the matter with all of you who wrote that? He is not insulting your nation, better yet, you know what? he is insulting your nation; at least admit we deserve to be insulted and well ashamed of ourselves for a thousand and one reasons. You say why? Ask yourself why not? Why does it bother you if a ‘farangi’ insults you? The fact that he is a ‘gora’ angers most of you who write against him. Hamid Mir writing the same would be just fine? Where is our tolerance level?? Even if the poor brothers were criminals, hardcore criminals, your religion DOES NOT preach such punishment. Yes, I know all of you agree on this. So why the anger then with George? Why can’t an ‘outsider’ (he isn’t) show his disgust? Why can’t we just SHUT UP and LISTEN to criticism? Rather than understanding his comments, which are all rightly mentioned, some of us are counter-attacking George for speaking out against our sick, sick mindset also known as culture. EVERYONE has their right to speak/criticize freely. Even if he was not a Pakistani national. In this case he is, more than all of us, if you want. Let’s listen and do a self-check rather than react adversely to what is being rightly said. May Allah Bless Pakistan With Better Common Sense More Than Anything Else Right Now. (yea go on, criticize me for defending a ‘gora’) – keep writing George. Most of us share your views.Recommend

  • Aug 26, 2010 - 6:33AM

    It is all a mischief of the mobile camera, the TV, the Internet, etc., etc., which caused so much hullabaloo, otherwise this lynching business was always there, in our religion, in our culture, in our very genes, which neither the ‘daang’ of Moula Jatt, could flare up or that of Gandhi’s, ‘adam-tashadad’ (non-violence), could suppress, both of them having become victims of this very barbarism. But, don’t forget, this very land of Sialkot gave birth to our legends like Iqbal and Faiz.Recommend

  • marYam
    Aug 26, 2010 - 7:19AM

    its saddens me…..its so true…all we can do is look down n feel ashamed…Recommend

  • Mansoor
    Aug 26, 2010 - 7:43AM

    He wrote that whole article just so he could write the last line… Recommend

  • cache
    Aug 26, 2010 - 8:14AM

    George, I am not surprised at all. Its only a while since the karachi lynchings and I remember thinking back then that this will turn very ugly soon. Unfortunately people who I talked to didn’t seem to share my sentiment as they seemed to believe in some sort of bloody revolution that was apparently just around the corner.

    As for the egotistic commentators who suddenly seemed to have discovered national pride, they need to realize that pretty much no one outside shares their view of a Pakistan everyone can live by. Sure, there’s criticism for the sake of criticism, but I do think that some unforgiving words need to be said, especially ones which would get a certain fringe of the society off their intellectually lazy behinds so that they’ll do some serious soul searching. Recommend

  • Khadija
    Aug 26, 2010 - 8:39AM

    Very Well Written article,unfortunately it is the truth. Regardless our Nation is great and have many good qualities but this is a Dark Reality which exists within our Culture. When i was in Pakistan i have witness murder like this back in 90’s. Unless we change as nation to finish this barbarism that is only they way out. Otherwise we might just become corrupted with time but again it is my opinion. Recommend

  • Hassan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 8:48AM

    A very accurate analysis George. I studied at a public sector university for 4 years and witnessed this culture of machoism up close and personal. I for one was not surprised. The video reminded me of similar incidents which I had witnessed during my university years. The only difference was that the guys in those incidents just did not kill their victims. Other than that the situation was pretty much similar. The police, if present, were always the silent spectators. No one dared to try and save the victims. And most of the so called heroes were only heroic when they knew they had ten twenty friends to support them. Also most of these incidents resulted out of vengeance and most of the times were just excuses for the perpetrators to justify themselves in front of their false egos. There needs to be a serious review of what type of heroes we as nation present to our youth. Unfortunately up till now it has been vigilantes like Maula Jutt or Atif Gujar. Recommend

  • Kakakhel
    Aug 26, 2010 - 10:14AM

    George has not been in Pakistan long enough to give such strong opinions. Incase George considers himself Pakistani, he is welcome in our country. However, I do not appreciate the Pakistan-BEATING in this article. George has come up with his school of thought on Pakistani’s contrary to giving a neutral opinion as a responsible journalist/Pakistani??

    Other than the paragraph about our inclination towards mob justice(which is a valid point) the article would have been very relevant if it had focused on that only, the rest of the reasons are either vaque or just a mere list of emotions being poured out.

    I Would like george to give us his version of the attrocities done by the British during their rule and the peak of it during partition, or to make it unbiased he can tell us of the French or Russian Revolutions?Recommend

  • Atta ur Rahman
    Aug 26, 2010 - 10:32AM

    well but all not true , i bet , all dis scene gone b chnaged soon .. inshaALLAH
    ll change ,, you will , we all will and we must …Recommend

  • Shafaq
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:00AM

    Brian, you seem to hate this country. Why are you here? There are many Pakistanis like me who love this land. And as ashamed and saddened as I am about the sialkot murders, I am also a Pakistani who you insult through this article.
    Your article is myopic and single sided and has attracted, like magnets, the cowardly responses of others who like to complain endlessly about the state of affairs but do not spend an ounce of their energy trying to improve it.
    I have hope for this country. My parents are from here and my children live here. I was born in this land and hope to be buried here. I find your point of view obtusely arrogant in saying it will never be a peaceful nation. As a Pakistani you should be exhibiting some hope for ‘your chosen country’, not add masala to an already dire situation and wait for vultures to attack it.
    I am disgusted by the tone of your article. I am also offended by the titles of your other articles eg ‘Pakistan’s human cockroaches’. Have you ever thought that people like you and the others who seem to wallow in hate for this country are the real cockroaches. Now where is that pesticide when you need it…Recommend

  • Aug 26, 2010 - 11:07AM

    George, you have simply penetrated to the core of the issue. A true study of the matter.

    @ Dia The problem with Maula Jatt is the effect it has on the youth of Punjab. I am also from Punjab and I have seen guys there with guns hanging on their shoulders like Punjabi Movies. I even know about the killings without much reason just to soothe their ego.Recommend

  • Nosheen Malik
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:09AM

    Well yes….the country reflects and is made of hatred. A hatred i can see purely reflected in this article. Whereas my heart bleeds for the recent tragedy , the people affected by them ….but i am equally shocked and appalled that we as a nation, sorry as the EDUCATED minority of a nation feel that its OK to be sarcastic and cynical about the whole thing. We throw around words like “barbaric” “blood lust” because they are so easy to just say. I am ashamed that it is not “Pakistan” that’s is the problem, it is still what it has always been….OUR identity…OUR land, the only place where us Pakistanis will ever be first class citizens…the country which has given us freedom. Yes, our country has been raped of being our Motherland by terrorist stigmas ,natural disasters, corruption but the last nail of the coffin is not the poverty stricken frustrated people it is US, the privileged people who can easily say “how shameful” “how sad” “how sick” yet don’t want to move a muscle to change it. It is the leaders and the elite and the rich who set the decorum in our country…. You think other countries don’t have poverty , frustration and illiteracy? You think there are no mental illnesses that stem violence? It is the leaders and the privileged of the nation that enforce law and set precedents but we just want to talk about it . STOP blaming the ones who don’t know better , and take a good hard look at those who never taught better. This is no longer our mother land….we eroded it …we are deflectors so don’t we dare blame the land for all we have not been able to do. Recommend

  • Atiq Rehman
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:34AM

    For those that question his credentials, George is as Pakistani as the rest of us. If being born and bred in a foreign land stops people from being Pakistani then most of our politicians fit the bill. They live in our country only when it suits them and have no love or loyalty to the nation that has provided them with so much!

    And Pakistan is not being insulted. It is being shown it’s true face. We have become a wicked, corrupt and cowardly nation and anyone that denies it is a stupid idiot. How else would we have elected a bunch of murdering cheating corrupt fools to rule us, who in turn elected the most hated man in the country to be our leader? How else could we watch silently as our taxes, our rights and our children’s future were stolen right in front of our eyes? How else can we not be on the roads, protesting when we have no electricity, no clean water, no gas and no food. How can we be proud when we are compared to the poorest countries of world?

    Stop telling me about our atomic bombs and tanks, because we’re still bullied by America and India. Stop telling me about the minor achievements and tell me how many children are without food, how many adults without education, how many boys without jobs and how many women raped without justice? Tell me how many corrupt politicians and how much money they’ve taken from us?

    Foolish, cowardly and barbaric. But I still love my countrymen because they are mine, and I still pray to Allah to save us all from ourselves. Recommend

  • Hira Anwar
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:36AM

    I agree with everything that you have written George except your opinion that Pakistan will never be a pure and Islamic State. That is a very harsh statement and very depressing to imagine. Pls abstain from making such demoralizing predictions!Recommend

  • Namreen
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:39AM

    What exaggerating claims George!Recommend

  • Naji
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:48AM

    I am surprised at what you have written, not for the reason that you wrote something negative about Pakistan but because I fail to understand that you never understood a Pakistani even after living here. A Pakistani is as Human as any other national of any other country. Barbarism is human nature and is present in every society and country in different forms. It’s not just associated to Pakistan or Pakistanis. Why do you feel that killing people publically in Sialkot is any different from that of dropping a nuclear bomb in Japan. Is that not barbarism. Why do you forget the British History which is full of such acts. The only difference is that of the CCTV installed in every noke and corner of the UK. You remove the CCTV and check how barabric the British are. I am sorry but I totally disagree with whatever you have written in context to Pakistan ONLY Recommend

  • Rakesh
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:53AM

    “And what about Zulfikar Ali Bhutto and his daughter Benazir? Were they not just killed by a more sophisticated form of mob justice?”

    I understand ZAB, BB’s is an unresolved mystery.

    But there are colors to Pakistan. I understand your disillusionment, but you are lumping together over 140 million people and calling them all barbaric. You already have enough credibility problems (as evident from the comments above), why make your pointer harder to convey? Why take a simplistic view of the situation and stretch it?

    I think the wonder that the current Pakistani ‘society’ is expressing is based on the reality we exist in. The reality where there is a media running-a-muck and providing instant updates on anything and maybe the values for the civil society have progressed. Either way, it is a good thing that people are at least flinching at it and expressing anger/disbelief. What actions they commit can be controlled and for THAT we need leaders. Recommend

  • Nosheen Malik
    Aug 26, 2010 - 11:59AM

    No one cares where the person who wrote this article is from , nor is there a disagreement of the facts that have been displayed. My criticism , OK true face shown …now lets get on with it…..try to fix the problems and i don’t mean go out to war its little things we can do. And just to say to be PATRIOTIC is not a sign of naivete but to to abandon , perch up on your high horse and be pessimistic…that i would certainly call cowardly. Recommend

  • tabby
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:00PM

    George,you are so right dude… We, as a nation are barbaric.. but….. may you tell me about the nation you belong to..? what are they doing all over the globe….? Being the part of great nation, why cant you tell us about the services USA is providing to this world…. Do I have to tell you what you are doing to innocent Kashmiris, Iraqis, people of Palestine and Afghanis…..? Why dont you condemn all those action BTW….. What Vietnamese did to you…books of history are full with those eye opener events………
    The sad incidents occurring in our place are nothing as compared to them…You should also write about these instead of feeling sad about it…. Recommend

  • A Naheed
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:01PM

    Who do you think you are?
    I don’t want to waste my time and intellect.
    Just read your history.
    Throw dirt up in the sky, and it will zero in on your face! Recommend

  • Sadaf
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:23PM

    I am so ashamed at all this happening. I can’t see to what has been happening in Our country This is result of violent Indian movies where whole crowd watching shameful act and police support them. This barbaric killing make me sleepless but as a nation we are not a barbaric degenerate nation.
    Agreed with **kashif malik** No one has a right to criticize our nation one who are **Genocide** (In 1944, a Polish-Jewish lawyer named Raphael Lemkin (1900-1959) sought to describe Nazi policies of systematic murder, including the destruction of the European Jews.) you people avoid talking about genocide and even though you are trying to hide the fact you forget the The horror of the **Rwandan** genocide 1994 mass murder of an estimated 800,000 people by Your nation you promote this term that’s why you hide these activities
    You are talking Zulfikar Ali Bhutto and his daughter Benazir Bhutto yes it’s a great incident of our nation but why you are not talking about Indra Ghandhi and his son Rajiv Ghandi’s murder why ???? why you come here to criticize us go and criticize these peoples
    You read news paper don’t forget few months before on 06 April **Dozens of police dead after Maoist ambush** go and search on CNN
    Simply everything happened every where we are soft hearted nation we criticize these shameful activity that’s why whole world come and criticize us Kindly checkout your own country news papers then talk about others. We will not give rights to other to criticize us
    May ALLAH bestow his all Wrath upon all those who were involved in such grieving incident, and innocent boys rest in peace, and Allah give their family strength at this time
    And guide our Nation to follow how to live peaceful islamic lifeRecommend

  • Sadaf
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:36PM

    I am so ashamed at all this happening. I can’t see to what has been happening in Our country This is result of violent Indian movies where whole crowd watching shameful act and police support them. This barbaric killing make me sleepless but as a nation we are not a barbaric degenerate nation.
    Agreed with Kashif No one has a right to criticize our nation one who are Genocide (In 1944, a Polish-Jewish lawyer named Raphael Lemkin (1900-1959) sought to describe Nazi policies of systematic murder, including the destruction of the European Jews.) you people avoid talking about genocide and even though you are trying to hide the fact you forget the The horror of the Rwandan genocide 1994 mass murder of an estimated 800,000 people by Your nation you promote this term that’s why you hide these activities
    You are talking Zulfikar Ali Bhutto and his daughter Benazir Bhutto yes it’s a great incident of our nation but why you are not talking about Indra Ghandhi and his son Rajiv Ghandi’s murder why ???? why you come here to criticize us go and criticize these peoples
    You read news paper don’t forget few months before on 06 April Dozens of police dead after Maoist ambush go and search on CNN
    Simply everything happened every where we are soft hearted nation we criticize these shameful activity that’s why whole world come and criticize us Kindly checkout your own country news papers then talk about others. We will not give rights to other to criticize us
    May ALLAH bestow his all Wrath upon all those who were involved in such grieving incident, and innocent boys rest in peace, and Allah give their family strength at this timeRecommend

  • Sharood Zafar
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:38PM

    The article is well written, no doubt.
    However i would like to state here that violence is a global evil which has effectively spread its tentacles in all countries and nations. It is sad tough that it has effected Pakistan badly. We hear about honor killings, domestic violence and mob lynching in everyday newspapers.
    But this is an incident which should shock us or at least cause some sort of reaction. It is about time that we change what was done in the past. the outcry for justice is necessary here since we need to educate our society and citizens about a fair and just system. Although it is a long shot, but it is never to late to make things right. If we do not take a positive step today then the situation would get worse with each generation. Recommend

  • Maliha shah
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:50PM

    i agree a lot more than i would like to admit..but perhaps not being surprised would seal our identity as not being human enough.. it would be indifference and one must not be indifferent to such things no matter how usual they are,its the last trace of humanity left in us to condemn it verbally atleast.i beleive that every human being is responsible for injustice in any part of the world.and for the people who have commented agianst George..i wish they would stop being blind for once.that is exactly the kind of atitude that has brought us to this stage..they would rather like to rot in the hell they have created than listen to someone who talks truthfully.. so what if the west and bollywood have contributed to violence..someone else’s sins dont make your own sins forgivable!!! i m disgusted at the way people are still defending themselves out of west-phobia and bias, if we want to change we first have to accept that we need to change..Recommend

  • Sohail Hameed Khan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 12:58PM

    Dear George,
    I have watched you on TV occasionally and I generally like you, but I disagree with what you have written.
    First of all, savagery is no alien to the western cultures – you need to study the history of Europe and Americas. Talking about Maula Jutt, I recommend you watch two Hollywood movies – “Law abiding citizen” and an old movie “Walking tall” and you will find everything you have written about Maula Jutt in these two movies.
    Man is basically an animal – he just needs to be pushed that distance! I cannot defend what happened in Sialkot, it was barbaric, but the irony was the inaction of the police, that is, if they were not a party to the crime!Recommend

  • Arshad Taqi
    Aug 26, 2010 - 1:40PM

    Interesting responses to a thought provoking article. Are we ever going to learn the art of a meaningful debate. Is this an isolated act of barbarism by a few ignorant, misguided illiterates or is it a manifestation of a much larger malady? Have we turned into barbarians in response to circumstances or were we always like this? Is this behaviour unique to Pakistanis or have other people acted similarly in the past?
    George is a Pakistani and no one can deny his right to speak his mind on an issue; surely he learned enough about our society before adopting it to speak with some authority. Recommend

  • Faizan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 1:52PM

    This is true to some extent , but that extent is very very minor. I dont agree with the closing speech, ‘Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. And it never will be’. What right does anyone have to declare Pakistan a failed state and its people a failed people? It is an Islamic state and we are a peaceful people! This is a fact! We all cannot be judged by the acts of a just a few! The millions of people all around the country donating for their fellow pakistani’s for the flood is a clear reflection of what we actually are. Peaceful, kind, generous soft, sentimental and ultimately Pakistani!Recommend

  • Ahmad
    Aug 26, 2010 - 2:40PM

    I agree with you, but I feel people are frustrated and there are no shrinks. You speak of muala jutt culture, but you failed to mention that there are more news channels in Pakistan then entertainment channels, they get frustrated with their own condition as well as the spiced up news from the the news channels, the entertainment time is occupied with more news, how can you imagine such nation to be normal. Recommend

  • Babar
    Aug 26, 2010 - 2:46PM

    “An-eye-for-an-eye-for-an-eye-for-an-eye . . . ends in making everybody blind”Recommend

  • Babar
    Aug 26, 2010 - 2:51PM

    To all the critics,

    All George has done is that he has shown us the mirror. We can’t blame him for our ugly face. Acceptance is a difficult choice but also is first step towards redemption.

    Cheerz George, keep up the great work. Looking forward to read more of your article.Recommend

  • sanjithmenon
    Aug 26, 2010 - 3:30PM

    i am from India, these things happen here also. Its bad its wrong and all that. We had a jilted lover who threw acid on his lovers face. the girl died. the police caught the boy, and took him for a ride. Killed him, right there on the road. his body was brought in a tractor to the city, and my you should have seen the women folk on the road baying for blood. Human rights groups came in, and asked who gave the police permission, it was none other than the chief minister of the state. the boys parents never accepted the body, and the municipality buried him. So what should the police have done? left him to the justice system who would have taken 9 years to bring justice? A lesson had to be taught, to the boys that if they hurt defenseless women, they would be paid back fatally. We and i mean, pakistanis too are very accommodative people. very easy going , but pound us too hard, we react with vicious savagery. thats our nature. MQM wants a place in Punjab heartland thats it.Recommend

  • Junaid
    Aug 26, 2010 - 3:41PM

    Not a bit of exaggeration. Societies which lack literacy, social justice and tolerance eventually turn barbaric. Alot of us pakistanis need a reality check because we are still acting too naive and blaming it on others (politicians, taliban, america, agencies, bla bla) whereas this extremism is gone into our genes.Recommend

  • Farhana Pasha
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:10PM

    Well said George! Pakistanis sitting at home watching this barbaric video and shuddering at the apathetic response of the crowd watching these brutal murders, are no different. These same Pakistani people collectively watched the brutal killings of Ahmedis over so many years and then the massacre of 85 Ahmedis on May 28th and did not even bother to raise their voice against it. Are Ahmedis not human beings? Is this what islam teaches you? Even the 500 Ahmedi flood survivors were refused to be sheltered and denied aid. Amidst all the mess and the turmoil that this nation is enduring, how can one even think about discrimination? Recommend

  • Usama
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:20PM

    very intriguing article George! very very true indeed all!

    just 1 quick Q, u seem to be knowing so much bout PK, yet, ur name “George” does not really fit u among Pakistani’s? U born here?Recommend

  • tony
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:22PM

    Ever heard of football hooligans, the BNP, racist thugs who beat to death? Now that’s inherently British. On yer bike George! You’re lucky Pakistanis are hospitable – if you had written this about Britain or the US you would have been villified. Recommend

  • FT
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:23PM

    No Doubt! It was all barbaric, inhuman, devilish & absolutely against teh spirit of any civilised or cultural ethics, BUT you should not confuse it with movement of independence of Pakistan at all. If you insist then you also look at the history which was done by british with help of fanatic hindus & sikhs. During teh period of 1923 to 1928 from Bangal only 28,000 women were picked raped & killed, what usa & nato forces have done in Iraq & the holy places of muslims & if you remember the Gujrat riots & the samjohta train masacare & even the cristians were burnt in soutern india & so on… Why HRC dont moblise teh media on this & ask the civilised world to also take actions on such areas as they highlight every single & minute details of any such frustrating event. we also want to live in peace as we used to be, but such usa policies for last 35 years has demolished evey single prospect of this.Recommend

  • Sabeen
    Aug 26, 2010 - 4:55PM

    Peace George,

    I remember your programs and remember having great respect for you to share with us your journey when settling into Pakistan

    But this article makes me doubt my respect for you greatly.

    Those people who killed the boys or that mob or any politicians or that movie you quoted have never represented me as a person or the Pakistan that I know. For you to associate partition with this incident is an insult.

    Pakistan welcomed you with open arms and this is a poor way for you to appreciate it.

    If you think Pakistan is such a failure like your fellow Tribune writer Fasi Zaka then really your free to leave. There’s no pressure for any of you to stay. But spare Pakistan and its people from such insults.

    Pakistanis will solve their own problems and will overcome these hardships positively, regardless of what you or this paper thinks otherwise.Recommend

  • Azher
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:33PM

    Beautiful penned article…it represents the (ever) silent educated (Pakistani)class.Recommend

  • Abbas Khan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:48PM

    I can feel the sadness accompanied by some pity in your words.But the fact is that out of 180-190 million people,you will see a minute amount involved in vengeance & blood sucking ranging from higher to lower class.
    And as far as Justice for any innocent soul is concerned,Allah is the ultimate judge.Because no one finds the right kind of justice here in a state through social democracy,that was made virtually independent by the name of GOD. Recommend

  • Sabeen
    Aug 26, 2010 - 5:59PM

    Forgot to add Insh’Allah to my last post so I’ll do it now. Insh’Allah it will be as I said.Recommend

  • saira
    Aug 26, 2010 - 6:04PM

    george has written and stated facts about our nation that we as pakistanis do not have the courage to say or admit. we are like ostriches that bury our heads in the sand and pretend like nothing is wrong with us. our politicians do not and never did care for our people. our police never cared for our people. our own society is full of cannibalism-we kill our own to survive. even the taliban who are clueless about what they are achieving, kill their own muslim brothers. and we dont have the courage to do anything about it. it is a game of politics and money. from the time pakistan came into being, we have no achievements to be proud of. if we didnt hold the button to the nuclear bomb, other countries wouldn’t even look in our direction. it is sad for our future generations. people who may hold hope for pakistan may be optimistic but not realistic. i have no comments about the inhumane killing of the two boys in sialkot, because there are no words to describe that sadism. we will never progress unless we become a secular and literate nation. hmmmmmmmmmm…Recommend

  • Amir Siddiqui
    Aug 26, 2010 - 6:09PM

    Articles like these are simply the writers way of achieving moral highground. Pseudo-intellectualism. Elitist mentality – that they are the only ones able to “see” the evil the commoners cannot grab. PLUS he is a man and has many ladies to impress by showing his “vulnerability” of heart.Recommend

  • Arif Ullah
    Aug 26, 2010 - 6:34PM

    Very well articulated article with a Despaired mind.

    George, don’t you think you are being too critical and focusing only on one aspect. I agree our society needs a revolution but we need to understand that this mindset exists in all societies. What American’s did in ABu Ghuraib Jail, what was done to muslims in Bosnia and we can give thousand examples.

    I am not defending this brutality, all i want to say is that you article revolves around citicizing Pakistan. We should criticise the act not the country. As a Pakistani i really feel ashamed but I am hopeful that this will change. You gave example of movies like Maula Jatt, i do seriously condemn such movies, but do you think we can not give you examples of such Hollywood movies???Recommend

  • Jibran
    Aug 26, 2010 - 6:37PM

    Bingo. Hasn’t it always been thus? It has.

    A dispute between two parties turned violent and the violence turned into brutal murders – This is not so shocking since it happens all the time. What is shocking is that it happened in broad daylight and no one intervened to stop the attackers. What is even more shocking is the behaviour of police [really? But apparently it is]. They were just there but they stood like silent spectators.

    In such incidents one expects normally a very nosy Pakistani people to rush to poke their noses in, intervene and stop the fight. As time passes violence and the surfeit of it in our society is making our hearts and mind hard and numb. And so a few bravehearts from the crowd who were supposed to jump in to stop the attackers didn’t move an inch.

    Now, the police. Well, anyone who has even slightest of acquaintance with this organisation knows full well that it is far worse than daciots and thieves. They try to keep face in big cities but as you step into small towns and insignificant countryside you notice the true face of the Pakistan police. Police gardi [police-terrorism] is a term coined decades ago.

    So whatever happened that day was “normal”, if you ask me, except for one thing: The crowd didn’t intervene. That is more alarming to me than police doing nothing to stop the killers!

    But why is there so much hype about this particular incident if it has always been thus? The answer is media. Media has never been as strong and loud in Pakistan as it is these days. [It doesn’t necessarily mean it is doing a “good” job – I have my reservations]. But yes, it is the media. This incident might very well have been relegated to a small news square on page 4 of an Urdu daily had it not been for the footage and mainstream TV channels airing it as breaking news, going to interview the family of the victims and seeking answers from the local police chiefs.Recommend

  • Ali Khan
    Aug 26, 2010 - 7:31PM

    George, honestly speaking you are absolutely right but do not attack on the whole nation as you are the part of this nation too. What have you done till now, tell me. Any progress from you any participation from you in making Pakistan a peacful land, nothing right. So blaming and criticizing is the easiest thing to do.
    I am a pure Pakistani and still proud to be Pakistani American but this kind of incidents and accidents are everywhere in the world. Have you ever had a chance to read or watch news from around the world. Every nation and every country has something weird going on. Unfortunately Pakistan’s issues are raised more than any other countries, I dont know why. Now 18 people were involved in the barbarism and mob lynching does not mean that Pakistani nation’s every individual is the same culprit.
    In short we all Pakistanis have to take a stand against our Politicians as well as we have to promise ourselves to start doing good for this country. Not throwing garbage outside can be the start and it can end with the developed nation. One step by any individual will change our beautiful land. Please Pakistani fellows, wake up, lets change our land into land of piece. I and my friends are sending 100,000 doallars from New York Inshallah soon. So what if I live in NY but I still have Pakistani sould and heart and Inshallah this pure land will be successful and peaceful land one day. George wait and watch Inshallah. Pakistan Zindabad!!!!!Recommend

  • M. Salim
    Aug 26, 2010 - 7:43PM

    excellent write-up – should be translated into Urdu for the benefit of the teaming millions. They need to wake-up from a state of self denial just like the silent intelligentsia!!Recommend

  • Mehreen
    Aug 26, 2010 - 8:12PM

    I see someone’s honeymoon period with Pakistan is over. Recommend

  • Hamza Ahmed
    Aug 26, 2010 - 8:41PM

    Excellent Article Brother. But Keep In Mind That Every Nation Faces Tough Times. 50 Yrs, 60 yrs, 70 Yrs. Does Not Matter At All. Americans And Europeans Are Considered To Be The Best Nations Today But They Also Had To Face Hard Times To Achieve What They Have Achieved. For Example American Civil War, That War Is Considered One Of The Most Bitter Civil Wars In The Human History.

    There Will be A Day When Pakistan Will Prosper And Rule Hearts Of This World.Recommend

  • Mehreen
    Aug 26, 2010 - 8:55PM

    I’m fed up of you demoralising lot of people patronising the entire nation with your articles, ignoring the hardships we’ve all suffered or mocking them whilst completely ignoring the selfless acts so many are pulling daily, especially these days when we’re all racking our brains or breaking our backs earning our livings and trying to figure out how to help the flood victims at the same time.
    These barbaric acts in recent times no NOT define us. Read any daily anywhere. Across the seas, mothers in first world countries are killing their babies, fathers are torturing and raping daughters and then stuffing them in freezers for 2 years, people are walking into mosques and peeing on prayer mats, cabbies are getting stabbed for being Muslims, 70+ bodies at a time are being found in warehouses, and for the most part, most of these events occur or are aoccuring in countries with access to education, medical and finacial support, supposedly democrative govts, NO WAR, AND NO SUCCESSIVE NATIONAL CALAMITIES. But we’re the degnerates. Well done, George!Recommend

  • Neena
    Aug 26, 2010 - 9:05PM

    After reading this article, I thought i felt moved by it but after a moment’s reconsideration, I’m sorry to say, I’m pretty disappointed in it. It tried to hold its facts and points right but generally I’d say it felt more like an emotional rant. Especially giving examples such as that of partition and our ‘entertainment’ sources to reflect the barbarism this nation holds seems too narrow minded a thought. Yes, Pakistan was found with loss of many lives but let that not become a ready-made blame for its future generations to have an inherent desire for bloodlust.
    And by the way, the whole nation responded in sorrow and shock to the event, did it not? “Don’t ‘act’ surprise”. Sorry to break it to you George but it was not pretense, and usually never is, when ‘the media, the blogosphere, facebookers’ and the general public condemned and reacted in horror to these killings.
    It is deeply heartbreaking and saddening but to me, even having such emotions mean we, to the very least, reflect at our misdoings.

    Bash us when we start adoring this ‘sadism’ and ‘barbarity’.Recommend

  • Shazia
    Aug 26, 2010 - 9:16PM

    Many Pakistanis are ashamed to call themselves as such, but we reject a foreigner who has voluntarily become a Pakistani. Why?
    Why are we so intolerant that we cant accept him as one of us? Dont we go abroad and expect people to accept us? Where are our Muslim values? Our humanity? We seem to be just as intolerant as the men in that blood thirsty mob.
    Any rational person must realise that George is spot on. Lord of the Flies indeed. It is a truly sad time for this country.Recommend

  • Aleem Shafique
    Aug 26, 2010 - 9:24PM

    “So don’t act surprised. The Sialkot murders are as Pakistani as truck art, biryani and loadshedding. This has always been an ugly reality of Pakistan and always will be.”

    Quite true and we should not be anguished by looking on this tragic incident in a different way. But at least, we have to put some barring on such barbaric acts and I think this is the right moment to put a full stop on it. Now, the matter is with apex court and I am sure that Justice Iftikhar and Justice Ramday will be able to adress the root cause of such incidents. Recommend

  • KH
    Aug 26, 2010 - 9:41PM

    “Barbarity and sadism are ever present in our society.” I agree with you and in support of your argument want to show you an evidence:

  • Soha
    Aug 26, 2010 - 10:27PM

    “Other people don’t kill each other,” George thought. “Why oh Why are Pakistanis so barbaric?”

    “Why can’t they behave ethically?” he wondered “like the rest of the world?”

    After all George was no fool. He knew that mobs in other countries were civilized. When the KKK attacked African Americans they always said please and thank you.

    Justice is always served in the United Kingdom. That must be why the crime rate is so low.

    “How DARE these Pakistanis be surpised that two teenaged boys were bludgeoned to death?” George asked himself.

    All Pakistani’s are the same – just so ignorant, right?Recommend

  • Sadaf Din
    Aug 27, 2010 - 12:32AM

    Lets face the truth, there isn’t a single country on this entire planet that doesn’t have a brutal past or its positive traits. In all honesty, I feel that George being a Pakistani citizen has EVERY right to state his opinions about his country and all you racist individuals who take sheer joy in throwing around ridiculous insults aren’t even worth addressing but fortunately for me, I just happened to have a few spare minutes to do so. Anyway, I in all honesty believe, that our human species needs to be blamed for any atrocious events that take place anywhere on this poor unfortunate planet. We as a species have failed, but that does not change the fact that nothing should keep us from striving to be better human beings. Race, Religion, culture, it’s just extra fluff used to make up excuses and get away with murder. Get over yourselves…our species simply sucks!Recommend

  • Sara Bashir Malik
    Aug 27, 2010 - 1:15AM

    Napoleon had once said: “The world suffers a lot, not because of the violence of bad people, but because of the silence of good people!” And THAT is why we NEED to act surprised, even if all this has been prevalent in Pakistan since forever. Just because something has been going on forever does NOT make it acceptable.Recommend

  • zohreenM
    Aug 27, 2010 - 1:27AM

    since we are talking about brutality,mob mentality,how much we hate our minorities,chulo if we are all jaahil uneducated robots in your eyes,barbaric narrowminded fanatics then what would you say about the civilized world,the torch beareres of humanity (because theyre educated and have democracy and that is the only benchmark by which you can measure the psyche of a nation right George?)In Germany an arab woman was stabbed to death 18times because she was muslim,wore a headscarfso what are you going to do now?lambast every German for bieng a follower of Hitler?you think only pakistan needs to be put on a pedestal and the whole world should mock,criticize and run it down but if i turn the tables then its not ok?You are writing for an International newspaper arent you?well it figures they would happily put your childish little rant or” article” in thier paper but my stance would never see the light of whose barbaric now?whats the benchmark?what excuse does Germnay have?should a maulvi give a fatwa that all Germans should stand on one leg so you can be appeased that oh well its our stupid mentality at it again ?

    “It was while Marwa el-Sherbini was in the dock recalling how the accused had insulted her for wearing the hijab after she asked him to let her son sit on a swing last summer, that the very same man strode across the Dresden courtroom and plunged a knife into her 18 times.

    Her three-year-old son Mustafa was forced to watch as his mother slumped to the courtroom floor.

    Even her husband Elvi Ali Okaz could do nothing as the 28-year-old Russian stock controller who was being sued for insult and abuse took the life of his pregnant wife. As Okaz ran to save her, he too was brought down, shot by a police officer who mistook him for the attacker. He is now in intensive care in a Dresden hospital.”

    bear in mind that various sections of society in Germany DID condemn the act and a life sentence was handed down(should have been a death penalty but oh well)which,for a change,is what we,despite our shortcomings,our inept nonexistent justice system is attempting to do.THAT is why it is important for people,facebookers to condemn it and sneering,mocking this act is the last thing that you should be doing.At least we acknowledge we have problems.give us credit for trying.give a fledgling media credit for acknowledging its failure and attempting to rectify can bring back someone from life but we are far from the inane image you have painted of us that is now circulating all over the world thanks to you.Recommend

  • S. Ali Raza
    Aug 27, 2010 - 1:46AM

    George: Ignore the self-righteous, complexed, Zaid Hamidy Nationalist type of hypocrites!

    You have hit the nail on the op-ed’s head :) Recommend

  • Aug 27, 2010 - 2:38AM

    i can totally understand your point George. when i watched ‘Lord of the Flies’ as part of my philosophy course in USA, the bad kids constantly reminded me of Pakistan and pakistaniz. lolz… we have destroyed our country and we deserve all that we’re going through. i wish lord of the flies could be a part of studies in pakistan. i wish people of pakistan could see outside their cocoons of false pride and this violent version of islam. i wish pakistani ppl could learn to be GOOD HUMAN BEINGS first and then try to be good muslims, christians , hindu or whatever faith they follow. After all, the purpose behind every religion is guiding human beings and helping us be civilized people. but i don’t see that happening in pakistan any time soon and i don’t see most pakistaniz realizing our mistakes. as long as we don’t realize our mistakes, we have no hopes of making amends. yes we pakistaniz are violent, barbaric, uncivilized….. we have a long way to go. maybe in a 100 yrs if majority of pakistaniz get educated, stop being biased, stop following our elders, religious clerics and leaders blindly and start thinking logically, we might have hopes of becoming a civilized nation. personally, i don’t see that happening in my life time. Recommend

  • Jahanzaib Haque
    Aug 27, 2010 - 2:39AM

    @Zohreen while your intricate comment is appreciated, it is unfortunately too lengthy to be published in the comments section. Best regards (Web Editor)Recommend

  • Kanzul Fatima
    Aug 27, 2010 - 3:27AM

    Your words sting, Not because they are harsh words but because they are so very true. I hope you find better things to write about someday. I hope and believe you will =) keep writing! Recommend

  • Rad
    Aug 27, 2010 - 4:34AM

    You have echoed my thoughts exactly-a nation that was built on the rivers of blood flowing through beneath the banner of partition should not really be shocked and outraged at such atrocities.Recommend

  • pervez
    Aug 27, 2010 - 4:38AM

    Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. AND IT NEVER WILL BE.. i dont like the phrase “and it never will be “… its very rude to say thatRecommend

  • salma noor
    Aug 27, 2010 - 5:12AM

    I appreciate your writing and the passion behind it…. but the truth is every nations past and present is as dark as our …. you just have to look close enough…behind the fancy pretentions its the same old story…one way or another…and personal i would rather like/prefer to feel surprised each and every time, cos my surprise makes me realize that i still belief in the positives of our nation…
    … it keeps me striving for the good … and i know we will get there inshaAllah.Recommend

  • Umar Khan
    Aug 27, 2010 - 5:30AM

    As disgusting as the thinking of your whole society, Mr. Fulton…

    Quran says….”If a wound (and killing) has touched you, be sure a similar wound (and killing) has touched the others. And so are the days (good and not so good), We give to men by turns, that Allah may test those who believe, and that He may take martyrs from among you. And Allah likes not the Zalimun”-AL IMRAN(VERSE-140)

    These are tests n exams of the Almighty given upon to the nations of character n valor…

    Be thoughtful of the fact that since independence our nation has been trailed and tested…not by men or thoughts of mind but only by the WILL OF ALLAH… and AL HAMDOLILAH we have always survived and tolerated what ever test we are put into…

    i accept all your grievances Mr. Fulton about this nation, but dont appreciate the thought of yours considering us being in such state by default…Have u ever considered what all the your nation introduced this world with..during the royal days of commanding half of this world…inflation, poverty, depriving of rights to minors, we all learn from the predecessors dont we? Recommend

  • Sariah Imran
    Aug 27, 2010 - 5:40AM

    this is utter generalization! and if Pakistan is so hopeless then why dont u get your respective asses out of here! we have hope and we can always work on our mistakes and try to be a better nation!
    These mishaps occur all around the world! Stop portraying Pakistan as if its the worst nation which has no hope at all, its our motherland and we respect it and love it unconditionally! what ever happened was extremely sad but that doesn’t give anyone the right to accuse all of the Pakistanis as barbaric. Stop being emotional fools, stay united and work for your country’s betterment. Instead of sitting in your drawing rooms as cursing your own nation! It is YOU who makes PAKISTAN..


  • Sheema
    Aug 27, 2010 - 6:56AM

    Here you go…fulton! see the article below!

  • jawaid Mohsin
    Aug 27, 2010 - 8:20AM

    Some people are mad in every society and country and for this the whole nation cannot be blamed. The law will take it course. till todate about 90 person have been arrested. All Pakistnees have condemned it. Every new pappaer and TV channels have condemned and reported this happening. Let us pray for the departed soul. It may happen again where literacy rate iabpit 15% and aout 1% of the GDP is pent on education. Let us comeforward to educate our people. This is the only way to stop such happenings.Recommend

  • Saif ul Islam Sajid
    Aug 27, 2010 - 9:04AM

    If maula jatt performs anything, it is barbaric and if rambo does the same, it is action; are you not hyperactive to condemn our society. What do you know about our society or our culture? You are still its student (and well so am i). What happened in Sialkot is certainly a blot on us, but it is in no way a complete picture of our society. Certainly, the dreaded chain of mob justice of the day is to be stopped and the society is to be tamed, however, this is not our history. During the birth of our country, the massacre of muslims at the hands of hindus and sikhs led to the revenge. They started it, not us and it is our right to avenge.
    No matter how much u deny, the root cause are the same, separation from our religion and culture, illiteracy, poverty poor governance and law and order conditions, and they need to be addressed appropriately at all costsRecommend

  • Naz
    Aug 27, 2010 - 9:05AM

    assalam-0-alikum, i just read the article and feel very sad people just think what they see… without looking at the word history.. if anyone read WW1 or world war2 what happen to those countries pluse hiroshema.. now this is time for as..some big countires will create a setuation which will be a men made.. and distroy the people of the countires which is happening and thats what happend in all the wars. Even tho we are talking about two brothers who where killed… and i have rade many stories in america for child abuse big time.. where mom’s cut there own baby in peaces and cooked.. not just one time thats what happened.. plus you will see in magazines alot of coco people every day life but they are crazy because they chouce for… but if in pakistan we get a right law n a good president you will see the peace in pakistan more then any other country..Recommend

  • Saad
    Aug 27, 2010 - 10:49AM

    @ Kashif Malik.
    Denial does not change the fact that every word is true.
    Blame games are not a justification but a mode of nurture for the ills that are already existent.
    Excellent piece George!Recommend

  • Summaiya
    Aug 27, 2010 - 10:53AM

    “This has always been an ugly reality of Pakistan and always will be. The Islamic Republic of Pakistan is a misnomer. Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. And it never will be.”


    PS. A very disappointing attempt.Recommend

  • Sadaf
    Aug 27, 2010 - 11:24AM

    @Sabeen Ameen weldone There are some pure pakistani’s like U me and some other petriotic person pakistan needs some positive energy i always believe that Love pakistan or leave it
    Pakistan zaindabadRecommend

  • Babar
    Aug 27, 2010 - 11:56AM

    Well i appreciate what you told but thats nothing new to us! its there for evey nation in one way or the other. How come you forget the barbaric acts on Palestinians, Kashmaris etc. its not just our country but the whole world is wrapped with such injustic acts.Recommend

  • hammad
    Aug 27, 2010 - 12:23PM

    Well George, do you have any idea of brain drain of Pakistan? Do not become advocate of Pakistan and label it a barbaric nation if you do not have guts to write even single one good act of Pakistan. Pakistan has flaws but the atitude you have shown in article simply reflect to me your unconcern about Pakistan. I have been writing on different forums. My talk starts more or less same like youRS, but i give solutions as a must in my articles because i care for this land. So my request to you is that do not label Pakistan with bad names, it is a state which has set wonderful examples in every fIeld of life despite of very low GDP. Recommend

  • Wajih Khattak
    Aug 27, 2010 - 12:49PM

    I agree with most of what you said George but not that we have acted surprised, we are barbaric, ruthless and possessing all the evil qualities, but this being captured and shown to us have definitely made an impression that unfortunately (or fortunately) would last for a long time. Now Mr. Fulton you should reconsider your comments on the barbarism and brutality that happened in the war of independence (or mutiny), what happened back than was inhumane but you don’t expect a country to rip off into two pieces without bloodshed. What happened in Sialkot is totally different, I mean they were tortured to death with our law standing their like a total stooge to the mob, if they would have just killed them it would have been accepted by many but not the way they killed those 2 boys (whether innocent or not) and specially what they did to them afterward. I have seen those touchy movies about the Jews and the Nazi, where the poor Jews are shot dead or put into gas chamber, but still I found them somehow humane (except for the mass killing). So I think now you should understand that why so much reaction has been observed, there is so much I would like to write and let you know but I dont think I would be able to express all that I feel about this incident.
    We have seen, read and heard about violence like this, but this one happening with 100’s of people witnessing it and the Police standing there (I am finding it too hard to write and comment about the police without using foul language) and being a part of this hideous crime have made many of us realized that its about time things start changing around here or we will not recover this. For the first time I have feel disgusted about my nationality and am being ashamed of calling myself Pakistani, as this time I (or we) have no excuse for what happened in Sialkot, those were not Taliban, foreigners, Militia etc. that was us, Pakistani. Recommend

  • Angela
    Aug 27, 2010 - 12:55PM

    When things are pushed down your throat all your life and so then again does another generation breed the same hate and intent. I dont agree with all you said but understand the underlying truths. Your country have so many wonderful beautiful loving people in it who just want the chance to strive and make something of their lives and are supressed at even trying.Recommend

  • mujtaba haydar
    Aug 27, 2010 - 12:55PM

    How can anyone not agree with George? Indeed, a lot of British raised lads, like myself, would describe the so called ‘land of the pure’ in such a way as George has, albeit, I can be a tad too colourful!. The basic idea for Pakistan was straight forward, and the plan seemed right on track after the carnage of the bloody partition. But, up and until the word “Islamic” was officially slapped on Pakistan did we start seeing a totally different Pakistan being nightmarishly born anew than the one sought by it’s idealistic founding fathers. I think the Quaid would be turning in his grave knowing what he left behind to such a people. I was proud of calling myself a Pakistani, up until now!. I guess the only proud ‘roots’ of my ancestral land I can boast of, and from where I can refer to it’s history and culture, would be the land of pre-partition India, and even the Indus valley civilisation. Anyone read the Indus Saga? :-)Recommend

  • Naqvi
    Aug 27, 2010 - 1:54PM

    Poor article and an even poorer attempt at journalism. Would’ve expected more sensibility and decency. By the way talking about barbarism, every nation in the world has had a chunk of barbarism. It all comes down to whether barbarism is acceptable (very sightly) on the basis of motive. The barbarism we endured in 1947 can be viewed on the ground of sacrifice.
    And don’t even get started on the vigilantes or should I remind you where the fashion of vigilantes started from (Batman, Max Payne, Hitman).
    As for Maula Jatt, we’ve seen quite a few counterparts (probably even more graphic) in the western media as well.
    For entertainment (on screen, fiction), we might endure this, but seeing this happen in real life, our humanity kicks in.

    “The Islamic Republic of Pakistan is a misnomer. Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state.”
    Will agree with you on this though. Recommend

  • Salman Elahi
    Aug 27, 2010 - 2:07PM

    most of the people commenting have ever been to rural land – sitting and sipping from their cozy suites people sure like to comment and pass judgment on what is Barbaric and what isn’t. lets go 10 yrs back – prior to the media revolution & the same folks had no clue about the width of breadth of this country. The media is nascent – learn to look thru or it. And What talk of about the gruesome movies reflecting culture. What about the Tarantino movies preaching vigilante justice – no that’s brilliant cinema. I am not even scratching the surface when it comes to violence on silver screen in the west and even in the East Asian cinema! Why are we turning a blind eye towards the general degradation of humanity across this planet. Satti is still practiced in India , Western nations continue to dominate in resources consumed and CO2 emissons. Just because its camouflage respectively behind the glitz and glory of bollywood and sky that we look the other way.
    George if you are blessed with some screen time , we dont expect you to produce the same rants as countless other columnists do. Give us your vantage point, mate!Recommend

  • Ghuffran Aman Ullah
    Aug 27, 2010 - 2:55PM

    I appreciate the fact that you refer to yourself as us. I am always astonished to see how can you, seeing all this around still feel Pakistani ? Lord of the Flies indeed. I had never made that connection but now that you say it very true indeed. I wonder how and if we will ever get out of this ? I am beyond words in expressing my gratitude I would say that even after all of this you still chose to be and feel Pakistani. Recommend

  • Saadiya
    Aug 27, 2010 - 3:09PM

    Oh!! so you want to bring history and barbarism into it?? Two words synonymous with both UK & USA!!! Go read your history books Mr. Fulton!!! the British history is full of murder, rape and Oppression….take the Tudor era…Henry VIII…what was the punishment for someone SUSPECTED of treason??? To be hanged, drawn and quartered was the penalty in England. And this was carried out till Edward I. The convicted were drawn by horse on a wooden hurdle to the place of execution, and once there were ritually hanged, emasculated, disembowelled, beheaded and quartered (chopped into four pieces). As a warning against further dissent, their remains were often displayed at prominent places, such as London Bridge. For reasons of public decency, women convicted of high treason were instead burnt at the stake. And who stood and witnessed this??? Everyone!! Even children….Don’t even get me started on Bloody Mary…

    You came, you invaded and after over 200 years of opressive rule left the people of the subcontinent to fight and die ….and are doing so till date….Recommend

  • Danish
    Aug 27, 2010 - 5:16PM

    I totally agree wid you George. i dont know when this mob will wake up from denial that its a nation state.Recommend

  • fatima
    Aug 27, 2010 - 5:39PM

    It is easy to state things as they are; Pakistan is a bloody nation and there is no way it would ever recover [as it seems from the situation]. the point however is if we write for a news paper we write more than facts, a solution may be or mold the heinous crimes so that they become a deterrent and not an inspiration instead. if you aren’t doing that there is no point writing an article….Recommend

  • Omair Shakil
    Aug 27, 2010 - 6:35PM

    George, it seems from the historical inaccuracies in your article, that your History teacher back in England went straight to the chapter on 1947 massacres and thought it best to skip the section on how the British plundered and looted the sub-continent and then just as an after thought decided to slice this huge land into incongruent bits and pieces. We can also never thank you guys enough for Kasmir and Junagadh, uncourteous creatures that we are! That said, I agree that our human rights record record is downright appaling and that we have more than our share of haters. I also agree that we can never absolve ourselves of the blame for the state that we are in but it is important to point out that the decay that we are has roots that run deep. Maybe our situation would have been different if the world hadn’t used us to fight their proxy wars; if instead of guns and bombs, we had been given books and stationary so that we could fill our empty schools with students. You have certainly identified the elephant in the room but your article whoich is heavy with bias and a lack of association with the people of this country makes me question your motives and your sincerety.
    George if you can’t be a part of the solution, then your realization of the problem has been a futile attempt. If you wan’t us to accept you as one of us, help us rectify.Recommend

  • Saif
    Aug 27, 2010 - 7:15PM

    It Reminded me of the movie the passion of Christ!

    Also the Vikings!

    And witch hunting in Europe.

    Or the school shootings of USA

    The problem is not in society all human beings are capable of great compassion and extreme voilance. The problem here is the LAW!
    It is in the interest of the police that we blame this indecent on our society. What we need to do is punish the police according to the law so that it never happens again. If we keeping making the lame excuse that our society is like this then the next boys can be our sons, and brothers!Recommend

  • RW
    Aug 27, 2010 - 9:01PM

    Perfection George!!Recommend

  • Tariq Rahim
    Aug 27, 2010 - 9:50PM

    The real problem is that this one heinous act unfortunately got taped and got beamed into your laps right in those comfort zones, and put your collective panties in a twist. Now you’re having to deal with this major wedgie, and all I see is self hatred about how terrible we all are as a people. Get over your inflated egos. This barbarism is a regular occurrence in our rural areas, where the majority of Pakistanis live, and no one there reads Express Tribune, much less blog on it. They have already moved on, and frankly would be surprised at all you Marie Antoinettes shaking your heads and proffering bread. Every rural person grows up scared of the whims of the local landlord and his police goons. Women get raped, kids get thrown in tandoors, and if you guys in the cities really did care about this society you would have done something in the last 60 years. But you’re so disconnected from reality in your cocoons that you scurry about from gated houses to private clubs, to booze and drugs, mainly to keep your spirits up. Why? Your lives seem to be perfect. I’ll have you know that most people in the rural areas are proud to be Pakis despite the lives they lead, which includes subsistence farming, food insecuriy, and perpetual exposure to environmental, biological and social hazards. So all you westernized wannabees, you deriding western influence in your country while dying to move there if you could, you are the hapless self-appointed intelligentsia who have really let this country down. Not the rural poor you so blithely pooh pooh as barbaric. You are no less cowardly in turning a blind eye, when you know all this goes on. You urban laptop cowboys, do something constructive otherwise you lose the right to rant. How dare you label the rest of us Pakis, when you comprise 2% of the country. No wait, that’s what you excel at. Go spank yourselves.Recommend

  • SM
    Aug 27, 2010 - 10:10PM

    Brave article indeed! Recommend

  • Aisha
    Aug 28, 2010 - 12:46AM

    This was an overly exaggerated article… written on some agenda…it was neither thought provoking nor was it based on facts that can be applied to our society. How much the writer has understood our culture… calling us barbarians and viewing this incident as a usual event happening on regular basis was really a big shock!!
    I wonder the goal of the writer. I consider this article as an effort to prove his hatred for this nation and I suggest such articles should not be allowed for publishing. Recommend

  • Aug 28, 2010 - 12:54AM

    Always love what you have to say. This country needs the bitter truth. And thanks for always telling it like you see it. this is what i call professional journalism.=D Recommend

  • mahlee
    Aug 28, 2010 - 1:01AM

    Kashif Malik

    he isnt wrong abt the partition, the pakistanis did all that brutality to yung bengali children, raped them for the sake of getting their partition.

    so he isnt wrong

    so everyone nids to know the fact before geting so defensive!!Recommend

  • mujtaba haydar
    Aug 28, 2010 - 3:13AM

    Why is everyone having a go at George and Great Britain? No Pakistani is in a position to point fingers at anyone at this moment. It makes me sick reading comments of people referring back to Britain’s colonial past in the sub-continent, but guess what? The Brits certainly did a good job in straightening your ancestors out, and their administration of that accursed land, that’s now come to be known as Pakistan, was the sort that old folk usually remember as being incorruptible, and to prove their point, they refer to many vestiges of infrastructure they left behind, which has outlasted anything this country has ever built in it’s 63 years of sordid history.
    I was amazed to read in the comments how someone stated the wanton barbarism being caught on camera as being “unfortunate”!!!! The startling psyche of the modern Pakistani. OK, so it has now come to a point where Pakistani’s are undertaking damage control by comparing themselves to India’s barbarism, such as their practice of Satti, and how the Indian Police are as much capable in their savagery as their Pakistani counterparts! But what surprises me is that almost every Pakistani is taught how to eloquently praise the peace loving religion of Islam, here the difference between the Hindus and Muslims becomes clear. Unfortunately, the orgasmic pleasure these Muslims seemed to have had in mauling the two innocent youths, even in their holiest of Months, was just too good for their religion to be given any thought. 1400 hundred years ago, there were a people who professed the same religion as Pakistani’s, and they literally butchered almost every member of the Prophet Muhammad (saww) family In karbala. Lets just cut to the chase, Muslims are cursed. And George, don’t you think it’s time to call it a day?.Recommend

  • Fatima
    Aug 28, 2010 - 5:26AM

    With due respect, I hope you are reading this. A nation should not be called barbaric because not the whole nation was involved. You are giving the example of Mulla Jat, let me tell you the number of horror movies are made in western countries(Hollywood). you go to a DVD shop you’ll find 10 different kinds of movies and all with disturb looking images on it. In every movie people are killed in a barbaric way and they cry for help and people enjoy watching that. CSI series, X-files:I want to believe what happens in this they are showing chopped parts of the bodies. There are number of horror movies made over there and the number of horror movies made here is compare to that is nothing. There have been so many barbaric incidents in west due to racism, religion, etc. You say that openly murder of the certain politician is barbaric what about Kennedy he was shot! Few years back there was an incident in America that bunch of high school girls at a play ground brutally tortured a Muslim girl and recorded it on there camera and they themselves put it on you tube and there were bunch of them who was watching, no body did anything. And this is the tip of the ice berg. Freedom is not an easy thing you get. People do get hurt. I am sure you have watched Brave heart wasn’t he fighting for freedom? Weren’t there people killed and slaughtered? So are westerns barbaric who watch horror movies for fun and shows like CSI, etc.Just because the country has Veto power and they are developed they can’t be baebaric. We are part of the third world country. Our country is 100 years back. So is it aloud to call us whatever they want.
    There are bunch of so called Muslims who are terrorizing the earth are all the Muslims butchers that what the west calls us that all the Muslims are terrorists! Are we Muslims terrorists? NO! our religion teaches peace. They say it like that because they see Muslims they don’t read about Islam none of us practicing Islam the way it is suppose to be but does that makes Muslims barbaric? Understand the situation that happened in Sialkot and blame the real culprits please do not call the whole nation equally involved in the crime. Our heart crys tears of blood about the incident we have to fight for justice. I would have totally agreed with you If you had written something about Judicial over here there is no doubt about it. There is no Law, justice for sure.
    People who are saying that your article is true and right. They are the ones who make our country look so bad. They speak about it just because they don’t like this country. Let me tell you the truth YOU CAN’T RUNAWAY FROM HERE, THIS IS YOUR HOME SO FIX IT AND MAKE IT A BETTER PLACE TO LIVE IN IT. You can’t runaway to some other countries. Our Indian brothers are much more Patriotic then we are. We are copying their dramas and lifestyle from the Dramas why can’t we also copy their patriotism. If we are going through mud on this country we are the ones who is going to get dirty….. May Allah show us the right path. Recommend

  • Khusro Kamran
    Aug 28, 2010 - 5:46AM


    What you wrote is unfortunately true. But, as a muslim one shouldn’t just blame things as they are because they were meant to be this way. No, as a muslim and an educated man, one should always be hopeful for the goodness in future.
    When Allah’s last messenger, Muhammmad PBUH was given prophethood, the land of Arabs was probably more barbaric than the present society of Pakistan. But, through his kind deeds and proper implementation of Islamic laws and behaviour, the world changed.
    Yes, Pakistan isn’t or never was a pure Islamic state, but don’t say it can never be, because hopelessness and despair are the signs of ‘kufr’ not islam.
    Islam is a message of hope and peace, its all about practising and teaching the right values to people, then the change can be seen and felt.
    Would love to have a disccussion with you.


  • Khusro Kamran
    Aug 28, 2010 - 5:50AM

    P.S. and one more thing, Lord of the Flies scenario occurs when one gets fearless of meeting God & have no sense of good and bad. It can happen anywhere, even in the west. Infact the civilised world of west changed after the dark ages, after they all got educated and when education was made compulsory.
    An illiterate society can go no where, we all have to work hard …all the educated cjass if we want to see a change and not the continuation of Lord of the Flies.Recommend

  • niyaz gul
    Aug 28, 2010 - 5:52AM

    Don,t abuse the whole nation please.Recommend

  • Aug 28, 2010 - 6:24AM

    Justice delayed is justice denial!Recommend

  • Sana
    Aug 28, 2010 - 9:05AM

    and the point is? this is who we are.. so we should not feel anything?
    and have you ever watched any R rated graphic hollywood movie? do you see this on their streets?Recommend

  • SRM
    Aug 28, 2010 - 10:20AM

    Simply emotional writing without solid grounds. There are so many flaws which i would have mentioned but they are already described by Mr. Zeeshan in his article.

    Aug 28, 2010 - 10:55AM

    mr. khurram has rightly depicited our present state of affairs. any who comes home in the evening in still one piece is most fortunateRecommend

  • muhammad arif
    Aug 28, 2010 - 11:29AM

    an absolut biased article by mr george. welcome to pakistan but before commenting on partition you must go through unbiasd history . it seems you are absolutetly ignorant of massacre of muslim men ,wemen,children caused by hindus and sikhs. countless inocent muslim wemen just to save their honour commited suicide by jumping into wells.
    well all pakistannies are neither barbaric nor moula jat but are as normal humen being and peace loving as any body else on earth.Recommend

  • M.R. Abidi
    Aug 28, 2010 - 1:15PM

    You don’t have any right to say anything like this. You belongs to a nation spreading this wildness all over the world. Every Pakistani is against this act of violence, we all condemned this act. This is your kind of people who portray Pakistan in such way. You really a looser George, why don’t you leave such and country and people?Recommend

  • Samandar Khan
    Aug 28, 2010 - 1:20PM

    Everyone’s upset about this event, there’s no doubt about it. However, most of you are using this incident and George’s emotional diatribe, as an opportunity to vent your own biases. All you bloggers fall into two groups, quite predictably exhibiting two distinct Paki traits. First there’s the, “wah wah, so courageous and articulate of you George, you’re the sole guy who speaks the truth.” Second there’s the knee jerk defensive trying to divert attention to Britain’s past (with the exception of Saadiya who was spot on), as well as the nefarious goings on in India, USA, Europe. To all of you, get off your cellulite laden butts and do something to improve your country. Don’t look for affirmation from others such as Time, Newsweek, CNN or George. Be honest to yourself first and see if you earn your own respect. The world’s respect will naturally follow. You whining bunch of city slickers make me sick, because its always about Pakistan being so terrible, when in reality you just want to be like the west and be liked by the west. You try and replicate those litle enclaves of ‘civility’ in the comfort of your high walled homes, but reality has a way of sneaking up on you and destroying your delicate delusion. You guys don’t even know what it means to be Pakistani. Do you know one person who belongs to the so called ‘barbaric’ rural poor? And your cook, driver and chowkidar doesn’t count. Get over your privileged angst. Be a giver not a taker.Recommend

  • Saira Rehman
    Aug 28, 2010 - 2:54PM

    In this article george tried to portray the real and gruesome picture of Pakistan but to claim that Pakistan is all about barbarism is not a just thing to do. I am not denying or wiping out these realities and acnnnot but to claim tat Pakistan is al about such brutalities and barbarism is not fair. We all respect and Love george but he should be bit conscious while certifying Pakistan as the land of killings and excessive massacres.Recommend

  • Anonymous
    Aug 28, 2010 - 4:33PM

    ‘The Sialkot murders are as Pakistani as truck art, biryani and loadshedding. This has always been an ugly reality of Pakistan and always will be.’ I’m shocked Express Tribune actually published your writing.
    Perhaps you would like to comment about the British/US ways of invading nations, starting wars, supplying ammunition, racism during partition, killings, murders etc etc etc etc.Recommend

  • SA
    Aug 28, 2010 - 5:46PM

    George, I feel glad that you consider yourself as part of Pakistan and have the courage to share the blame. The problem is that in order to criticize our society you’ve taken a very simplistic view. Maula Jutt is not a representation of our society it is a mythical figure made out to fight the injustices of our society. Doesn’t all super hero movies build upon this fact? case in point; Robin HOOD. Injustices occur all across the globe and human rights violations occur as much in USA as Pakistan. A girl gets raped every 10 minutes in USA so does that mean that the US society is corrupt as a whole? George you have embarked upon the symptoms rather than the root cuase of the disease. Injustice, Corrupt govt institutions, inefficient Judiciary and a failed political regime are the main reasons for all this abyss. Please stope ridiculing ‘US’ Pakistanis because you want to believe that we are a failed state. Please if you’ve chosen to be a Pakistani then do it with the best of intentions, not with the aim of self ridiculing and demoralizing us.Recommend

  • Omar Yousaf
    Aug 28, 2010 - 6:47PM

    ‎”If in your course, you don’t meet your equal, your better, then continue your course, firmly, alone. There’s no fellowship with fools”
    Mr. Fulton, I disagree sir… I totally disagree. Your article is sheer evidence of your lack of knowledge and respect of the culture, social norms and most importantly history of this country. You seem to have read a handful of books and selectively pecked upon a few incidents and episodes from the little past that you know of and extrapolated your opinion over the entire nation. But I’m not here to criticize you. I’m here to talk to the PAKISTANIS.
    I ask the hundreds of people who have read or commented on this article; look around yourself, you know at least a few hundred people around you. They may come from diverse backgrounds… young, old, educated, uneducated, moderate, extremists, Muslims, Christians. How many times have you seen or observed the barbaric tendencies the Mr. Fulton has referred to? Just ask yourself how many relatives, friends are like that or even have the audacity to think like that. Ask yourself this question many times over and I pray to God that your answer is NONE because my answer is NONE. Ask yourselves, if you hadn’t seen the Sialkot incident would you still say we are a monstrous lot. Please don’t label yourselves as barbaric, rapists, murderers because we are not.
    To label a nation as barbaric and degenerate one has to look at things in the right perspective. I would say world wars were barbaric in which British, German, French, Russians had the blood lust Mr. Fulton has conveniently labeled on to us. Both wars ensured more than 60 million dead with endless suffering later on. I would say dropping of a nuclear bomb on Japan was barbaric leaving more than 250,000 dead and millions suffering later on. Ask yourselves are we anyways closer to that? Now I don’t mean to sound like our politicians that since they did wrong, we are permitted to do so as well. The incident is worth criticizing and perpetrators be punished but to claim that this is the face of the entire nation is utter non-sense.
    Now for those who conveniently appreciated the article declaring viewpoints like “Brilliant”, “truth to its core”, “welcome to barbaristan”… SNAP OUT OF IT… read your history, read other nation’s history, understand why people do what they do and make a knowledgeable, well informed and a nationalistic comment rather than nodding your heads like puppets on a string.
    I come back to you now Mr. Fulton. Seems to me that you were longing to relate something to lord of the flies and you have successfully married a cow to a chicken finally. Being the representative of a so called civilized world, I had much respect for you as you – I thought – may understand the power of words and articulation but I am disappointed in you as well. Of my Nation I’m still not.
    Hopefully Yours,
    Omar YousafRecommend

  • Raza Naqvi
    Aug 28, 2010 - 7:31PM

    Sir, what a disgusting and above all incorrect generalisation. You have vilified an entire nation, an entire culture based on the actions of a few hundred people. Where is the justice in that? Nay, where is the sense in that?Recommend

  • Mahvish
    Aug 28, 2010 - 7:49PM

    with due respect sir,your article is based on lack of information. This situations you have built appears to be in Guantanamo bay ……
    we accept that there needs to built strict law and order ,but No nation is perfect. This is not happening in Pakistan alone. You can find these brutal stuff in all over the world. But We condemn this, and hope so if the criminals will be punished then these sort of killings will never gonna happen again.Recommend

  • Mehreen
    Aug 28, 2010 - 8:03PM

    Here goes another one with a superiority complex passing generalisations and judgment on all. I disagree with Samandar Khan, there are a lot who commented here who fit neither slot/category he’s forcing them into, they are many who have well articulated our angst at being rubbished and called barbarians.
    Ironically, those countless people who are breaking their backs these days helping out aren’t the ones complaining, when they’re the ones actually dealing with the reality of things. These are the people who need to be projected, because they inspire good, they motivate, they move.

    May God bless the 2 boys and give their family courage to bear their brutal murder, and may we as a society overcome these evils, Inshallah. Countries/Societies have been through worse, I am sure we can beat this if we support each other, calm isn’t attainable by spreading hate and mistrust. Recommend

  • sam
    Aug 28, 2010 - 8:07PM

    “Rather than drawing inspiration from the Holy Quran, our nation models itself on another book — a book in which children become savages. Pakistan is not the land of the pure — we are Lord of the Flies.”
    superbly put… couldn’t agree more..Recommend

  • Aug 28, 2010 - 9:19PM

    You have written this very concisely about what we are, and have become and will continue to progress unless average pakistani comes out very strongly condemning all the violence & corruptions. this shall take place in every office, school, college, or a place of business to show that it won’t be tolerated.Recommend

  • fatima
    Aug 28, 2010 - 10:37PM

    i felt angry after reading your article, but you are entitled to your own opinion. But you have your facts all wrong. Sure, Pakistan was made at the cost of many lives, but don’t isolate Pakistan’s history from the world’s and call us Barbaric and don’t refer to my country as a degenerate nation. just open up a history book and read about all the “revolutions”, the civil wars, the world wars, the genocides, the mutinies and the colonialism that raged havoc in the world, and please don’t forget to read who it was caused by. Sure, we’re a state in trouble, drowning not only in the flood waters but many other problems,yet that doesn’t give you or any other Pakistani citizen to call me a barbarian. I did not beat those two boys to death, i did not drown hundreds of villages to save my land, and neither did i send those drones that kill children and women who are written off as collateral damage. Bloodshed may be a part of Pakistan’s history, but it does not define us. Understand that, and remember it. Recommend

  • Anonymous
    Aug 28, 2010 - 10:55PM

    well written and true to the core ! this is our reality , Sadly !Recommend

  • Aug 28, 2010 - 10:59PM

    Well said George i understand the morale of the story and that is tolerence ..yes we need to change our attitude. i salute ur bravery and i respect your patriotism. I don’t know how long it will take us to learn and how long we will coupe with all this..

    Majority of Pakistani’s are sad at this but yes it is not the first time, what happened in Karachi some suspected bandits were BURNED to death by the mob. we can find many justifications and there are justifications.
    I want to ask you guys a question doesn’t our religious people encourage public punishments. many of us admire the Iranian revolution why? All of us know the answer.

    But anyways Nothing will change we are hypocrite society we want others to change not ourselves ..i will give you an example when i came back to pakistan i rented a portion and in the first month i got an overreaded bill, when i asked my landlord he started swearing at wapda and the system but i come to know that he was the one stealing electricity…

    we need to change ourselves, (apnay giraban main jhankain hum sab) self accountability. Recommend

  • Kazim Merchant
    Aug 28, 2010 - 11:21PM

    Why single out pakistanis? Was this any worse than the Minnesota (duluth) lynching of 1920? Or Nazi Germany? or the massacre by the British at the jalianwala bagh? Or Rwanda? Or Hiroshima? Humans are too complex foryour simple mind to understand. People are people. I feel sick about Sialkot. But it’s a human problem, not necessarily a Pakistani one.Recommend

  • ehte
    Aug 28, 2010 - 11:43PM

    True but twisted towards the wrong angle. the wrongs in a society can only be blamed on the upbringing of the society as a whole as well as the twisted sense of morality that have been conditioned by increasing lawlessness and perceived religious rigidness.Recommend

  • Rabia Ezdi
    Aug 28, 2010 - 11:46PM

    Of course I’m not entirely surprised, because Pakistan-bashing is the fashionable thing these days.
    Taking the negative and extreme segments of any society and projecting them as a reflection of the entire nation is stupid, ignorant and shallow. There is no country in the world that does not have elements of crime and injustice. Not to forget Mr Fulton’s country of origin, which despite calling itself ‘civilized’, is full of daily stories of psychotic ‘human rights abuses’: young people murdering innocent children, mothers killing their own babies, racial hate-crimes till this day, and much more.
    The article does no more than bring down the ‘Express Tribune’ as legitimate journalism. Congratulations, your newspaper has just turned into a joke. Recommend

  • Wasim Kakakhel
    Aug 28, 2010 - 11:57PM

    Somehow George, I’m not buying this “we Pakistanis” line of reasoning. Its good old fashioned, looking down your nose, sneering, and you don’t get a free pass just by using ‘we’. Your article reads better and sounds more sincere if one substitutes ‘you Pakis’ for ‘we’. Your voyeuristic take on Pakiland as defined by a cult movie and a bloody partition, makes little sense. Maybe you should watch George Gittoes’ movie ‘The Miscreants of Taliwood’, since he seems to get it. The ‘it’ being where reality ends and the surreal vigilante heros of Punjabi cinema take over. Grow up, take a stroll around your newly adopted home, soak it in, and then share your views. Your fulminating has got all these London vacationing types in a lather. Be wary of the power you wield over this insignificant minority of self loathing Pakis.Recommend

  • Ali
    Aug 29, 2010 - 1:22AM

    praising such articles is ironic
    “brilliant” “awesome” bla bla

    i dont agree at some places
    pakistan had once been a peaceful land… where people in even big cities like karachi used to sleep in their open verandas without locking their doorsRecommend

  • Maryam
    Aug 29, 2010 - 1:25AM

    And you are a Pakistani? How dare you.

    Your article is farthest from the truth. You are treated with kindness and welcomed into a community and you reward the nation by a vitriolic outburst as one would expect from an angry, ill informed, individual who thinks he knows all.

    Shame on you George. it is NOT your PakistanRecommend

  • Shahid Khan
    Aug 29, 2010 - 1:52AM

    Dear George, nice article and It’s a kind of self-reflection. We must look within, identify the problems and mistakes and then try to overcome and correct them. This article gives some food of thought. But I wish you’d have finished it with some hope for the already depressed, sad and hopeless Pakistanis. Recommend

  • Aug 29, 2010 - 2:07AM

    @maryam that is realy bad of u ..who are u to disqualify him from being a pakistani he is a pakistan and more pakistani than us because we were born here but he suffered for becoming pakistan when many pakistanis were want to leave this country or left it…Recommend

  • Muhammad Afaq Shaikh
    Aug 29, 2010 - 2:18AM

    this is the saddest article george…ur hate for pakistan is coming out….its not Pakistan but some people….u have lived here and u know Pakistan has a bright side too…i have seen u attending salsa sessions n u n ur wife dancing with others…..stop spreading the negative image of the country in the west…..if u hate pakistan so much …go back..Recommend

  • Maryam
    Aug 29, 2010 - 2:23AM

    Do not generalize. There is plenty to fix in Pakistan, but to demonize and disrespect an entire nation in this way is not acceptable. Citizenship is no attained by gaining a passport, it is by wanting to call it a home. And when your home is messy, you fix it but you done call its dwellers flies, cockroaches or genetically lacking.Recommend

  • Adnan Cyprian
    Aug 29, 2010 - 2:24AM

    Mr Fluton is right. And a lot of the comments given here are a testament to George is saying.This is not the first time and it would not be the last. The only difference is that there is a video. So please dont act surprised. Recommend

  • Anonymous
    Aug 29, 2010 - 3:10AM

    We’re all Pakistanis here and I think we need to accept these problems as our own. Why is it that we are giving lists upon lists of other countries where these human right abuses are also taking place? Do we WANT to be like them? Just because something is inherent in man does not mean that we should not correct it. And I agree with George. Pakistani society is indeed a very violent one if only because of the failure of the system as a whole than any Pakistani liking of violence. While saying this we must remember that it is we ourselves who have let this happen and the sooner we accept this the better it will be. Women ARE being tortured, raped, murdered_ you name it, it’s happening to us. Minorities ARE being oppressed. And the most odious part is that some of these criminals are those that sit in the parliament, who get paid from the taxes a select few of us choose to pay to the state. We DO lack communicating skills. Instead of arguing with reason, we, myself included start bashing the one whose point of view we don’t agree with (I use the excuse that I’m Pakistani so I have the birth-right to hate India_ I’m not proud. Ok secretly I do get pleasure from it.) While watching this I do not blame those standing by, they’re probably too scared and being in a crowd everybody expects somebody else to help and history HAS shown us when people join mobs, they lose their conscience. The one to blame here is the policeman but more than that, his superiors, and more than that I blame myself. Instead of bashing the Police maybe if I could gather the courage to get recruited the system could really improve.
    What happened here was a case of people choosing to punish rather than prevent. Being unhealthily obsessed with religion, we still think we have the right to punish someone instead of preventing him from doing further harm. Lord of the Flies being one of my favourite books, I couldn’t agree more with George’s comparison. I think I should add here that just a few days ago, I had to sign a paper which said that I agreed to all Ahmedis being non-Muslims and I did. And every one of us has signed that paper. The officials at NADRA or the passport office don’t even give it any importance. These lines are the fine print to being a Pakistani but I wonder what these lines mean to Ahmedis. With so much inequality and oppression in our society it was only a matter of time till we resorted to violence.Recommend

  • Sonia Qadir
    Aug 29, 2010 - 3:13AM

    This article is wrong on SOOO many levels! I actually can’t believe I’m reading this. Is it just me or there’s like this trend for foreigners who come to live in Pakistan to talk about us in such racist terms? (because this is certainly not the first time I’m witnessing such comments from a foreigner residing in Pakistan).

    So we are barbarians? I suppose it must be in our genes, George? Quite unfortunate that 300 years of rule from your Superior and Civilized White Nation could not cure us of our disease. And of course I should not mention colonialism or the fact that Europe and USA are built on the exploitation, brutal murder and torture of people of the rest of the world. No need to mention that the British Raj created the problems, the cracks in our social fabric that have not healed even now. Because of course all that violence, and social/legal “ordering” was merely your attempt to cleanse the rest of us (the inferior, backward, barbarian races) of our disease!!!

    Oh Maula Jutt is horrifying? Well I completely understand George. Hollywood, US and British Television is after all SO peaceful,all about love and caring about each other, and humanity in general. A severed limb!!! Just imagine! I have never seen anything like that in Hollywood. Horror oh Horror!

    Some fools would ask at this point “what about Iraq? What about Afghanistan? What about the millions of people who die of aerial bombing of Your Highness The Civilized West? What about the victims of Napalm attacks? What about Hiroshima and Nagasaki?”
    Oh what foolish people! As i’m sure you would tell them in your infinite wisdom George, the West has only done that for our own good!
    After all, its only fair that drone attacks kill scores of innocent civilians in a country where 2 children were once beaten to death by an angry mob. Only fair!

    Thanks for trying to save us George!! I’m sure your White Man’s Burden must be quite hard to bear!! Recommend

  • moyn
    Aug 29, 2010 - 4:26AM

    i so totally agree with the analysis given by the writer. whatever he has said is 100% true about us. but , come on!! there HAS to be SOME solution- SOME light at the end of this dark tunnel of savagery!Recommend

  • Kauser
    Aug 29, 2010 - 9:10AM

    What George has written is something that many of us cannot deny. Brutality, utter disrespect of everything and everyone not concerned with oneself, anger, lawlessness, hatred and sadism are the norms of the code of conduct of majority in Pakistan. Those of us who take time to reflect on the happenings of the last 2-3 decades will certainly realize that we are going down (light speed) a slippery steep slope.

    Those familiar with history are reminded of the Roman amphitheaters, the Colosseum and the entertainment which always involved death and destruction;the barbaric show of strength by the Mongols; lynching and burning of women and men in Medieval Europe; the German and Japanese atrocities of war, the Lynching and burning of Africans in US, the genocide in Africa, the bloody revolutions and many more. Thus atrocities committed cannot be pinned to a race, religion, color of skin, culture, or richness/poverty. it seems that every nation has had its fair share of brutality and victimization.
    What should be (and hopefully is’) of concern is how to get out of this. We are fortunate to have successful examples from history of nations who have shaken off the shackles of ignorance, brutality, and apathy. These need to be studied with a focus on steps to be taken and how to go about it considering the diverse cultural, ethnic and religious and educational background of this nation (if I may call it thus). Many of us are aching lets get together for the purpose of rising from the abyss.

  • Mehwish Mughal
    Aug 29, 2010 - 10:18AM

    I agree with Mr. Fulton and I am not going to defend myself as a Pakistani.
    If we are globally labelled as extremists, it is our own created image. The Sialkot murders are not the first, our Nation has been in this kind of frenzy for a long time.
    I am in grief, and ashamed to be a Pakistani.Recommend

  • Hasan Mir
    Aug 29, 2010 - 11:13AM

    I cannot disagree with your post, it hits the sweet spot. This is not an isolated incident, and will continue to happen if something isn’t done. What can be done about it? And so, I pose the following question.

    What are articulate and well educated people such as yourself doing about it other than posting online, what can best be described as a long rant accomplishing nothing?Recommend

  • Anoosh Khan
    Aug 29, 2010 - 12:31PM

    We are becoming “Lord of the Flies” by the minute now! A thought provoking piece, indeed! In fact another parallel can be Shakespeare’s mob in Julius Caesar and their treatment of Cinna the poet. I think your appropriation of our violent and sadist dispositons is well taken especially when we personify it in the form of culturally symbolic silver screen heroes!Recommend

  • Umar farooq
    Aug 29, 2010 - 12:35PM

    excellent article Recommend

  • Sameer Iqbal
    Aug 29, 2010 - 12:53PM

    Mr Fulton,

    I dont quite agree with what you have written about Pakistan. It is too much generalisations!!Recommend

  • Aug 29, 2010 - 1:43PM

    Alas!!! A sad but a true account of our nation and its society.Recommend

  • Mehreen
    Aug 29, 2010 - 3:43PM

    Well said Wasim Kakakhel.Recommend

  • Aug 29, 2010 - 3:57PM

    George, You are right at some places but you cannot generalize all Pakistanis for being bloodthirsty and vindictive.. We are Pakistanis too and we strongly condemn what happened in Sialkot. How do you define our actions? We are also a part of this nation and this society. Recommend

  • Omer Chauhan
    Aug 29, 2010 - 10:42PM

    Janab George, I really Appreciate you writing such an in-depth article about the “barbaric” history of our nation…. but I Disagree with you on the fact that it is not our NATION that is Barbaric. It’s a few good for nothing hooligans that get the best of our national media….. What about the day to day shootings in America? or the extremely degenerated social life in South Africa? or the constant Racism the entire global family has to face when they visit Australia???? people execute innocents in Japan too… In Serbia, Israel, Ghana, Uzbekistan, China……. What makes you say Pakistanis are savages???? As for your counts of Pakistani barbarism;

    American Civil War (1861-1865) Total Deaths… 620,000.
    America is among the top in Rape, Murder, Theft, Fraud, and
    Robberies cases.
    Abraham and Kennedy were both assassinated.
    Have you seen Gangs of New York, or the Recent Punisher flick???
    and for the MEDIEVAL violent ARABIA, The Christians too had their Crusaders, and believe me or read for yourself….. they were even more Savage than the Arabs you call “Violent”

    May Peace and Truth be Blessed on you……… Salam Alaikum.Recommend

  • rashid
    Aug 29, 2010 - 10:47PM

    You are not wrong George….how can you be … despite spending time here u can never feel and understand like ORIGINAL people of the land. You still represent people who first tells you that “u have a right to remain silent” and then torture you to death for mustering courage to do the same. I don’t even need to get your attention on larger than life horrific events which stand out to negate whatever CIVILIZED nations project about themselves to deprived nations. I will only request you that prior to commenting on something like that first do read newspapers of civilized nations which are full of beating to death, baseball bat master piece strokes, artistic stabbings, in discriminate democratic firing incidences which will prove to you that the any human(s) possess the tendency to do horrible acts and this phenomenon can not be associated with any group of ppl, nation or area.

    Your reference to riots and massacre during partition seems totally irrelevant and misplaced more like Israeli policemen blaming “Nazi death concentration camps” for killing young Palestinian boy!. One got to understand the reasons and references in appropriate manner prior to branding nation as barbaric and blood-thirsty. Yes we have our problems, yes we need to improve in lot of areas but it does not give anyone a reason to write us off as a nation. Thanks to our CIVILIZED FRIENDS strategy of treating us like guinea pigs we have never been allowed to think beyond the aspect of from where to get the next meal so expecting such nations to groom themselves in 64 years is something really far stretching for someone with appropriate knowledge.

    And the movie reference taking Maula Jutt as role model is really clumsy. I mean if that aspect is taken as bench mark then half of India is illegitimate, 50% of American men are psycho killers while remaining 50% are out to save the world single handedly, all british men can jump from any building without getting hurt etc. Stores are full of movies in which Gora hero’s went on a killing spree however ironically those being killed are mostly muslim terrorist therefore does not matter at all to you or the ppl u represent.

    We as a nation shall re-emerge from our miseries and mis-fortunes to prove people like you wrong… we know its going to be a long and difficult task but No one will come from OUTSIDE the Country or the World to do that but OURSELF.

    Meanwhile You relocate owing to your FFC “Free Flies Syndrome” as WE can manage.

    Rashid MahboobRecommend

  • Syed Hasan Haider
    Aug 30, 2010 - 3:09AM

    I must say, a very well written piece up there.

    I have read the comments and I have been reading whatever has been written after the incident. I am glad that majority of the people take the situation very seriously and see them selves being represented in the mob, which looked on and did noting to stop that barbarism, that day in Sialkot. I if you guys remember such an incident isn’t new. There thieves have been burned and killed in Karachi before. The only difference this time is that the thieves killed this time we not guilty. I have to admit that when these sort of incidents took place before, no one wrote about them. No one condemned then, in contrast people were found praising the mob which took the lives of those cellphone thieves in Karachi. If only these incidents were taken action against, this very saddening and depressing incident wouldn’t have taken place.

    We are not a failed country, we are a failed nation. I can’t see even a single characteristic of the nation which Iqbal dreamed of and Jinnah fought for, in our nation today. We need to stop being selfish. We need to start thinking about the people around us. We need to think if what we are doing is going to affect any one else or not. We juts need to THINK! Think about the future of this country. Who is shaping the future of this country? You? Me? Or someone who is an outsider? Are we in control?Recommend

  • Majid
    Aug 30, 2010 - 4:02AM

    Pakistanis all over the world are greiving for these boys and their family. You need to remember that these two beautiful boys and their civilised family are also Pakistani. After seeing how well they conducted themselves in interviews and how patient and strong they are to have to live with the aftermath of this, you need to remember they too are Pakistani. So there is hope. We can bash ourselves all we want, but this one incident is a wake up call for Pakistanis everywhere. Thanks to the Pakistani media who has told this story to the world. The main culprits need to be punished, but also every single ‘police officer’ and ‘rescue worker’ who was watching is just as guily. I hope this incident shakes and wakes up Pakistan and some positive big changes occur in all of the country’s institutions. Every Pakistani should know the names of these two boys and what they went through. It is time for all to come together as one and say ‘NEVER AGAIN’.Recommend

  • Aug 30, 2010 - 8:02AM

    its true, but to change things we all have to step forward, what has happened was our past for present and the future we should stand one and fight for this barbaric attitude, as in bible, PS 1:6 For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.
    Process is slow, but not impossible..only we have to work continuously, because consistency is that one problem which lacked in every aspect of our life.
    Good effort kept it up. Recommend

  • Rabia Khan
    Aug 30, 2010 - 10:13AM

    You are the perfect example of the Western Liberals that are spreading the paranoia of Pakistan’s Failure as a Nation and Humans. I live in London, a city known for its “Sophistication”, “Civilization” and “Humanitarian Acts”, yet only I as a citizen know the murky, dirty facts about the city of “BIG BEN TOWER”. Some may find this very amusing but even us Londoners don’t have immunity against violent acts of crime committed by the commoners, we also have youth killing and recording their victims and the Police not ever being where they need to be. At least in Pakistan a murderer is occasionally caught and sentenced to death. Here in the UK, the home of “Human Rights”, an eighteen month old known as Baby P, was repeatedly battered, boxed and abused until each bone in his body was broken, and eventually killed after weeks of abuse from his keepers. The killers sentenced for two and a half years and a little community service. Not far from where I work, a boy was stabbed by a youth mob, in broad daylight, for no apparent reason, the killer; a seventeen year old caught and transferred to juvenile jail. There have been fourteen incidents of youth killing and mobile video recording in the span on one week, right in the heart of the Capital of England. These killings do not include cannibalism, drug crimes, bank frauds, robberies, battering of elderlies and the vulnerable members of society for their belongings, car theft, family feuds, rape, incest rape, domestic violence, kidnapping, racism, drink driving, gun crimes, political scandals of corruption and local council corruption and benefit thefts that seem to be the life of the local news each week. It is a jungle out here, but the tale of these internal crimes and warfare never reach the headlines of the National papers, let alone the international Media. The people of this country, don’t bat an eyelid over these stories, look at the reaction of Pakistani nation, it’s a blessing. If this was an English paper and you were addressing the British Nation in a British paper, this wouldn’t go past the first proof reading. We need columnists that can write the truth not rant on about all the frustrations he/she has been bottling up inside only to vomit it all out for all of us to read, keep your opinions to yourself thank you, give us some hard hitting, genuine and quality journalism so than the reader may establish, that these are acts of the minor barbarians amongst us and we, the condemning are in fact much larger in number and that together we can succeed in putting an end to this custom, and understand, be that as it may, our sanity is still intact, we are still a very strong and peaceful nation.Recommend

  • Usama Ahmed
    Aug 30, 2010 - 10:27AM

    Well done George. I like your insight about us. I firmly agree to what you have writen about pakistani nation. Recommend

  • Yasir Javeed
    Aug 30, 2010 - 11:54AM

    An honest and illuminated rendering not only conditioning Pakistan but the globe with “The Only” remedy.

    ‘Wo Zamane Ma Moazaz tha Muslman ho kar’
    ‘They’ were respected in the world, as Muslims’
    ‘Tum Khar Hoa Tareeka Quran Ho Kar’
    ‘You’ are disgraced since you left the Quran’ (Iqbal)Recommend

  • Arshad Taqi
    Aug 30, 2010 - 1:09PM

    I am impressed by the response from “Patriotic Pakistanis” to this article. We have built a strong defence with arguments “like look into your own history you bloody Goras”; “it was only a few of us, don’t generalize”; “we don’t need your advice George, we can look after ourselves”; “Indian and Hollywood movies show more violence than Maula Jutt”.
    This is clearly a case of collective responsibility and let us accept it, we have failed miserably. Sialkot is not the first incident. We watched as Christians, Ahmedis, Shias and alleged decoits were butchered by mobs in frenzy. Those events were forgotten and so will this one be once the media has something else to sell in your living rooms. By the way; does anyone know what happened with those high powered inquiry committees set up to investigate and bring the culprits of those incidents to justice?
    Go on living in your glorious past and dream of a wonderful future, meanwhile stick your collective heads in the sand and pretend ALL IS WELL. Recommend

  • Sabih
    Aug 30, 2010 - 6:05PM

    Thank you George….All of them act like ducklings when Ahmadi’s are mentioned. They fear the Mullah more than GodRecommend

  • Lord Achichi
    Aug 30, 2010 - 7:12PM

    “We are, and have always been, a barbaric, degenerate nation revelling in bloodlust. Our nation was forged during a bloody partition — in which up to one million people were massacred. One just has to read eyewitness accounts of the riots, the train butchery, the brutal rapes and slaughter of that period to get a feel of the heady, almost orgasmic, delight that the perpetrators of these crimes revelled in as the nation was born.”

    Am I the only one who finds this HILARIOUS. I mean seriously George. Seriously. Recommend

  • ahmed
    Aug 31, 2010 - 12:48AM

    to people criticizing george’s pakistani-ness, why dont you criticize bilawal and all your other so called leaders and their families having their everything abroad. George is a Pakistani and lives here, i guess its more pakistani then many.Recommend

  • sam
    Aug 31, 2010 - 12:59AM

    As a nation each of us is responsible including george whatever happened in sialkot as none of us dear to change the system. we just mutter words of condemnation and get our own way. I am contradicting George for the harsh language used against our country existence for which million of muslim lives has been sacrificed. The only way of survivability is to change centuries old system of our governance inherited from british. Recommend

  • Aug 31, 2010 - 4:16AM

    george is more pakistani, dare i say the type jinnah would have been proud of. the fear of allah in these pakistanis of today is gone replaced by the fear of the mullahRecommend

  • k k
    Aug 31, 2010 - 7:17AM

    I would rather comment on comments, one cannot not feel the pseudo patriotism conveyed by some of the commentators, why shoot the messanger, isn’t what George said is true in every sense of the word, isn’t “budmashi” a merit in this country. Aren’t all traits of Pakistani culture shared or lamented by George true. But like always you hide under the garb of religon or patriotism(in this case the later) to shoot down a logical discourse, I don’t know why it hurts some of us when some migrant Pakistani shows us our true colours. Recommend

  • Ahmed Ayub
    Aug 31, 2010 - 1:53PM

    I wont take this from you George. Not from you.Recommend

  • Saira
    Aug 31, 2010 - 4:32PM

    I want to quote Margaret Mead here:
    “Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.”

    Alright, agreed! We are seeing brutality, torture, murder, death, torture, corruption and we shouldn’t act surprised. We shouldn’t waste time being surprised, those who feel that what is happening is wrong should come together to make changes for the better.
    What good does it do by sitting back, and point out the ills & evils of a society that you are yourself living in? If a person cared, they would try and find solutions for it, not just sit and complain & whine.
    What we shouldn’t do is write articles like this gentleman who just sit and demoralise a society already ravaged by poverty, corruption, disasters, etc. He is not offering any solutions, trying to understand where the brutality came from, the why, where & specially the How. How can we – the individuals making this society as a whole- can make a difference towards a better Pakistan, despite all this brutality.
    You’re article isn’t helping, it’s only making peeople feel worse. The reason why it’s not helping, is because this gentleman has empathy with/for/towards the people of this country or even towards humans at large. He’s the type who will sit, complain, whine, bicker…but never actually go out there and solve any problem.Recommend

  • Waqas Ahmed
    Aug 31, 2010 - 4:36PM

    I’m gutted to read this article, the way you generalized the whole nation as barbaric is utterly disappointing. The protest against this barbaric act by a mob of few heartless beasts in itself is a proof that the nation is not supportive of such acts. You should realize that such kind of incidents happen all over the world where there is no rule of law particularly in third world countries.Recommend

  • Naveed khan
    Aug 31, 2010 - 8:23PM

    I think George wrote this out of anger and hatred for the people that that are responsible for such disgusting and barbaric act,I agree with that, but I think He is just trying to convince himself that this nation has been and will be full of violence, well let me be honest , as long as foreigners who have ruled this part of the continent keep telling us all this, we can never step out of the violent times and move towards something civilized, we became animals because of the atrocities and slavery forced on us by the British, in those days people who fought or got killed were called freedom fighters, and finally when it all got out of control, they left everyone fighting over land, so they can save themselves. WE ARE THE PRODUCT OF WARS AND FIGHT FOR FREEDOM, and all this has not given any Pakistani time to get educated or even build a civilized nation, every year something happens which pushes us back into the past, and we are forced to start all over.Nations require consistency to build civilized and positive race, we are just fight for food. Recommend

  • Aug 31, 2010 - 10:43PM

    i m quite disappointed to read this article and fasi zaka’s generalising every Pakistani as barbaric! the world is being ruled by political agendas that are structured by US and European first worlds and i dont need to say how peaceful they are…thus giving arguments such as Maula Jutt being violent is quite a weak one..what about many english films that display equal amounts of killings and video games that sell because of their levels of violence…Recommend

  • sobo
    Aug 31, 2010 - 11:14PM

    im tryign to be as unbiased as possible… but you may have shown what is going on here in Pakistan, however, you highlighted maula jat… what about all the hollywood, bollywood, french, german etc movies? what do they portray? are they all about butterflies and love thy neighbour? im sorry i dont agree with the example you quoted of the film…

    yes you are right about pakistan never being a peacful land… but my friend.. the same applies in the rest of the world… remember the time the skinheads in the midlands in the UK beat and murdered the innocent muslims “for the fun of it”? rem the israelis “defend themselves” by killing hundreds of innocent muslims? remember the time the weapons of mass destruction was so hyped up… people were killed there? are they all not in the same state? WE THE WORLD TOGETHER ARE GOIG NTHROUGH THIS… ITS UNJUST FOR ANYONE TO POINT FINGERS AT ANY ONE INDIVUDUAL OR NATION….

    i do relaize you consider urself pakistani, which is great…. but id like to see how you would portray a picture of the west if they were in a similar situation.. “Dont act surprised” by my comments however i am surprised about the sialkot killings not only that it was a one off case but because i actually saw it with my own eyes for the first time which is why i feel stronger about this than about the zillions of rapes, killings, injustices that i read about in the paper… God bless us all. Recommend

  • Farooq
    Sep 1, 2010 - 1:51AM

    “the attempt to achieve and maintain justice, or to undo or prevent injustice, is the one and only universal cause of violence”
    –Violence By James GilliganRecommend

  • mariam
    Sep 1, 2010 - 6:37AM

    guys..we all need to go out of pakistan more..or come back to pakistan that..if we become culturally sensitive…we can communicate that back in pakistan..i can never let go of my matter how stinky and degenerated they have become..i need to focus..and do more for the country that’s just headed for disastor all thanks to our lack of initiative..Recommend

  • jawad
    Sep 1, 2010 - 8:20AM

    hey guyz wait a sec…all of you just agreeing and blaming pakistan and its cultural values adb blah blah blah….its ssoooo easy to just log on and read articles and leave comments …our society is like that because all of you guyz are not there….u guyz are all sitting abroad and passing comments…its so very easy to do that…i am not being extra patriotic here…i know there are problems..i knoe there is ill literacy but to blame us and our people for the voilance at the partition in which we were the victims…and there is anger and frustration in our society reasons are many…load sheading,corrutption,inflation rates…etc..even the people who did this act..their own homes were robbed and they never got justice so frustation is there…but even this dosent justify what they did..but dont potray us like we were barbrist n we will be like this…if u are a real patriot then come the part of the system.bring the change,u join the system the others will follow u.huh all of u just sitting in your laptops and just going through the articles…come out come in pakistan..join the goverment institutes…join police and give justice.join other departments whatever u r expert in…y to wait for some miracle to happen and change our fourtune up side down!!!!y to always blame others and the country..huh..we are country we are pakistan..dont forget while passing any comments that u are sayin all this to ur self!.Recommend

  • Mustafa
    Sep 1, 2010 - 8:52AM

    George with great, who are you to decide that Pakistan is barbaric?. What if I had all the power in the world and through propaganda, media, staging out things, setting up things against you, I start a negative propaganda? Wouldn’t the public think you are not fit to live in this country? They will. That is what is happening to Pakistan.

    As to your response to the only film that you might have seen which is Pakistani , what do you call the films ‘SAW’ parts 1,2,3,4,5,6 ?
    What do you call the case of Dr.Afia?

    You need to actually broaden your mindset. If you have the power to spread out the word and reach people why not use it in a positive way to reflect Pakistan, mind it, it’s very easy to point fingers at some one but to go and correct things it’s difficult.

    The Story of Pakistan, its struggle and its achievement, is the very story of great human ideals, struggling to survive in the face of great odds and difficulties. – JinnahRecommend

  • Talia Shahbaz
    Sep 1, 2010 - 6:48PM


  • Natasha Raza
    Sep 2, 2010 - 2:39PM

    **@ KKK LOVERS

    I never realized how complex the life of a self-loathing bitter cockrach can be. Perhaps Fasi Zaka could use your little note as inspiration for his next masterpiece entitled “The memoirs of a iconoclast Parasite”.
    I cant wait for it, im sure its gonnaa be a cynical gem enriched with some more of Zaka’s classic revelations of “Reason why this country is a hellhole”.

    And than again, why shouldnt Zaka be a critic of the very place that has given him his Identity and sustainance. In fact, we all as “Infectious Pests of this Planet”, should JOIN FASI in crippling this country of its well being. Its something that would be more easier to do than actually working for the betterment of this nation. Afterall we have been fighting for Pakistans prosperity for decades now….. why not just give up and count our riches (like this herald author). Im just positive that thats exactly what we need and for that THANKYOU eR. FASI. You are surely the revolutionist that is needed to mend this wretched country of its disease, and it’s people!Recommend

  • Aown Kazmi
    Sep 2, 2010 - 2:46PM


    Hi my name is Amima and i am the biggest supporter of KKK. One of my main dilemma in life is that I have a GREEN PASSPORT, which means that I always get my visa refused to the ALMIGHTY United States of America! In my leisure time and in the comfort of my air-conditioned room, I enjoy dewelling and sulking on Everything and Anything that is wrong with this Godforsaken place that I have been SHUNNED IN!!! I have an extremely low self-esteem but I cope with it by bashing and thrashing everyone around me. I have recently been woken up from my deep stupor of disillusion and have finally been enlightened by the works of The Great Master Mr.FASI ZAKA and his ingenious side kicks. I have no shame of being called a COCKROACH infact I am worse than that. I am the filth of the world, the unwanted spa of humanity, the scum that is more disgusting then all things rotten that crawl on this earth and by only acknowledging and accepting that i can totally be set free of my useless, worthless, shallow and benign existance. Oh WHY CANT OTHER PEOPLE ALSO ACCEPT THIS….WHY? WHY? WHY? WHY DON’T THEY ADMIT THIS HARSH BITTER REALITY AND STAND CORRECTED by big patriots and nationalists like George Fulton. Afterall more than anyone else’s, IT IS George ka Pakistan, isn’t it???Recommend

  • Omer Chauhan
    Sep 2, 2010 - 4:21PM

    @Aown Kazmi: Extremely well said, That is their exact “point of view” of our Nation, and our Country.Recommend

  • usman
    Sep 2, 2010 - 6:36PM

    I agree with the article except for “and it never will be”. I believe theres still hope for us all. I loved the article except for the disappointed undertone but then I cant blame George, I blame all and none of us for all this.Recommend

  • Asim
    Sep 3, 2010 - 3:06AM

    Heinous crimes occur all over the world. I’m not even from Pakistan, but we can’t subject this nation to the errors of a few. Our religion teaches us that if you kill one human being, it’s as if though you have killed all of humanity. These criminals will pay, there is no doubt. At the same token, we cannot blame George for writing what he has, he’s just doing his job. Now is everything that he’s written a 100% correct, maybe some. My best friends are from Pakistan, they aren’t barbaric like this, they are civilized people.

    The biggest challenge here is that these people are not educated, that’s why they did what they did. And when I say education, that means having a good balance between the education of Islam and your normal everyday school education.

    Rather than cursing these criminals, let’s pray that Allah (swt) give them the Nayk Hidaayat and Thaufeeq. Doing to them, what they did to those innocent boys will not solve the problem. Instead, we’re letting the ideology live on, “an eye for an eye.” Pray for good and bad people, not just for the good. Let’s not let our emotions run wild, use the same energy and lift up your hands and ask Allah (swt) to help societies like this, help them get re-educated, learn the difference between right and wrong. Kaafir ko sazaa do gai, tho is may kuch faidah nay. Lekin samajdaar thareekai se us ko ilm diyogay, tho sabki betheri hain. Always remember this. Our Prophet Muhammad (PBUH), didn’t take revenge because they wanted to hurt him, but he educated them, that’s what we’re missing out on my Brothers and Sisters. Let’s go to these societies and educate them.Recommend

  • dr asna
    Sep 3, 2010 - 11:56AM

    George ! i really do not know u . but i do know pakistanis … they are an underconfident nation truely impressed by white skin (playing GOD for them)That is why u have been appreciated by so many of again i would say innocent, unaware, pakis who would even change thier father if a “GORA SAB” just gives them 10 min of his life .Actually pakistanis are not barbaric they are just slaves not yet able to comprehend the event of 14th August 1947. But when u call us barbaric a hope twinkles in me that one day inshallah Pak will also rise as a super power like British who would go to nations for trade never letting them have aclue that actually they had come to trade for their independance and thei childrens future. Just like America who abolished the native race of the land by brutal mass killings on the name of friendship and then to show their children that this was once a race now preserved in reserves. then they went to iraq for weapons of mass destruction got hold of them and used them rightaway. Holocast of jews was not done by this nation. Remember the masscres by Romans, masseres of central asia. Guantanamo bay is not pakistans property. Nation do develop this way ur nation did.And for those who have left pakistan, their mother land, can never be in a mothers lap again.Pity for them .Recommend

  • EJ
    Sep 3, 2010 - 8:01PM

    George – well written.

    Summed it up well in 5 years!

    jo nafrat ka beech boya 63 years ago, usee nafrat ka phal kha rehay hain hum.Recommend

  • hordo
    Sep 5, 2010 - 12:51AM

    Mr George, I found your article utterly disgusting.
    Where a large section of the Pakistani population is condemning the act , what logic compels you to say that our society celebrates barbarity .

    Instead of highlighting the factors that have compelled this nation to this extent, that we had to see this day, you go around making racist nonsense claims. Please do not forget that it is the West that has forced Pakistan into its present conditions .
    Do not intermix movies with reality . If movies had an effect on how a majority of people in a society behaved , Hollywood would not have existed.

    I hope you produce more thought out articles in the future or not produce any at all.Recommend

  • hadia Khan
    Sep 5, 2010 - 6:48PM

    For all of you who have issues with George’s article, please read this fab piece written by Anas Abbas….!/note.php?note_id=466755342274&id=100000832604151&ref=mfRecommend

  • Mariam Khan
    Sep 8, 2010 - 10:00AM

    The killing of the two teenage boys was indeed heinous and barbaric, but it isn’t wise to label the “entire” Pakistani nation as blood thirsty and uncouth.

    George, How do you think you can justify calling yourself a part of the Pakistani nation, when your article radiates the hatred and annoyance you have for this nation? A true Pakistani wouldn’t go abusing his nation, culture, rituals openly on a digital communication platform – where the whole world can read your thoughts.

    Living in a country for a couple of years, learning its language doesn’t make you a part of its nation; its by doing some thing productive for the country that you become a part of it.

    Try doing something good for Pakistan for as long as you stay here, rather than spreading negativity, ill will and irritation amongst its masses. Recommend

  • hadia Khan
    Sep 8, 2010 - 3:14PM

    Dear Mariam,

    Here are 2 sons of the soil who have written exactly what George is saying. Does this lessen the pain this message has brought you?

    Have you even tried to find out what George has done for the people of Pakistan? Do not kill the messenger!!! He is telling you exactly what you and i come across every day in cities, towns and villages of Pakistan. Please, instead of criticizing George, lets try to work towards getting rid of the brutality which our fellow Pakistani’s have descended into!!! Lets demand for and education system that teaches tolerance, sympathy and human rights. Let us teach our children to respect other human beings. Let them know that Abdul Sattar Eidhi should be their Hero. These are a few steps that you and i can take on individual basis and make Pakistan a better place. Peace!Recommend

  • saad
    Sep 8, 2010 - 6:25PM

    Dear Hadia,
    i have read the article by fasi zaka that you mentioned, dont you feel the difference in hit that you get from both articles. while fasi zaka’s article its like cursing ourselves and to feel ashamed of our deeds. when i read fasi zaka article, i felt like hes showing us in the mirror where we stand and to make us think about our every act we do. when i read the George’s article, i felt like someone is telling me to be ashamed of being a pakistani, just read following words again

    “Our nation was forged during a bloody partition — in which up to one million people were massacred. One just has to read eyewitness accounts of the riots, the train butchery, the brutal rapes and slaughter of that period to get a feel of the heady, almost orgasmic, delight that the perpetrators of these crimes revelled in as the nation was born”

    “So don’t act surprised. The Sialkot murders are as Pakistani as truck art, biryani and loadshedding. This has always been an ugly reality of Pakistan and always will be”

    this words are not making me ashamed of my act but are giving me an impression that being a pakistani i am bound to be like this and i always will be. and most of his words itself excludes himself from pakistani nation. Recommend

  • saad
    Sep 8, 2010 - 6:29PM

    and Hadia
    also please read the endings of both articles u can find the difference

    “Truth is, there is only one way to get change, and it’s not hanging the people who killed these boys. It is raising your voice to contradict people who advocate death for others, no matter who they are speaking of. To internalise that murder of any kind, for anyone is wrong. Sounds easy? Well just try it.”

    So don’t act surprised. The Sialkot murders are as Pakistani as truck art, biryani and loadshedding. This has always been an ugly reality of Pakistan and always will be. The Islamic Republic of Pakistan is a misnomer. Pakistan has never been a pure, peaceful Islamic state. And it never will be. Rather than drawing inspiration from the Holy Quran, our nation models itself on another book — a book in which children become savages. Pakistan is not the land of the pure — we are Lord of the Flies

    feel the difference .. Recommend

  • SJ
    Sep 9, 2010 - 4:29AM

    Saad, very good analysis. I totally agree with you on the final comments both of them made in their articles, but I believe George wishes well for Pakistan as well and was just venting his anger. At times I feel the same way as George did but the only difference is he expressed his thoughts publicly and is subject to scrutiny being a journalist. Recommend

  • Sep 10, 2010 - 1:13AM

    The Islamic Republic of Pakistan is a

    That is what I’ve always thought.Recommend

  • Aown Kazmi
    Sep 10, 2010 - 2:05AM

    @ Ayesha Hoda

    So im guessing you’re an expert on naming state’s right? Humor me with what you actually do think this country should have been called?Recommend

  • AR
    Sep 10, 2010 - 3:55AM

    Why does the blame game begin after every incident in the country? Don’t we already know it is us who have indeed done this to ourselves? Why can’t our writers talk about hope and bringing about a positive change rather than spreading hate and leading us to the point that our systems finally become immune to all these issues.

    It’s true that the people who can really help are the writers, poets of a nation..but none of our writers are ever going to try that. Aren’t we aware already of what Pakistan and it’s people are facing? This is no time to be reminded of what happened 50 to 60 years ago. Things were different back then, there were honest people around, is there anyone now with a clear conscience?

    Also, Maula Jutt does not define our culture. We are Pakistanis, not Punjabis, Sindhis, Muhajirs, Pathans. This is the sole issue facing our nation. We are everything …but Pakistani. Recommend

  • Sana
    Sep 10, 2010 - 1:33PM


    I agree with you. Writers and Poets can play a big role to bring about a big change but they hardly care about it. There is no one like Iqbal (no one can reach to his level – all I meant is no one is trying on that side). They are flaring up the already burnt wood. Anyways, hit on these pages:

    You will see this writer is talking about hope and love. From the former, read both the posts and from the latter read her ‘Happy Birthday, Pakistan’. Thanks! Recommend

  • BT
    Sep 22, 2010 - 8:44AM

    Sounds like another drawing room discussion.
    And when you say “we”, do you include yourself?Recommend

  • Qudus
    Oct 14, 2010 - 3:25PM

    Don’t mind the critique…..good article…However, to be fair barbarism is built in human nature. Wearing suits and ties has not changed our barbaric nature. Educated and advanced communities are also barbaric its only that it is manifested in subtler ways….Where are we all heading?Recommend

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