There are numerous Pakistanis who are convinced that the Taliban rule in Afghanistan was the best that the country had ever seen. They say that there was peace in Afghanistan and people could travel wherever they wanted to inside it, that there was no theft, no rape, no looting and generally law and order was very good. There is, however, another segment of society, which is of the opinion that religion was misinterpreted and misused by the Taliban when they came to power in Afghanistan.
However, these are issues that are on the minds not only of Muslims. For instance, surveys suggest that in present-day America, as much as 45 per cent of its Christian population believes that Earth is less than 10,000 years old. Similarly, the Old Testament, in Deuteronomy, ordains that the punishment of stoning until death is for disobedient sons, non-virgin girls and adulterers. Of course, this command is no longer practiced by Jews.
Now back to the Taliban. When they ruled Afghanistan, they did not enact any law which was not in accordance with the primary sources of their faith. They enforced laws taken from the Holy Quran, Ahadith, Sunni jurisprudence and fatwas of renowned Islamic scholars. They imposed restrictions on women and these included a total ban on activities outside the home and the requirement that they wear a long body-covering burqa when outside. Not only this, they were forbidden from dealing with shopkeepers, receiving education, treatment by male doctors, shaking hands with non-mehram men, playing sports, wearing high-heel shoes, or riding bicycles or motorcycles. They were also prohibited from going on a walk outside the house, even with a mehram, and they could not go to a male tailor, appear in the balconies of their homes, or travel in transport with males. Of course, there were other restrictions as well, and these included listening to music, photography, watching TV, using the internet — and all of these were off limits to ALL Afghans. Men were forbidden from shaving their beards and were required to wear headgear like the Taliban. Of course, not all these laws were invented by the Taliban, and in fact most were adopted from various Islamic sources, mostly from the Hanafi school of thought.
Those who support the Taliban also think that when the Americans leave, the Taliban will give up their arms and return to a normal peaceful life. They should see a recent video uploaded on YouTube. It is titled “Takfiri Molvi” () and shows a Pakistani Taliban leader calling the Quaid-i-Azam ‘Kafir-i-Azam’. This man also says that army troops have been declared apostates; he calls the Imam of the Kaaba “gumrah” and justifies kidnapping for ransom by saying that this is allowed under jihad. He refers to a kidnapped person as “aseer-e-ghaneemat”. Lootings of banks is also permitted, by calling the loot as “mal-e-ghaneemat” and the killing of women and children is justified by saying that this happens during a war.
The Taliban leader then goes on to call most Pakistanis “apostates” and hence this justifies their killing as a religious obligation. He says quite clearly that the Taliban will continue their jihad till the enforcement of Shariah in Pakistan and will kill all those who oppose them.
The Taliban’s agenda has been clearly spelt out in this video. They want to impose Shariah in this country, through the use of force. And they are armed, trained and capable of accomplishing this mission, if they have support from the people. They will neither lay down arms nor end their terrorist activities, even with the withdrawal of US forces and people who think that they will are naïve or living in a state of denial.
So to consider them as “our own people” and to initiate dialogue with them is not going to stop them from carrying on with their activities. I would wish good luck to all those who want to negotiate peace with the likes of Mullah Fazlullah, Hakeemullah Mehsud, Faqir Muhammad, Hafiz Gul Bahadur, Qari Hussian and others.
And as for those media anchors who consider the Taliban important for lasting peace in Afghanistan, why don’t they consider allowing the Taliban to set up a government in, say, Karachi?
Published in The Express Tribune, October 16th, 2011.
COMMENTS (64)
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@Umer: {groups like TTP as insurgent groups are using militancy and un-islamic ways to implement shariah in Pakistan}
As if Afghan Taliban shall use democratic / Islamic / non violent means to implement Sharia (whatever that means) in Afghanistan just like they did during their previous benign rule during 1996~1999? There is a limit to naivity and self delusion.
@UnGeneral: I fully agree with you. Why not the whole country?
@John B:
America is not and will never be correct . US is the biggest terrorist of this world infact in this planet.
I pray for the death and downfall of America and president Obama and all of the CIA operatives.
"When they ruled Afghanistan, they did not enact any law which was not in accordance with the primary sources of their faith. They enforced laws taken from the Holy Quran, Ahadith, Sunni jurisprudence and fatwas of renowned Islamic scholars."
Let's get something clear, this guy's talking from the top of his head here. The Taliban consists of fanatics and extremists taking their INTERPRETATION of laws from the primary sources of faith and imposing them, and not based on the actual teachings of the Quran or the Sunnat in itself. Nowhere in the Quran or Sunnat does it say to impose such inhumanely and unjust restrictions on women as were imposed by the Taliban in Afghanistan, nor can we find any evidence in Islam that justifies killings of innocent women and children, to the extent that suicide bombing is categorically stated as Haram in Islam while the Holy Prophet's life is the best example of peaceful coexistence between people belonging to different faiths, races and backgrounds.
Afghan Taliban and Pakistani Taliban are the same ideology and tactics. All are trash but unfortunately we have a lot of Taliban lovers in Pakistan.
Excellent and perfect piece by Asad Munir.
dear writer your giving the impression that the shariah law is a bad thing. remember shariah law was not created by the evil Taliban but it is Gods law. Taliban are Pakistan's enemy which makes them my enemy. Im not a religious preacher nor am i a practicing Muslim.but i have come to conclusion that Shariah law is the only system in which peace is very lasting. We have seen communism, we have seen totalitarianism, we have seen capitalism and now we are seeing a failing democracy. they have all failed. i think its time we try Shariah.
@Abdul Rehman Gilani:
fifty years ago the Jamaat e Islami was one political party with clear aims of wanting to establish the same Shariah system in Pakistan.
When asked if there was a model, they use to refer to a Medina model that didnt last for very long in historical terms, and for reference to successful implementation the model that existed in Saudi Arabia where punishment for personel choices is considered barbaric by standards that the world agrees to, and confirmed by UN resolutions on women's rights and freedom (By the way fifty years ago slavery was still legal in Saudi Arabia. If Shariah is finally implemented in Pakistan, one could ask if slavery will also be permitted sooner or later).
As for Imraan khan, I have happened to have met him at least three times during the last thirty years, and this last Friday one could watch him live being interviewed by the the "TIme" magazine global edition, editor Bobby Ghosh at the Coloumbia School of Journalism in New York City. The interview should be in this weeks issue of Time.
His views border on Naivety and amnesia, and his insistence that all violence will disappear if the Americans leave and the Taliban have their way, is smooth talk that does not take into account that more than 50,000 Afghan Shias were massacred by the Taliban taking over Mazar e Sharif.
Mullah Fazlullah, Hakeemullah Mehsud, Faqir Muhammad, Hafiz Gul Bahadur, Qari Hussian
first these people must surrender and have prison of 20 years for blasts in mosque for killing children and muslims according to quran.
What is the AUTHENTICITYof the so called video? Or it is the same proof like that wer for WDM in Iraq?
For me this article is trying to justify the war on taliban... but tell me .. how are we different if we kil every1 who doesnt agree with our idea of Islam? as bitter as it may sound but all the things you have mentioned are in the shariah (sunni) and similar in shaism also. WHere i disagree with taliban is the way they enforce it. You are to preach islam ... not force ppl to follow it .... and this is where no Jamat e islami but the tableeghees come into the picture. That is the way followed by the Prophet (PBUH). The patience, the honesty, the tolerance and all the good virtues ..if they become part of the society... things will happen automatically. Revolution will only come if each and every1 of us revolutionarize themselves ! Unfortuantely our media doesnt understand this and i wud call them a bigger threat to this nation than any other outside force.
Indians and other anti-pakistan people want us all to think that TTP and Afghan Taliban are the same. Pakistanis are not stupid.
The writer has placed the Afghan Taliban, who are fighting against Americans, and insurgent groups in Pakistan in the form of Tehrik-e-Taliban Pakistan who are waging war against Pakistan to implement shariah using militancy.
The conversation video is with a member of insurgent group who are waging war inside Pakistan.
The insurgent groups like TTP, BLA, Lashkar-e-Jahngvi have provided Western media a source to deface the efforts of Afgan Taliban and pose them as terrorists although they have no relation with the Afghan Taliban.
These insurgent groups are being funded by RAW and CIA through Afghanistan and their interrogation videos are present on Internet in which they have admitted that they are being equipped by RAW in Afghanistan.
Indian RAW Give us Targets in Pakistan - Pakistani Taliban Admits http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9N1LWAQAHM&feature=related
My request to the writer of this article is that please dont confuse Afghan Taliban with insurgent groups like TTP as insurgent groups are using militancy and un-islamic ways to implement shariah in Pakistan.
Why Karachi? why not Islamabad and Rawalpindi? Im sure they have a more favorable following in Aabpara than Karachi
Once Qazi Husain Ahmed ( jamat e islami) said they try to run country like small home big problem was they were lack of modren education.
@ Asad sahab, Ethanic politics and reliegous diffrences killed more peoples in karachi than they killed ... & in last few moths how pushtn, muhajirs, balouch, killed eathes what u gonna say
Excellent, excellent piece!! The truth is that a majority of our population LOVES to talk about Shriah as imposed by Taliban in Afghanistan. But another truth is that this very populace is disgusted at the idea of being forced to pray, being forced to shut down their business, having to shun music, movies and tv/internet. They hold delusions of grandeur dear to them and want to keep them delusions. They love to yap about religion but deep within, they hate to have it implemented it in real. So it's a case of utter hypocrisy. But yes, let them have a taste of Taliban rule that they oh-so-love. I see lets pack all Taliban-lovers and send em to Swat. And then hand over Swat's rule to Taliban.
Mr. Asad, I hope in your expert opinion you would have known before writing this that there is a plethora of differences between the Afghan Taliban (Mullah Umer, Haqqani, Hekmatyar groups) and the fake "TTP" (Pakistani Taliban) which is a separate pocket of local murderers who are provided arms by the American Task Force 373 in Afghanistan and training by India's RAW.
Also note, the Afghan Taliban have repeatedly made it clear that they have no enmity for Pakistan. Whereas the fake TTP attack only within Pakistan and never attack "kafir khan*rs" in Afghanistan. Really goes to show that a strong emphasis on differentiation between these two groups should be put.
For those who still say "WE SHOULD NEGOTIATE with the Talibans" henceforth have a real Taliban in them .... A very clear cut view on how they think indeed.
I m sure for those who understand the point here are the WISE ones ......
Great write up ... Thumbs up !!!
@Tanoli
Have you heard of the civil war between Good Taliban and Northern Alliance that cost the deaths of tens of thousands in the 1990s.
Why Karachi, Why not Lahore? This city has more Taliban sympathizers and supporters than any city of Pakistan. Vast areas of PU, Mansoora, Jaati Umra and Zaman Park are controlled by Taliban style administrators, only they need is to remove their masks and show their real faces.
Bang on article sir "Let the Taliban rule Karachi". But i just have one little doubt, do you still think the pakistani govt is the one in rule in karachi? By the news i keep reading about there, taliban already rules karachi. Its just that people comfortably kept their eyes closed.
Let us start their rule from Mianwali and D.I. Khan as the popular leaders from there are very fond and appreciative of Taliban.
With due respect, I would like to raise certain points:
Are Taliban a unified entity with its clear objectives and goals. You mentioned the names of many taliban leaders are they really aligned?
The Taliban rule in Afghanistan was at least much better than the current regime. There were no bombings on citizens, no suicide attacks etc. Please have a look at statistics.
Your generalization about taliban agenda based on a single youtube video is problematic.
Why we should not talk to 'Taliban' [i have reservation over considering them a unified entity]? Do you think fighting with them is the only option and we can deal with them in that way? USA and its allies, with more resources than us, after ten years of war with them reached to the conclusion that dialogue is the way forward.
Who we are to decide who can or cannot rule Afghanistan? If people of Afghanistan favours Taliban, let them rule. We need to stop this patronizing attitude which has created a mess for us. We supported one group over the other in the name of 'strategic depth'. This policy has created a mess and we are now in trouble.Confusing TTP with real Talibans? Isn't it obvious enough by TTP killing of Colonel Imam?
Excellent write up
Why do the people at large wish to remain slaves of whosoever wants to take them slaves? The Army in most part of those 62 years has taken the people slaves, whereas in the remainder part of those 62 years people have reamined slaves to the feudal landlords aka politicians. Well if people like slavery of one or the other group, who can stop them from becoming and remaining slaves. But on the other hand if people want to become a force of their own can anyone stop them from becoming so? The people need to become a force of their own, to bring about the practice of justice and all the good things people need and deserve. So how can people become a force of their own? By coming together to unite. Coming together in their mahullah, qusbah, qiryah i.e wherever they live. If people, any people, even the people of the USA, do not want to endure slavery in any form or shape any longer then they have utterly no other alternative than to start coming together in the localities where they live. Start coming together very regularly to start playing their part in those matters that affect their lives and their destinies. Once people start coming together to unite and organise to look after the well being of each and everyone, their vision and vista of infomation and their response to solving their problems themsleves will start opening up multifold. So we all can see it is entirely upto us the people. Whether we start coming together to liberate ourselves from the slavery that is imposed upon us people, by those who are organised to do so or whether we organise ourselves in such a way that no one will ever dream of imposing their will upon the collective will of the people. THIS MATTER, INDEED IS OUR OWN HANDS. COLLECTIVE HANDS. IF AND WHEN WE CAN SEE THE SENSE IN ORGANISING OUR COLLECTIVES IN THE LENGTH AND BREADTH OF THE COUNTRY.
Taliban may have bought law an order but that in reality was only limited to the pashtun belt. ask the hazaras many of whom liv in Quetta and have relatives in Afghanistan, they will surely speak of their women being distributed and mal e ghanimat from their property. Isalm or i would say religion can never be confined to communities it has a universal appeal which Taliban could never concieve. Please also write of the atrocities which the 60% non pashtun population faced under the Taliban. had things been so good the North would have also accepted the so called true rule.
@Khan: What you say is slightly misplaced...let's not forget the fact that the ranks of scholars such as Dr. Sarfaraz Naeemi, Tahir-ul-Qadri, and Ghamidi have strongly opposed acts of Taliban...but they have either been martyred or reciprocated with death threats...
On a side note, while the author might be correct in pointing out Taliban's narrow mindedness, he is off the mark by implying that it is a logical outcome of compliance with Islamic jurisprudence...simply put if Muslims had followed the lifestyle enforced by Taliban...Islam won't have survived for 1400 years...any follower's flawed interpretation of a message can not be taken as evidence against legitimacy of the message itself !
Brilliant article. Showing an ounce of sympathy towards the Taliban's ideology is adding more fuel to their fire - they are a breed whose aggression knows no boundaries, Pakistanis (especially the media-fed educated middle classes) need to stop fooling themselves and give them a loud and clear message.
Ge your fact right..."earth is not 1000 years old"but the first human adorn this earth 10000 years ago. Dont mix up these two
Well said. What seems extremist ideas to a common man is actually a basic part of the Sharia for the Taliban. They believe in the concepts of takfeer which allows for killing of innocent Muslims who disagree with their views. Proponents of ‘reaction to US presence in Afghanistan theory’ don’t know the ideological foundations of the Taliban movement. Taliban in the 90s didn’t just create order but impose their ideology. Tens of thousands of Pakistanis were also a part of their movement, and they weren’t reacting to anything back in the 90s.
Taliban have a "misinterpreted view" of Islam, many "intellectuals" say that, but they do not elaborate further or come with the right interpretation with logical groundings. Maybe their own knowledge of Islam is limited.
@Author
why don’t they consider allowing the Taliban to set up a government in, say, Karachi?
And Pindi too. After all Taliban did not enact any law which was not in accordance with the primary sources of their faith. They enforced laws taken from the Holy Quran, Ahadith, Sunni jurisprudence and fatwas of renowned Islamic scholars.
And this precisely, is what has been ordained in the Pakistani Constitution via the Nazaria-e-Pakistan insertion. Looks like Taliban have a more legitimate claim at ruling Pakistan than some others who have ruled for long spells without any constitutional justification.
why not al-qaida?
What a marvelous article. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you
People follow religious sources selectively.Some text is believed and practiced as per the literal meaning,some text,which does not suit them,is interpreted.They follow the Sunnah of keeping beard,but do not travel on camel,also a Sunnah.They keep more than two pair of dresses,do not mend their shoes themselves,make properties, all contrary to what the Holy Prophet practiced.Instead of keeping horses ready for war,as commanded by the Allah,they make bombs.The reason given is that times have changed.But for women the time does not change.All laws are applied to her as per the literal meanings.The Talib in this video,has quoted Islamic sources, for all their acts like,looting,kidnapping,beheading,killing of woman and children,and he has invented these.The Christians and Jews have passed through these stages,in the medieval ages,we unfortunately are confronted with extremism in the 21st Century.The extremism is here to stay,unless some revolutionary steps are initiated now.A well written piece,highlighting the kind of threat we as a nation are facing.
lets think for a moment i am Ahmadi can peace talks with lashkar e jhanvi will convince them to live a peaceful life with me, if so then Taliban can too live with us in peace.
I am more from the Saddam Hussain school of thought. I think we continue bombing the Taliban until they ask for mercy and give up their weapons. In the meantime we should take no prisoners.
Well argued, Brig Saab. Problem with Pakistan is that there are two kind of Taliban here: Wild looking, bearded taliban and whisky-sipping, clean-shaven taliban (aka masters/philosophers of strategic depth). Former are the immediate enforcers of their "hate theology", while later do this through the former. Later have another distinction: they want this "hate theology" for general populace, while cynically leaving themselves, their women, children and family out of this sharia-domain.
@ Abdul Rehman Gilani - wrong, wrong, wrong. We've been giving the religious parties a chance for decades for fear they will blow us all up and now that's what they are all doing. Let's not kid ourselves that the tribal areas were "peaceful" before - it just wasn't as bad as it is today. 1948 Kashmir was an adventure to distract the Pashtuns from the Durand Line issue.
@Abdul Rehman Gilani:
Jamaat Islami and Maududi ideology is exactly what is the basis of this extremism. Jamaat Islami has always supported these terrorists. The terrorists have prospered in MMA's period in KP. Who are you kidding?
Few understand the Quran despite numerous readings, even fewer understand the requirements of humanity that are universal and not based on a particular religion, then there is lack of education, equity and reason, all of which lead to a principle that might is right. We live in a time when Mullah claim to be the leaders of men, though they are completely illiterate and entire political associations are in existence that call their members and officers Alim's. Few realize that Alim is a name of God for he has all pervading knowledge. How does man reach and acquire an attribute of God, for Prophet was known as the unlettered Prophet, and prayed constantly; "Oh lord increase my knowledge", where as the Mullah begins with the premise that all knowledge is already in the Quran and that he has acquired it sans reason, sans practice, sans knowledge. It must be understood that no real Alim would call himself Alim for that is an appendage given to him by other educated men who realize his ability to grasp. May God help Muslims for the devil provides them with Taliban and Takfiri Mullahs.
I think Maulana Nawaz Sharif should settle a deal with Taliban and move them over to Punjab from KP to set up Shariah rule first in Raiwand and then in Lahore. I am sure residents of Raiwand and Lahore will be eternally thankful to Nawaz Sharif for this favour. Residents of KP should have no issue with Taliban moving over to Lahore. Everyone happy.
Generalization just on the basis of a Youtube video I think is wrong.
Hats off to Brigadier (R) Asad Munir for writing thought provoking article.Such sane voice are very hard to find in our land of pure.Well done Sir and wish our mighty establishment ever listen to such sane voices and they leave their self made dream of strategic depth based on Taliban support. The extremism serve no cause and as nation we need the progressive and liberal democratic thought system to run our country in this 21st century.
Well said. What seems extreme ideas to a common man is actually a basic part of the Sharia for the Taliban. They believe in the concepts of takfeer which allows for killing of innocent Muslims who disagree with their views. Proponents of ‘reaction to US presence in Afghanistan theory’ don’t know the ideological foundations of the Taliban movement. Taliban didn’t just create order but impose their ideology. Tens of thousands of Pakistanis were also a part of their movement, and they weren’t reacting to anything back in the 90s.
i dont know why people called Taliban's interpretation of Islam as 'misrepresented', when in fact it is the most literal and traditional interpretation of Islam that is exclusively based on the works of Ibn Taymiyyah and al-Ghazali et al.
what we call "misrepresented" is based on our modern lifestyles and ideals that are fundamentally different in 21st century than the 7-9th centuries. we appreciate our diversity and varying cultures, when in light of literalist meaning we should be ashamed of it.
if you want to talk about something serious, try talking about NOT enforcing Islam on others, appreciate the equality of all citizens regardless of who or what they are, and treat them as equals in eyes of a well-made, modern, and fair judicial system that is with the times rather than stuck in the past
long story short, Taliban's version of Islam is the Islam that refuses to get over its past and move on!
that is why secularism, and a willingness to make our understanding of Islam more with the times than being stuck with past is important!
Let Taliban Rule Karachi Does not make any sense
Talibanization is not just limited to mulla omer and hakimullah mahsood it is a mindset ... u cant just kill everyone who want to impose taliban style shariah in the country .. we have to change the mind set .. and remember one thing taliban dont have any leader .... i remember ppls were talking abt baitullah mahsood few years ago and after he died hakimullah came into limelight ... after usama ... haqqani network came into limelight .. so we cant win the war by just killing the leadership .. someone else will take the charge .. we have to educate ppls and provide them with good jobs ...
Only if other army and ISI personal could think like this:)...!
Thanks Asad Munir for writing such a remarkable article. Mr Be Ghairat Khan & his followers must read it, it would be good for their health.
The counter for extremists like these, lie in religious parties themselves, like the Jamaat-e-Islami.
Fact is, that those who are willing for peace, should be given a chance, not bombing all innocents! Gather all those who are against us, just because we fight US's war, negotiate with them, bring them on our side, and then use them to eliminate these handful of fanatics.
The religious parties and Imran Khan both can play an instrumental role in the peace process, if given the chance.If UK can do dialogue with IRA, why cant we? If US can talk to Taliban, why cant we talk with our tribals?
For more than 6 decades, the tribal areas were peaceful, and acted as a wall for Pakistan, the tribals helped us since the time of Quaid-e-Azam, but when we bombed them just to please the US, it was natural for them to be incited to revenge.
@Khurram Mohiuddin: well they should
So, the rest of the world, including America, are correct then?
Its about time people in Pakistan realize who their friends are and who are out there to destroy their way of life. Taliban were created by the Deep State with the doctrine of hatred with the purpose of controlling Afghanistan.
Chickens have come back home to roost!
Brig. Asad Munir has my respect for his excellent views and analysis.
If only this kind of sense was prevalent amongst all people.
If only.
I wonder if higher ups of the military share Brigadier (R) Asad Munir's thoughts.
one of the best and rare pieces of candour