I’m from KGS and I can’t study next to… a big building?

Nehl | 13 years ago | Reply i think collectively kgs has done a lot for the country just as much as any other school. it seems, though you'll deny it, that you're just releasing previously ignited spite for...perhaps a failed admission try or whateverr.. you should realize its not grammarians who call themselves elite...infact you all do. you build up a pedestal for them to stand on and raise there status...FYI not EVERYONE in kgs is filthy stinking rich...some parents just make sacrifices for there children to deserve a quality education from an esteemed institution. And.. as for your utter inability to grasp the problems a high rise building would face: - traffic jams would clog up the roads all day, causing problems not only to students etc but ALSO to others using that road or visiting the building...how is that SELFISH?? - this building is for commercial purposes and NOT, as incorrectly stated previously, a flat. this means that there could possibly be a bomb threat etc. its not uncommon in forum or parktowers, why would this be any different? - you people are realyy acting childish! you're saying that just because there is pollution already, it won't make a difference if it increases? more cars, more smoke, more trash! apparently you all want to jump to much greater causes such as corruption. more worthy, true. but i really can't see it making a difference. atleast kgs is doing all it can. - i think you should notethat with the amount of influential parents nd ex-grammarians in kgs, the school could easily have stopped the building. yet they all put in effort to first try apeaceful demonstration before exerting force or taking the matter to court. im not going to be self-righteous and say that is a model of courtesy. but i will say that if you are going by the facts, you had better see them all before you judge. lastly i dont think that there is one person here who can disagree to the fact that the saddar building is one of the many signs of pre partition architecture and is a well designed building. on my own i would never stoop so low as to pick on the structure itself when criticisng a school. but since you decided to take that low blow, i can say that the building is A national mark, not THE national mark, but A national mark. oh and just by feeding on your spite, and one sided judgmental approach of pure despise towards kgs, i think i should add that rather than saying kgs thinks its too cool, you should be proud that there are things other than terrorism that are country is internationally know for-this school for instance, whose students get reserved seats nd scholarships, because of there talent not their 'high horses'.

Talha Qamer | 13 years ago | Reply Building a high rise equates to development. Next to Grammar isn't that a good thing?

A.A. Haji | 14 years ago | Reply mubarak on your intolerance...' Praise.

Sehrish | 14 years ago | Reply 5-11 years..typing error

Sehrish | 14 years ago | Reply Dude get your facts right! Commercial 21-23 storey building next to the junior section where children aged 3-11 years go to school! If parents sending their kids to other schools have similar or worse problems, go ahead and do something to solve them instead of just whining about them!

Mo | 14 years ago | Reply There you go guys: http://public.dawn.com/2010/10/28/sepa-rejects-high-rise-plan-near-school-in-clifton.html So I guess the protest did work!

Umair | 14 years ago | Reply @Syed Nadir El-Edroos: On target....Brilliant

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply The Cantonment Board apparently saw sense just in time and revoked the permission for any commercial construction on that plot. However, in the case of a residential complex, Karachi Grammar School will be honored to cooperate. Also, let this be a lesson for all those of you who think we're the 'wrong' people, and make 'phone calls' like BAD citizens to achieve something legal. We did what any other 'normal'--in your biased opinions-- and sensible Pakistani would've done, a peaceful protest with a proper NOC for something that we thought of as a hazard. Maybe someday you people will stop playing the blame game--with the people who're worse or better off just because they as a school score better, or are more selective about students or have meager traffic senses, LOL-- and actually do the same for whatever each and every one of us believes in. :) God Bless Pakistanis and may He give us the strength to fight for whatever we feel/know is wrong. Pakistan Zindabad!

rasheem | 14 years ago | Reply So are they building the 22-storey building or what? who is winning...whats the latest score? LOL R. Ali

Sana | 14 years ago | Reply I'm sorry but as well written as this article is, I disagree with it. I mean yes you have your own opinion but you make as all sound like callous snooty kids who don't know a thing about the real world and don't care about anyone else. You can't generalise like that. There are people like that in almost all the big schools here,,, only like 1% or even less of the people studying at grammar are like that. I'm sorry but this just really hurt me.

Max | 14 years ago | Reply @Bilal Zaidi: If you read my previous post, I've qualified my opinion putting an 'if'. I said if a protest was placed against commercialization of the plot, then it makes more sense than if it was against increased risks. Yes NOCs are issued pretty easily. But thats my point. Should they be?. I'm no expert at law, but I'm reasonably certain that the essence behind the relevant law would be only to allow them to be issued for a reasonable cause. Anyway, that is a completely separate discussion. I am not blaming anyone for NOT closing the streets for days. Quite to the contrary in fact. Since you've cleared up that the issue the protest was against commercialization of the plot, I must ask: why not take a stay order from the court?.

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @Mariam Sabri: No no Mariam, I didn't say any such thing. I was merely answering the guy. You can check my previous comments, this blog has blown waaaay out of proportion just because people can't keep their bitterness out. See I believe in our people and everyone else out there representing our country regardless of what people say. My friend who went to the US this year and her fellow Pakistanis, some of them Grammarians did a Burritos sale at their Uni to collect money for the flood victims. My point of saying this is that all of you people out there who are saying we dont contribute to the country after going abroad in any way, you have no clue what you're talking about. Go abroad in present times and see the attitude change in the general younger local public. People's opinions of the country have been changed relentlessly due to people from Pakistan going abroad and setting a better example than the one set by apparently 'Muslim' terrorists. Don't point fingers without facts please. Yes, we've a few bad eggs. But then, what place doesn't? Everywhere you go, you'll find rich kids and spoilt brats. Doesn't mean we get to be judged because of them. @Max: Man you're quite mislead by an idiotic news piece on this website. The protest was against commercialization. And protest by schools is allowed EVERYWHERE around the world against security issues, zoning laws AND commercialization around it! What is wrong with you? As for more pressing issues, we're dealing with them the best we can. But you REALLY can't blame us for being sensible enough not to burn down the whole damn city, or close the streets for DAYS because we have load shedding problems, because I'm sorry the whole country is facing it and violence is NOT the answer to anything. Nor is targeting people just because they're in a better or worse financial position. Also, another very important point to add here. Anybody can protest about anything they please as long as its within the law, and NOCs are issued quite easily. The only problem is, the people who get 'lathi-charged' prefer to take the law in their own hands because they don't believe in it. YES, even we dont believe in our law enforcement agencies to an extent, but that does NOT mean you can BREAK the order no matter WHAT.

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen Must we have this long debate again? Okay heres my argument: 1. Technically, if I have a foreign passport/nationality, my identity is: 'a national of that country' whose origins are from Pakistan. True, I remain a Pakistani, but what I do, where I study or where I chose to live is entirely up to me! I know a lot of people born abroad, who've lived abroad for years, but have come back to Pakistan. Most of them have GENUINE accents, not copied or attained ones as you claim. And EVEN IF one speaks in a copied accent, there's nothing really alarming about that, we can see TV anchors and students from other schools doing that all the time! i don't see you picking on them! 2. MOST of us get into Ivy Leagues solely on merit and scholarship/financial aid, etc. The REST pay full tuition, BUT THEY TOO NEED GOOD GRADES TO GET IN, IVE LEAGUE ADMISSIONS AREN'T SOLD ON E-BAY! Our parents save up their entire lives to be able to send us to good colleges and provide us with the best education. 3. KGS is not elitist. I said that before and I will say that again. I have the son of the owner of a bank and the son of the manager of a small branch of the same bank in the my class. My father himself manufactures cardboards for a living. Its not very profitable, but after working hard over the years and expanding his business, he is able to provide us the luxuries we could have only dreamed of a few years back. I have not been a Grammarian since the beginning, infact, ive only been one for a relatively short period of time. Before this, i studies in Saint Patrick's, one of Karachi's best schools at a quarter of the fee i'm paying now. I too had these weird beliefs about Grammarians, and i too had heard a lot of stuff about them. I thought of them as self-obsessed snobs who only cared about themselves. Now that I'm amongst them, I've finally realized whats true and what's not. They're some of the most kind and caring people I've ever come across. Ofcourse the school has its fair share of snobs, just like any other school, but that doesnt mean every one is a snob or a self-obsessed idiot. I still belong to the middle-class and I'm proud of that fact. 4. The story of your nephew cannot POSSIBLY be true as KGS DOESNT TAKE ITS STUDENTS ON INTERNATIONAL TRIPS. IT IS PROBABLY ONE OF THE ONLY SCHOOLS THAT DOESNT TAKE ITS STUDENTS ON INTERNATIONAL TRIPS. IT REFRAINS FROM EVEN NATIONAL FIELD TRIPS (EXCEPT A TRIP TO LAHORE IN SECOND YEAR OF A' LEVELS WHICH IS THE ONLY TRIP THROUGHOUT THE SCHOOL LIFE), SO AS TO PROMOTE EQUALITY AND AVOID SITUATIONS WHERE THOSE WHO CAN'T AFFORD TO GO ON THE TRIPS DONT FEEL LEFT OUT. So its technically not possible for them to refuse admission on basis of him not being able to cope with expenses of international trips as there ARE NO INTERNATIONAL TRIPS! Also, unlike other schools, students aren't harassed by the school on non-payment of fee. The school contacts the parent after the fee is over 3 weeks due and then too they don't send the child home (like other schools). So either; a) your nephew lied to you, and the real reason he didn't get in is something else; b) you made this up as a piece of fiction; or c) you've mistaken the school with another one. 5. WE DONOT SUFFER FROM A SUPERIORITY COMPLEX, IT YOU PEOPLE WHO SUFFER FROM AN INFERIORITY COMPLEX! 6. I'm sorry you feel that was a cheap shot. That was merely meant as an example of why our parents aren't rich JUST LIKE THAT. I'm sorry if you felt offended by that, but honestly, you offended us by saying that life was easy for us just because our parent's are 'loaded'. Just to remind you, YOU used the word 'loaded' as your reply to someone's comment, i didn't start using that word. My parents too have worked hard. My father dropped out of university during his first year after my grandfather (a lower-middle-class man who left behind many debts) passed away. He couldn't afford the tuition of the university, and instead started working with my uncle in the factory. I remember the days when dad used to get up in the middle of the night when it used to rain and rush to his rented factory in North Nazimabad to move the cardboard rolls and prepared cartons from the katcha part of the factory where the water leaked from the roof into the office, which was the only part with a solid roof. I also remember my father leaving for factory before I woke up for school and returning way after my bed time. I remember when instead of playing with me on Sunday, he used to go to his factory just to make sure there was food on the table in the night. No one has life handed to them in a golden plate Sabeen. Even those who are born rich need to take care of their money, otherwise they also face starvation. My father too is a heart-patient. He has had a slipped disk for a year now and is not seeking treatment for it because of the expenditure involved. Ive seen my father forgo on his own medical needs just to make sure I get the best possible of everything in life. So that I can say that my father has done whatever i wanted him to. He has taught me how life works. Believe it or not, i have roamed around in more buses than people have seen their entire lives. Thats because my father wanted me to grow up a person knowledgeable about the world, not an ignorant prude. I know a lot about how hard work is done, as I too try to earn as much as I can for my age to be able to give something away. I am sorry about your loss, I was not aware of your parent's death. The barrier between us is not about being humble or simple, its about people thinking of us as someone out of this world. People need to understand that we are as normal as everyone else. I could copy you and say that there is a barrier between the poor and the middle-class, but that doesn't justify anything does it? The barrier is totally psychological and needs to be removed ASAP. I feel sorry that I triggered up something that made you respond so harshly, but the fact is, you guys have said a lot of stuff you shouldn't have. I think its time to end this argument once and for all, and also time for Mr. Popalzai to apologize to the hundreds of people he has hurt through this article. I do hope that this clears up any misconceptions you may still have about us being 'royalty' because we're not!

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @bilal: bro i saw you outside school today with your mom! haha i didnt 'go' on her parents, i simply pointed out that what she was saying about our parents was wrong. i mean, she doesnt have any right to say that my parents had it easy in life, or whether money was handed to them in whatever way. we know people who come to school in rikshaws and public buses everyday. heck, i know people who take lifts from neighbors on motorcycles who're going for work! its really not fair for them to call us elite people who don't give anything back to the society!

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Max: hahah max, nice to see you reply. Those weren't hiccups, they were separate replies to separate comments by Sabeen. Haha i mentioned the NOC just to tell you that cant get us off the road if we have permission to be there. AND DUDE, we did protest against the commercialization of the plot. The added security risk is ALSO an issue, its not the only issue. check out other reliable newspapers and the photos. they show plac-cards protesting against the commercialization solely. haha go to the police TIB branch of the area, and they issue you an NOC if its peaceful, follows the law, etc etc. Ill take you there if you want, we can get an NOC to hold a debate outside the school about whether we rock or whether we rule :P Issuing an NOC isnt against the law or an abuse of authority, the TIB officer himself issues it, and after its issued, the police even provides you security. you need an NOC for everything dude. That statement was sarcastic, just bytheway. it meant about how you guys dont think about what you say against us, you just say it mindlessly!

Max | 14 years ago | Reply @Ali Zain: First, please stop posting in 'hiccups'. You can all you have to say in a single post. Its annoying, really. Secondly, again. You're talking about a right (NOC) in this case. I'm talking about ethics. Do I need to teach you that there's a difference between law and ethics?. The whole point that is being debated here is that you may have had the right. To go out and try to obtain attention for such a petty issue (security risk etc.) may have been legally right. But it wasn't ethically correct when there are bigger things out there. Perhaps a better stand point would have been to emphasize that the construction was illegal due to it being constructed in a residential area rather than saying my kid is now at an elevated level of security risk (which I already pointed out he isn't to that an extent). If that was done (which some comments point was the case, though this and another article don't), then it was fine. Thirdly, no authorized official in their right mind would give you a NOC for this thing. Unless, of course he wasn't following the true sense of the law or abusing his authority. "i mean oh my god, do you people ever think about why we are the best?". That statement of yours portrays your mindset perfectly.

Mariam Sabri | 14 years ago | Reply @bilal zaidi: Also why is there this obsession with comparing what school sends more kids to Oxbridge/IV League schools? Why does that somehow put you above someone who went to a 'mediocre' local college? I've seen some extremely dull, apathetic kids get into IV Leagues and really smart, impassioned ones go to not very highly ranked local colleges and vice versa. Let's not use such superficial measures to judge people.

Mariam Sabri | 14 years ago | Reply @bilal zaidi: Bilal, my point was that indulging certain people's comments will only lead to more pettiness rather any productive outcome. When its clear that they are not willing to change their mind and only argue for the sake of it then why bother? You make a really good/valid point about not all of us who went to Grammar School being elite. In my circle of friends hardly any of us were. A few of us managed to get into our dream colleges/universities but had to give up on them because we simply couldn't afford them. The school tried their best to help us look for scholarships and were never discouraging of us applying there just because it was beyond our means financially. I don't think any school in Karachi can be considered entirely elite (aside from the American School judging from its insanely high fee) and its unfair to make such generalizations.

bilal zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @Mariam Sabri: No Mariam, we are humans. I'd REALLY like to clarify that. :)

Mariam Sabri | 14 years ago | Reply It's sad how petty this discussion is becoming. If you have nothing of substance to say, then please refrain from commenting and use your time more productively elsewhere. How about we start by not replying to Sabeen? It'd really be doing a service to our country.

bilal zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply Now now people play nicely! :) @Sabeen: Listen, Ali Zain went overboard, I apologize. But since we're 'humans' as you claim for us not to be, we wont point out any people who you deem 'middle-class' from our school. But just one thing, my very own friend used to come from pretty far away every day in a Suzuki FX and took tuition and went back home at 8pm at night only to come to school at 6am again the very next day. Now he's one of the 15 people from our school who got into AKU. Another friend of mine got into AKU and couldn't afford it. Yet she was too proud to ask for aid and is in IBA now. Don't give us crap about being super rich just because we're in Grammar. Another one of my friends used to come to school in a bus, mind you not a school bus. Please don't make suggestions based on one experience, because trust me, close to 50% of the students at school are getting some type of aid for fee. Though, you started the judgment process first, so please don't blame anyone here. :) Being Grammarian doesn't make us an elitist, however being judgmental does make you a person who's hung over stereotypes. @Ali Zain: Easy hojao bhai, you've no right to go to people's parents! Relax. @Mo: Not to offend you or make Lyceum sound any lesser, but how many made it to Ivys this year? How many got called for the Cambridge SCHOLARSHIP interview last year? I mentioned the scholarship so you don't say its only because we can AFFORD to go. :) Thank you. @Rizwan Liaqat: My man, you're severely mistaken. Schools, hospitals and parks come under the label 'community', not 'commercial'. Also, our school was constructed in 2001, the college campus I mean, long before any houses were built alongside the school. Also, for your information, plaese don't JOKE around because if you go outside Lyceum, Southshore or ANY school for that matter, there's a traffic jam and they're in residential areas. All of them. CAS, DHA, CITY SCHOOL DK. Please don't be bitter. :)

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply @Sara Ali: Lady, Your "hahahahahaaaa's" are quite interesting because I wrote nothing funny in my comments. Makes me really question your sanity to be honest! .. As far as my going too far is concerned, I wouldn't worry about that :) ..I have made it this far with the exact attitude and I think I will manage to move on ... Anyways.. I suggest you read through earlier comment against which I had to respond back .. If elites can judge middle class as "not hard working enough" .. we can sure judge a few elites other way round. I gave a few Grammarians a chance here .. Seems I was right after all. Cheers!

Rizwan Liaqat | 14 years ago | Reply @Chota Suria: What about the school that causes traffic jams and noise pollution? Is that not located in a residential area? Sorry, but I am one of those who sick of seeing schools in residential areas, with several schools located in my own street. I find it quite funny then when KGS is trying to tow the same line and protesting against a commercial building being built.

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply @lammy: For crying out loud its not a false story. I just gave out my nephew name to prove that .. Its not easy getting details out of relatives in Pakistan especially when one is not even in the country. Give me some time for christ's sake.. I will revert back exactly when it happened so ppl who have contacts can investigate accordingly.

Sara Ali | 14 years ago | Reply @sabeen. hahahahahahahahahahahaha. your comments are hilarious. and you seem so biased and ignorant i won't even bother arguing with you. but you do need to get over your self-righteous attitude. 'we are more human and humble than people like you will ever be'. who are you to judge that? specially seeing as you dont even know what youre talking about and are just basing your opinion on a few bad experiences you have had with grammarians. and im not even sure how many of those bad experiences actually count cuz it seems like you would never even give a grammarian a chance, you would just automatically assume the worst in all of them. anyway, your opinion is definitely funny but i dont think you would get very far in life with an attitude like that. and you talk about the attitudes grammarians have. hahahaa.

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply @AA: Yes my comment about drinking, partying was un fair and I do accept that. This trait is not limited to students from KGS and is not necessarily limited to elites. I do apologize for that. I am not bitter. I just do not like double standards. I cannot confirm again and again that my nephew was indeed rejected by KGS administration during an interview for reason i mentioned in my earlier comment. I do not have any personal grudge or vendetta against the school and honestly i do not have the time to make up a story about that either. It did happen. I just dont know the name of the lady who made that comment. I am hoping and praying that either my sister or brother in law remembers the name so that I can post it here for all. Then you can all do your investigations from school. My nehphew's name is M. Asadullah in case you want to find anything else on him do let me know. I think I had mentioned earlier that my comments are entirely based on my experience with Grammarians professionally during which I failed to meet a single Grammarian who wasn't too full of himself or herself. Hence the comments! Yes I may be wrong and hopefully I will meet nicer Grammarians shortly who are as intelligent and deserving as they all claim to be. Take care.

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply @Ali Zain: Apologies for responding a bit late to your comments .. anyways I dont know why you chose to respond multiple times when one would have just done fine. I dont really buy the foriegn passport story because it does not change your identity .. people who are born elsewhere usually study elsewhere as well but that is a separate debate. Being born with an accent and trying to copy an accent are two different things .. i know why ppl do it and so do you hence no point arguing about the same. Yes some of you do end up in ivy league schools becuase of intelligence & grades which is good for you but majority is there because of reasons others then good grades. Kindly go read my comments again .. I never mentioned that every one who ends up in an ivy league is there because of money .. if that was the case none of the people I know would have made it that far .. I am not speaking farce or nullyfying the so called facts .. I am stating the facts .. "KGS is not elitist" .. who are you kidding? Point out one kid in the existing lot whose father is a normal middle to lower class Pakistani (and no an AVP or a Manager in a foriegn company do not qualify as middle class). And no I am not making up that story about my nephew .. it did happen and yes the school was KGS. I will revert to Humanflux with more details on that as per my earlier comment. Your comments about collecting cheques is disgusting. This shows the true mentality of our elites .. hence I really do not need to explain any further why I wrote my first comment.. i am sorry but 09 years of experience is enough for me to make up my mind about something and pass judgement. I agree not everyone is the same but majority seems to be indulged in this superiorty complex also evident from your multiple comments. You claim that your father is loaded because he worked really hard in life and my parents would have been loaded too if they had done that .. sigh .. dude really .. seriously?? That really is a cheap shot. you are implying here that every middle class Pakistani is not loaded because he / she does not work hard?? Are you kidding me? Both my parents were salaried & worked hard to make end's meet. Both had bad health issues from early middle age because of our tough living circumstances.. They never took any vacations or time off because they could not afford to do so but it's ok .. not every one is suppose to be rich.. that's how life works ..Having money does not signify that one is very hard working. From this statement of your's I am assuming that you do not seem to know the first thing about hard work and sacrifices made thereof. My parents are a shining example for me because they worked hard and made me the person I am today. My father kept on working even after two heart attacks to ensure that we end up with a better future so please dont tell me that my parents were not hard working or else we would have been loaded.. they worked twice as hard because unlike others life was not offered to them in a gold plate. I would not have responded to your ranting in such detail but since you had attacked my parents, one of whom just passed away a few months back, you deserved a response. And you are right, there is a barrier between elites & middle class Pakistanis, because we are more human & humble then people like you will ever be!

leena | 14 years ago | Reply Very well written. I had forgotten about the nullah next to the school, lol, yes what about that you very very concerned parents?!

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Max: yes max, you would have that right. except, that we would have had an NOC, allowing us to block the road (hypothetical), so technically, the police would tell YOU to get the hell of the road (no offense ofcourse, this is all hypothetical).

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: humanflux isnt defending us, he's explaining to you the true facts which you have jumbled up. whatever you've done is commendable, except that we've done 100x more than that. We collect, rather than writing out cheques from the bank's account. if my parents are loaded, its because theyve worked hard in life. if your parents had done the same, you'd be talking otherwise. Ive seen where my fathers business was 10 years ago and ive seen where it is now. it took endless nights, and endless days to reach where we are today. its sad to see how people just speak farce in order to nullify true facts. kgs isnt an elitist institution, its just an institution where the elite ALSO happen to study. as far as the fact of your nephew is concerned, that is impossible as kgs doesn't require you to submit a bank statement like many other schools do. The security deposit (refundable of course) is 3 months compared to 6 months in other schools. If you research, you'll find that besides paying full tuition, students achieve GOOD GRADES to go to Ivy Leagues. by saying that only money is needed to go there, you're insulting the Ivy Leagues themselves and you're also insulting your knowledge and intelligence. You have some serious research to do, or you're just going to end up winded in your pack of farces

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: and how about you deal with the stuff thats affecting you and we deal with whats affecting us? youre forgetting that the Americans also tried to build a consulate next to our school. at time time too, people like you were calling us idiots. now, after years you guys see why we didnt let them build there. we won the case, and inshallah we'll win this one as well. breach of security isnt something we take very lightly. and, we never said we were more equal. its you people who feel we're above you guys, not us. YES, we're proud of who we are, but then again, isnt everyone? we feel we're normal Pakistani's, but its you guys who have created a barrier between us.

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: we speak english in foreign accents because more than half of us have foreign passports and have lived abroad for a long time. get your facts right. not all grammarians drink, not even most of them. just SOME of them, and that too is their business. If someone wants to party, abuse substances or alcohol, its their business, not yours or mine. Its sad to see you people dragging in personal lives of people just to defend the stories that you guys make up every minute

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: AND JUST BYTHEWAY, kgs doesnt take its students on international trips, bay view does. get your facts right and stop making up stories about nephews not getting in because of that. we have people of all classes studying here, and we are proud of that.

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: you have misconceptions that need to be cleared. need i mention that you seem to be just as prejudiced just because you arent a grammarian? i mean oh my god, do you people ever think about why we are the best?

Aaminah | 14 years ago | Reply its not us, grammarians fault that the rest of the country isn't fighting for what they beleive in.

Chota Suria | 14 years ago | Reply It seems that we have deviated from the topic. IT IS WRONG TO BUILD A COMMERCIAL BUILDING IN A RESIDENTIAL AREA ; simple as that. Regards, Chota Suria.

rukun | 14 years ago | Reply @Mustafa Hanif: and that isnt solving many/any of our problems now is it?

Mo | 14 years ago | Reply @Mustafa Hanif: I'd have to slightly disagree with your comment there! Lyceumites are equally capable of making it to IV leagues and other Tier A universities and they have proved it in the past. Question being, is Lyceum not built in the midst of bunglows? If an open environment is so eagerly wanted, then i'd suggest they go open up a KGS in Tando Allah Yar!

Habib | 14 years ago | Reply The person responsible for that construction has to be a bigger shot for these parents to protest...hmmm...perhaps a phone call from someone's daddy could not solve the issue...or maybe they just wanted publicity. In any case, a well written article in terms of pointing out how the hearts and minds of men in this city and nation are dead. Wait, they did protest for something they believed in or so it seems. Maybe they'r still alive. Maybe the people writing comments are dead from the inside too, right?? Or are they?? Voicing out opinions. The protesters wanted environmental safety for their children while sitting in a nallah (hahaha seriously??) The writer responded by writing 7 paras of 'the country is burning, look around you.' The people responded with mixed views, most agreed, some disagreed. We'v all broken signals, bribed policemen and other officials, we'v all made those phone calls that get us out of trouble at some point in our lives, we'v all trashed the country in some form, doubled parked cars, hit n runs, littered, badmashi (servants included, papu is a human being too, dont make him walk in the heat coz you want a pack of smokes), the list goes on and on and on...think about it. The pot calling the kettle black. But since we'r in the business of calling each other out....perhaps now would be a good time to mention....people are dying of hunger, they dont have homes, clothes, drinking water...and you people want to argue about what is right and wrong in this picture. SHAME ON ALL OF US!!!! We'r no worst than those people protesting...think about it. If there was a news paper for the hungry and poor of this country, it would read. "I am from a well fed family and I can argue about whether some people's kids can or cannot study next to....a big building???' In case your wondering, this newspaper is for the masala wanting people of this country. Something to talk about over tea yea....(been there, done that right?? yes you have, dont deny it. How many people have you mentioned this article to??)

AA | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: I honestly have only one thing to say to you: you are one bitter woman! And please let me know your nephews name, because I am 110% sure that KGS could never have said this. I know this because I do not come from a rich family, I could not afford to go for any international trips. Also KGS is the only school that does not TAKE their students on international trips. All other schools take their students abroad, and if the student does not go it simply makes the student disheartened since everyone else is going. HOW is it elistest then? Also, majority of the KGS students go to college on a full scholarship. They are amazing, brilliant young minds. Straight As is not the only thing that matters - KGS makes you a well rounded individual. Also, the comment about having bars at their houses and constant parties was completely unfair, and that is what I base my opinion about you being bitter on. Please do not generalize. Partying and drinking is far more common in schools like American School and Bayview. They are still good schools, its unfair to generalize.

AA | 14 years ago | Reply Security of a school vs having a high rise building. Its that simple. It is not about KGS vs another school. I cannot believe all these people who have commented against KGS are for the high rise building. Shouldnt the response be automatic? A school is supposed to be top priority - in any community! There is no argument here!

Anum Ahmed | 14 years ago | Reply Theres a lot of comments here which are not directly related to the issue, but I'd like to clear a few misconceptions. @ Nadir: KGS is not the most expensive school around, so you cant call the kids who go to kgs elitist in that sense. The fee of lots of schools is more than KGS. Im an ex grammarian, and I know of about 30 kids in my batch who came to school in public buses. Did you know about 60% of our students go to colleges on financial aid? @ Justsomeonelse: This requirement (about having to have a 7 A* marksheet) is true, but only for new grammarians. While new grammarians do also get into good colleges, it is a fact that majority of the students who end up going to IV leagues or Oxbridge are old grammarians, who do not need a 7A* marksheet, so Kgs HAS indeed 'produced' these students. (No offense to new grammarians - like I said, they get amazing grades) @Tippu: Yes there are many other natural hazards, but those are hazards which no one can do anything about. This, on the other hand, is a hazard which we can control, so why willingly consent to a hazard to the kids? And im not saying this is only for kgs students, I think all kids should be protected againt any possible or potential danger. @Rabia: I know lots of Grammarians dont come back to Pakistan, but there are a few loyal ones who do come back even after studying at a top college. So even if we get just a few students from a college like Harvard back to Pakistan, thats absolutely great, Yes, the protest that was made was a little petty, but again, there was never any harm in a peaceful protest. As for traffic blockages, KGS is not the only school that blocks traffic. Also KGS is the only (or maybe one of the few) schools whose parents and teachers actually volunteer to stand outside a school at 7 am, to control traffic. How many other schools do that?

parvez | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: Agreed Grammarian's do have an attitude problem but your passionate distaste of this is a bit disconcerting. Relax a bit, give it some space. Life is too short for bitterness. Please can we we leave it at that. Cheers !!

lammy | 14 years ago | Reply i am still waiting for Sabeen's confirmation. I personally still think that is a false story.

Tamaaz Khan | 14 years ago | Reply I do not understand what this article is protesting. The fact that people feel strongly about an issue or that they belong to an educational institute of high standards? These people have the right to stand up for their interest as they feel. Building a highrise in a residential area is quite irregular and against EPA standards and an inconvenience to the school and those who own houses around the area. If you have an issue with the traffic jam for 30 mins in the morning and 30 mins in the afternoon, why not take out your own protest? After all we Pakistani's love a protest. Didn't we all protest to support the resinstatement of an corrupt NRO judge against other corrupt NRO judges? What is a righteous protest in your mind? p.s. A smelly Nullah is not an enviornmental hazard. What do you expect people to protest on that front, that it is smelly and should smell like roses? Pointless article!

Mariam Sabri | 14 years ago | Reply I'm sorry to say the tone of this article is extremely unprofessional and immature. You're not really addressing a wider social problem very effectively, in fact, it's not even clear what social problem you are trying to address. I think it's wrong for people like you and Syed Nadir El-Edroos to assume that KGS as an institution that only/alone represents the children of the elite. Yes I agree that no one should be on a high horse because they went to KGS. That really is no reason to have a superiority complex. Those who do are clearly idiots who should not to be taken seriously. Any kind of institutional or national pride in never something to indulge in. But then again those that take this behavior to be representative of the institution as a whole and criticize it to an unfair degree are no better. They often have their own insecurities related to not getting into the institution. So what if you didn't go to KGS? It doesn't mean you're lesser than someone who did. It also doesn't mean you're somehow better than those who did. There are plenty of us who get admission into that institution because of a great deal of hard work and good grades and not because our parents had $$$$. We attended the school knowing that it would help us excel and get into good colleges/universities. It isn't that KGS 'monopolizes' all these opportunities, it just aids those students who take the initiative to avail those opportunities no matter what walk of life they maybe from. Furthermore, I can personally attest to the fact that of the many A Level schools out there KGS is hardly 'over-priced'. Four years ago, when I was applying to A Level schools it was the cheaper than its two main competitors. I've been informed that that's still the case. A few of my friends who had the grades to get into the school but still found it a little difficult to afford talked to the administration personally about their problem, and they were kind enough to offer them some sort of financial support. Unlike its other major competitor in Clifton, KGS didn't charge a huge admission fee. I was also disgusted by how this other school forced students to pay this amount within a day if they wanted admission, well before KGS put up their admissions list.

Serfed1009 | 14 years ago | Reply Rabia 5 days ago @Mustafa Hanif: Dear Hanif being an ex grammarian and also a grad of one of the ‘best’ foreign universities myself, I would like to ask how is many Grammarians studying in elitist universities abroad a contribution of KGS to Pakistan! Atleast don't lie about how you went to grammar in your comments Ms. Rabia.

CF | 14 years ago | Reply This article is against a group of parents protesting a 22 storey COMMERCIAL BUILDING in a RESIDENTIAL AREA. HOW did this ''reputable'' newspaper let go of the fact that this author has mentioned nothing of the sort. Making this article read like one written by a child riddled with insecurities. PATHETIC! Why is it that such jealousy is shown towards KGS? Is it the number one ranking? The amount given to charity? The excellence in all fields? Why is it that people look for more and more excuses to rant about KGS. What would be the point of the govt enforcing rules for each school to have barbed wire and snipers on the roof if there’s a huge building next door. I also laugh at the stupidity of the person who said getting into Harvard is not an achievement, please do indulge us in what you think justifies itself as an achievement? Missing the most vital flaw in the article about the building being commercial? Why doesn’t the Tribune hire competent authors who don’t let their personal feelings get in the way of an article? It seems this Mr. Popalzai isn’t really very well versed in journalism. The easiness with which the rest of the country turns against the second oldest school of the subcontinent is absurd. Why don’t they try and attain a great reputation for their schools? I doubt this will get published but if atleast one person on the newspaper staff reads it they can start making amends I’m deeply disappointed in this newspaper and this author for all this just sounds like petty jealousy.

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply @parvez: As mentioned earlier to Humanflux, my comments are based entirely on my personal opinion and do not in any way reflect anything else. Thanks for enjoying them though.. I can be far more bitter but that would just be taking this to another level which is not needed for now :) And I can be off base a little bit but cannot be that "way" off base .. Grammarians have chronic attiude problems mostly and its a fact! Cheers.

parvez | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen: You'r way off base here. If the parents are loaded than Grammarian or not it becoms easy. I may not have agreed with your comments but I had fun reading them. Best wishes and good luck to you.

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen I apologize if my comment seemed too personal. That was not my aim. I was flabbergasted by some of the points you had raised and had wanted clarification. As for me asking you what you do for your country etc, that was bought up by your comment about Grammarians wasting their time with silly protests while important issues were being ignored. A valid point but people will first and foremost look out for themselves that is a fact. And people here seem to think that the "duty" of the "KGS elite" is to rid the country of all its evils. I have already stated my problem with that in an earlier comment of mine. And please do let me know (possibly in the comment section of this blog only) about the names of the interviewers. If this is true then it is a serious matter which needs to be looked into. And as for what I do: I work in a non profit org. in Karachi despite being a Grammarian and having obtained two degrees from abroad (and I am not an exception). I just wish people would indulge in dialogue with the so called grammarian "elites" before bashing them.

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply @Max. I agree with you. There is no absolute freedom but a multiplicity of them. However, either everyone has a right to protest or no one does. By denying them the right you would deny yourself the right too. Also thanks for actually posting a good/relevant argument about the whole business. People here seem intent on just bashing each other rather instead of trying to tackle the issue.

Max | 14 years ago | Reply The claim, apart from environmental hazards, is that the building is a 'security risk'. I'm not sure if building a 22 story tower next to the school would increase the security risk a lot than how much it already exists. As far as I can recreate from memory, the school is surrounded within a one mile radius by building tall enough to give a direct line of sight into the school from the roofs. Those buildings technically represent an equal security risk in my opinion. So my point is, that protesting that a building not be built because its 'very' next to a school on the grounds of security risk is baseless. Plus if an attack was to be conducted just to create 'chaos' (quoting from the main article), an sane terrorist would attack when the schools get off. Don't packed roads with children represent a security risk?. Further, I see some people saying that ignoring other things, they have a right to protest if they consider their school is threatened by whatever risk or they are inconvenienced. However, in certain cases its not a question of whether I have a right to something which decides the morality of my actions. For example, having paid my road tax, I had a right to demand those protesters to get the hell off the road so I could drive through there (assuming they were blocking it, remember this only is an example). I'm not sure, however, if it would have been ethical to do so.

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply @humanflux: I think it is apparent from my comment that it’s based on my "personal opinion" and hence I have used the word "mostly" where appropriate. There could be odd one's out in the lot as mentioned by yourself hence I do agree that not every one may fall in the category as described in my earlier comment however that number is seriously scarce. Also my earlier comment does not seem to be worked up but yours surely does. It’s a matter of experience and the example I had shared is 100% correct. This was a few years back but I can get back to you with details of people who carried the interview accordingly. Let me check with my sister on that one. As far as my doing something about our government is concerned.. What do you want me to do exactly and how is that going to be related to my work? I vote for one thing.. Ever since I became eligible, I have been voting. I exercise my rights.. So what if my vote does not count for now.. One day it might.. At least I don’t sit in my air conditioned room and try to negate facts.. I protest & I act as much as I possibly can against humanitarian issues.. from collecting funds for children who are dying of hunger in flood affected areas to writing & spreading word against our corrupt regime as when facts become available.. Most of all, myself and few of my friends actively recommend & assist less privilege people in getting jobs so that they can get dou waqt kee roti (which is a privilege in this inflation) . I do not have to explain my self any further to you on what I do because clearly I play my part as an active citizen & I am quite satisfied with that. On the other hand, you should really think of what you do other than defending KGS elites!

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply @parvez: Apparently its quite easy if your parents are loaded that is !

parvez | 14 years ago | Reply @sabeen - from your comment its apparent that being a Grammarian is not easy.

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply @Sabeen I still don't get the issue, if they want to protest let them go ahead and protest. Why are you getting so worked up about it? And for every grammarian you may or may not have come across I can show you many more of them who a did not go through their contacts to land jobs. "They go to Harvard and Oxford etc. mostly because their elitist parents can afford to send them to these institutions" Really? All that's needed to get into these institutions is for their parents to be able to afford it? Check up on grammarians from the Class of 2006, not a single grammarian that I an recall who went to an Ivy League school went fully on his/her parents own dime. All of the Ivy Leaguers got scholarships, need based or merit based or some sort of financial assistance. "During an interview session, my Nephew who now did his A-levels from an ordinary school and got straight A’s so much so that he was offered a full scholarship at Oxford was rejected by KGS administration citing reasons that his parents could not afford to send him on international trips if required in future as per school’s policy and that the child would not fit in because his parents were ordinary salaried Pakistanis" I'm sorry I don't know you and I don't usually jump to conclusions but this seems false.But could you please find out the name of the person from KGS who took this interview and let me know? Thanks. "Sorry to burst your bubble Grammarians but you guys are extremely wrong and self obsessed & not that brilliant considering the work of few Grammarians I have had an opportunity to work with" Key word: "Few". So based on a few grammarians you have generalized the 200+ students who graduate from there every year? And then I bet it's people like you who complain when the West stereotypes Muslims. Also as a VP of a FOREIGN OWNED bank what are you doing do deal with our our corrupt government and depleting resources etc. etc.?

Sabeen | 14 years ago | Reply Umm... Let’s cut the discussion short... The irony is that people who go to KGS think of themselves as superior beings. I should know... I work in a foreign bank and have to deal with ranting of the so called “Grammarians” more often than others. During my almost nine years of experience, there have been a number of times when most former students from KGS (who I interview for any open position) often then most introduce themselves as “Grammarians”. They do that proudly, thinking that it will affect the way how the interview will proceed forward just because they went to an elitist school and assuming that this statement will benefit them somehow. And no this introduction has nothing to do with the supposedly top class education that they receive from KGS, its basically to make a statement that they belong to the “Elite” hence beware! The Grammarians think that they own the entire country, they deserve the best jobs and that they are the cream produced as far as our country's educational system is concerned... Ahhh... Sorry to burst your bubble Grammarians but you guys are extremely wrong and self obsessed & not that brilliant considering the work of few Grammarians I have had an opportunity to work with. Yes, KGS is an elitist educational institute and people who manage to send their children to this institution belong to the elite class MOSTLY. During an interview session, my Nephew who now did his A-levels from an ordinary school and got straight A’s so much so that he was offered a full scholarship at Oxford was rejected by KGS administration citing reasons that his parents could not afford to send him on international trips if required in future as per school’s policy and that the child would not fit in because his parents were ordinary salaried Pakistanis... Sad but true. It’s a completely different story how my nephew did not require the supposedly best education to get the grades he got finally but still.. This example had to be quoted for the “Grammarians” who think they are the “best” when they are not. They go to Harvard and Oxford etc. mostly because their elitist parents can afford to send them to these institutions. Then these “Grammarians” find jobs mostly in foreign institutions because of a pathetic precedence and culture which forcibly claims that since someone has studied in so and so institution he/she must be very intelligent .. And the cycle goes on. These people speak English in their adopted British or American accents, go to parties, have private bars in their homes, can mingle with other elites easily, already have contacts and hence it becomes a piece of cake for them to manage the job without even having the expertise or necessary skills. And who am I kidding, mostly they don’t even need a job, they just do it for fun. In case by reading my post some “Grammarians” assume that I am an under accomplished individual who hates elites, please be informed that I am VP in a foreign bank having done my Masters and hence my above mentioned comments are based on my personal experience with “Grammarians”. I made my way up from bottom to the top and I think the lessons learned during this journey were quite valuable something most “Grammarians” are deprived off. I am not against the elite but I am against the concept of “every one is equal but some are more equal then others”. And for crying out loud, it’s a high rise building, not an American Embassy which is being built next to the damn school building. Get over it. We have bigger issues to deal with like our corrupt government and depleting resources etc. etc.

Sarah B. Haider | 14 years ago | Reply @Syed: Gatekeepers = Sub-Editors.

Sarah B. Haider | 14 years ago | Reply @lubna lakhani: His **

fudge | 14 years ago | Reply KGS itself is a security risk for other 'students' with their drunk after-parties and the drugs the students take .... the parents should know what's going on in the school rather than worrying about commercial buildings .....Pakistan is hanging by a thread and these 'literate' people of our society , the elites can think of THIS reason to hold protests ? .... Although yes , the commercial building shouldn't be built due to some legal issues which i dont know of , but doing this sort of stuff makes us look like stupid westerners ..... SECURITY RISK ?? are u kidding me ?? if my parents were doing THIS protest i would jump in the 'nallah' beside KGS and die to be honest due to the shame ...

Moiz | 14 years ago | Reply I always thought people studying in such elite High schools must have some 'brains' but frankly lol..

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @parvez: yeah!!!!

parvez | 14 years ago | Reply Report in Daily dawn is that the KGS has won its case. Way of the world -- if you have the clout then use it.

F | 14 years ago | Reply This is so stupid. Saying that KGS students go abroad because they have the money. They work their backsides off to be good enough for foreign universities. They dont get in on financial basis. Many of them ask for financial aid. They go because they are good enough to. And generalizing kids to be snobs and a couple of rich kids is a crude generalization. As only a small fraction are very very rich, most are from middle class families. And to the one who mentioned the children apending on parties: You have to understand human psychology. Children need to have an outlet like that. And name any school that does not have children throwing parties! And KGS has a fee lower than many of the other private schools in Karachi. The fee is actually low compared to the education and opportunity the school offers to students. So please stop generalizing!

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Syed, Syed Ali Raza and Zubair can you guys stop pursuing an argument that you guys have lost? seriously, I don't see you objecting to the hundreds of policemen assigned to different schools, institutions, politicians and influential businessmen and the security threat they face, but you seem to have a lot of problem with the security threat we face. Our school has received more bomb threats than most of the other schools of karachi combined and i think we have a full right to ask for protection. Also, more than half of the guards employed at kgs are non-governmental and are paid for the school. Also, the schools security system which includes cameras, razed wires and concrete blocks have been financed by the school. We aren't asking the government to park hundreds of police mobiles to block the road while the school is going on, we are just asking the concerned authorities to stop and illegal act from being committed and to help us counter threats that may (and are MOST LIKELY) to emerge in near future. The proposed building will take atleast 5 to 6 years to complete. During this time, the builders will encroach upon the service lane of Khayaban-e-Saadi as a storage/unloading point for their construction material. Concrete will be prepared on the spot and hazardous fumes and a lot of dust will rise into the air and disturb the peace and well being of the surrounding schools and houses. You are forgetting that this protest is being led by KGS and SHEHRI, and that they arent the only parties that are being affected. Most of the areas residents registered complaints and wrote letter to the Sindh Environmental Protection Agency to step in and nullify the issued NOC so that the building can not be built. I don't remember KGS asking for the nallah to be removed, primarily because it is not a doable task and KGS has already built a wall along its boundary facing that side, thus reducing the risks of health hazards from their side. Even if we go for a crazy hypothetical theory that a suicide bomber or a group of armed terrorists will somehow jump out of the nallah, climb over a 25 feet tall wall covered with razor wires, and enter to the school, the children of college section (15-19) are somewhat old enough and responsible enough to assess the situation and act accordingly. Compared to them, the children of Nursery and primary classes are less capable of understanding the gravity of the situation. Older children know how to react if there is a hostage situation, younger children do not. Older children are less prone to diseases, younger children are less immune to them. Older children understand the long term implications of a high-rise being built next door to their school,younger children do not. All the younger children do know at their young and innocent age is that there is going to be a tall building next door and that building is troubling their school and that both their school and their parents don't want that building to be made. They come to school to get educated, to play, meet their friends and learn the morals and values expected from them in their society. They cannot be bothered with such distractions. I also don't remember anyone nominating our school as an International Cultural Heritage. Need I remind you that the Saddar campus is over 160 years old and according to the constitution of Pakistan, is technically eligible to be declared as a National Treasure and National Cultural Heritage? Also, the school qualifies to be declared an Internationally Protected Cultural Heritage according to the criteria of the United Nations body for Cultural Affairs. @Umar kc Yo, think about what you say before you say it understand? there are over 70% of Grammarians who represent Pakistan abroad. The other schools you mentioned are the other 30%. Sadly, others either don't get the required grades or can't pay the required fee. Feel free to check this up and let me know what you find. Because I know one thing for sure, no matter what you or anyone else finds/fabricates, you cannot erase the truth, which as always, lies on our side.

Syed | 14 years ago | Reply Gatekeepers? You dont mean... KGS = Karachi Grammar Security??? REALLY? Kidding. If what you say is true, you have a point.

Syed | 14 years ago | Reply I like Zubairs suggestion, but they should make the junior and senior campus buildings high rises and connect them like the petronas towers!!!! WHOA!!!!!

Sarah B. Haider | 14 years ago | Reply @Ali: He might as though be jealous, but let me tell you a bunch of people working at the Express Tribune were proud students of KGS, so I am sure the writer was not deliberately trying to denounce a particular elite school as some of the gatekeepers are themselves from KGS. He is just being objective because this is a non-issue.

Mustafa | 14 years ago | Reply I studied in KGS, and i think high rises would disrupt traffic in the area. But that point has already been mentioned and i would like to point out that when i was studying in the saddar campus, at times people from the neighboring high rises, would throw rotten fruit and trash on the campus. Not saying that the people in every apartment complex do that and that it will certainly happen next to the junior school campus, just putting it out there as a disadvantage of having a apartment complex next to the school.

UmR.. | 14 years ago | Reply The concern shouldn't be saving the "National Treasure", it should be saving the "Nation"....

09 | 14 years ago | Reply if you want extra cars and traffic on boast basin and my kolachi you're just stupid. sorry, but its true.

Syed Ali Raza | 14 years ago | Reply Bravo Zubair! ... and they can bring all the campuses to one state of the art building. Solves a lot of problems for the parents.

Zubair | 14 years ago | Reply KGS should make a taller building.. Competition

omar kc | 14 years ago | Reply @Mustafa Hanif: really? out of KGS,st patricks,city school system,Aitchison college,beaconhouse school system,lahore grammar school,Lyceum you are sayin 70% of those studying in reputable universities abroad are from KGS??. adding up all the reputable campuses of city school and beaconhouse,you are saying that out of 30 odd schools, KGS contribute 70% to class institutions? youve either been smokiing the wrong stuff or your one of the parents protesting,

Syed | 14 years ago | Reply I propose KGS push for the removal of the Creature of the Black Lagoon from the nullah next to the senior campus! That guys is going to cause some serious trouble one of these days I tell you. Also I personally think all the apartments across the nullah should be razed to the ground, snipers are tricky and their scopes have long rangers. Plus there is news that UNESCO is considering making KGS a world heritage site, regardless of campus!!!!! THE 1847 ARGUEMENT WORKED YOU GUYS! VICTORY IS OURS!!!

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Zaiba Zawar: agreed

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @sarah.elahi: thanks a lot. but one question prevails. the author can use as much indirect hate speech that he can disguise within his article? how about cautioning the author of this article about not targeting institutions? Although its a blog, it is still on the website of a popular newspaper which is an international one and articles such as these can cause problems on a large scale. thanks.

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Mr. Kapadia: Cheers sir! These people don't seem to realize the threat at hand. When I visualize that building, I can almost see it from our yard in the College Section and then it hits me in the head repeatedly - in five years time when those nursery students see the building, and inhale that smoke and polluted air in an age where a child is prone to diseases, they will wonder what both you and us older students did to stop them and why we couldn't succeed. About why THEY should suffer the long-term side affects just so another corrupt official can fill his pockets and that another builder can make a quick buck!

sarah.elahi | 14 years ago | Reply

@Ali Zain: A delay in comments being posted is not due to concern over content. Comments are approved periodically by the web team and if your comment does not contain hate speech or bad language, it will be posted. A delay most probably indicates that the team is working on other things and will check comments in a few minutes. Thanks for waiting.

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply @Sajjad Ahmed: we can go study wherever our results and pockets allow us. We can also move away and never come to Pakistan again, but that will never change our identities as Pakistanis. The country is befitting by us representing Pakistan abroad. You expect us to study hard, and then come back to join the most cursed government on earth? Our bureaucracy and our government are the people who are responsible for the country's grave state. I'd rather be unemployed and not have food to eat than have food to eat which hasn't been legally and lawfully earned. The cream deserves to make their decisions. If someone feels they should abandon Pakistan, then both you and I, or anyone else for that matter, can't tell them how to live their life. I don't see you complaining when children from other schools go abroad never to return! why target KGS?

Zaiba Zawar | 14 years ago | Reply Last year, 2009 to be precise, a much awaited, half constructed flyover in Gizri, was protested against by the administration and parents of a govt. school located nearby, for the reason that it jeopardized the safety of the school children studying there. Along with the other objections raised by the residents of that area whose property was getting devalued due to this flyover, this school had put up camps with people on token hunger strike in support of this protest. While it is very easy to point fingers, the latest, hottest and mostly useless trend of our media, one should try to understand the main issue before commenting on it. The protest here was not against a high rise near the school, in isolation. The protest, which was equally attended and supported by the neighborhood residents, is basically against the unsolicited commercialization of this or any other area where someone big is getting a bigger share to pocket. Will this be the only high rise in the area? Obviously not. The minute work starts on this one, the other plots will be grabbed by the land mafia and before we know it, another concrete jungle would be thriving, adding to the already ugly skyline of the city. Does that mean we stop the wheel of progress? Definitely not. But we should definitely step in the way of illegal changes being made to the already existing plans in which people have invested for a long term plan. We can buy apartments if we feel that they suit us better, but if we invest in a property which lies in a non commercial, limited height area and wake up one morning to find excavators digging deep trenches for the foundations of an even higher structure, our privacy goes out of the window and our investment down the drain. This is only one side of the story. The load on the water and electricity supplies of the area, the drainage and sewerage, the road works, the pollution caused by the added traffic and the air conditioners and generators, are some of the more obvious issues. The security issues that plagued the schools across Pakistan last autumn have of course been brushed under the carpets of the law enforcing agencies. As for the issue why it should be brought up in the neighborhood of KGS and nowhere else? Because they had the guts to stand up to it and the unity to fight it out together. The brains, running most of the important offices around town, have their stakes here. And believe it or not, most of them are neither born with golden spoons nor possess one now. However, they are people who have given considerable importance to education, not only as the piece of paper showing their qualifications, but in the growth of their personalities, perceptions and mindset. Someone took an offense to the comment once made that "KGS is an institution for a chosen few." These are not the "Elitist few" but those who can achieve grades high enough to get in and can work hard enough to cope with the standards(two thirds of those passing out from the school join at middle and high level, which is solely on merit basis) I personally know people who spend all they earn in a month to pay the school fees of their children here simply for the quality of schooling (which does not only mean bookish knowledge). No doubt there are the richie poos around for whom it is merely peanuts and more a class symbol, but are all the rich of the city attending this school alone? If not, how come they never stand up for the issues faced by their schools or their areas? Instead of applauding those who find the courage to stand up against the system(or the lack of it) the propagators of "change" are the ones who become the hindrance themselves, simply because they are not a part of it. Remember, the success of a good cause means we all win; if it fails, we all suffer together. If we had only stood up to the influx of the Afghan Refugees and their free movement all over the country during the Zia regime, a lot of what we are suffering today could have been avoided. So instead of criticism lend support to a good cause. It might be your neighborhood next.

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply yellow journalism. post my comments already!

Sajjad Ahmed | 14 years ago | Reply @Ali Zain - Problem is not that you are going abroad and representing our country (which is a good sign indeed) - problem is that the country at large is not benefitting from the output of the 'premier' school of the city !! The government positions - our bureaucracy - our military and our educational faculty right now demand the cream of the country to come to them -- and where is that 'cream' is anybody's guess !!

Hasan | 14 years ago | Reply Are you a Patrician or what :D

Faisal Kapadia | 14 years ago | Reply @Shaheryar Popalzai When you say this is not a report or an article, what exactly do you mean? Are you trying to say this blogpost/writeup should not be taken seriously? Blogs FYI are the most read news source in the world today, internationally they have overtaken mainstream media long ago. There are studies on this available online. If you are suggesting your blogs are not to be taken seriously then why exercise comment on this issue at all? How will people interpret what you have written as something other than derogatory when you use the following words “Some of us who have to travel by Boat Basin have to face some inconvenience while the policemen obediently stand by making sure nobody offends ‘the wrong people’, even though they’re not being law abiding citizens at all” You effectively called hundreds of parents the “wrong people” what did you expect roses in return for this statement? Your post fails to mention where the rubbish heap is situated when you use the following words “KGS is located next to a nullah, but obviously the trash, dirty water and whatever else is housed within the nullah has never been a health hazard for the kids” So lets be fair shall we as you say lets not be vague and then play victim later. The title was not picked by you? Is this the best you can do man? No doubt this is a well written piece but what you are claiming reeks of unprofessionalism and not just on your part. No you didn’t question the morals or the ethics of people who send their kids to KGS you just wrote us all off as elitists who effectively brow beat anything that offends us while we sit on our high horses, you don’t have to say anything to imply something. Just tell us what your definition of elitist is and when you use it do you differ from what the word means in the dictionary? Perhaps we are all wrong to think it means someone who thinks a tad too much of themselves? The simple facts are that this blog post was a rant by you against those you perceive as whats wrong with the system/society in Pakistan but in doing so you forgot that you are taking on not just what you perceive as irritating and unjust but people who know how to read and write just as well as you do. I personally do not agree with the personal remarks said to you or about you but when you write knee jerk posts you should expect knee jerk reactions. Having said that its your opinion, flaunt it all you want just kindly do not use it to twist an issue important to the Parents concerned into something it is not. This protest is not about the some kind of class structure or perception of us vs them or some kind of ploy to stop development work in Karachi. Its about the desire to not see one’s kid inhale construction dust in their school yard and study in the shadow of an imminent security threat from the vantage point of a high rise structure.

Ali | 14 years ago | Reply I hope Mr. Shaheryar Popalzai will not play the true hypocrite when its time for his children to begin schooling. Hopefully, he will put them up for admission at an average non-elitist school and then organize a rally to fight whatever ills or issues he finds there.......... Bottom line: you don't stop waging a war against lesser evils just because there are bigger one's present. Illegal commercialization without following laid out laws & protocols is indeed illegal and worth fighting for.....

Faiz Khalil | 14 years ago | Reply As a current student of KGS, I'd just like to say that the protest was completely justified. The building of a 222 story commercial (not apartment, as was originally stated) building next to the Junior section campus will have serious repercussions. The security and environmental hazards themselves ill be considerable. As for KGS being an "elitist" institution, I'd advise the writer of this biased piece of writing to take the time to compare the fees structure of Grammar with that of comparable institutions like Nixor, Lyceum, the City School, etc. @the person who said KGS is enforcing a "rigid class system"- Many of my contemporaries in Grammar are middle class, and substantial financial aid is also provided to those who lack the resources to study here. To those who complain about the traffic jams, they ought to go outside other schools in Karachi at home-time. The traffic jams are much, much worse. KGS has the right to protest when the security of its students is threatened.

@zainab imam from Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply we are not an NGO that goes around fighting for everyone's rights to oppose commercialization. if they city has been badly planned, blame the corrupt rulers and governors. those who were affected should have spoken up. 60 years ago, there wasnt a bomb-threat every hour and extremism wasnt as serious as it is today. look at the times and then voice your opinions accordingly. we fight for what we believe is right. this is affecting us and we will fight for our rights!

@deen- from Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply just to create 100s of jobs, you want us to compromise the security of 850 children from the junior section and 850 from college section?is this what you call sensible understanding? do you not understand the problem here? youre the kind of people who have made this into a fish market debate. if people want to make big buildings, they can do it elsewhere in commercial areas. WE WILL NOT LET THEM POLLUTE OUR SCHOOL'S SURROUNDING AREA WITH MONEY MAKING SCHEMES. DO IT ELSEWHERE WHERE PEOPLE ARE IGNORANT OF THEIR RIGHTS, WE ARENT!

@sajjad ahmed- from Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply yo, if we study hard, go abroad and settle there, its because of the effort we have put in and the fact the those abroad appreciate it. even while abroad, we play a vital role in representing pakistan as a country which produces hard-working and honest people like us. just because you got stuck here and didn't get good college admissions or a foreign visa doesnt mean you pick on our school acha. we are what we are because we work hard. why do you think we require 8As for a' level admission? its because thats the minimum you need to match our academic standards.

Jiya | 14 years ago | Reply @D'oh: Um the students didn't go out on the road actually, it was the parents. Please get your facts straight

JusticeForAll | 14 years ago | Reply People are getting extremely sensitive, defensive and judgmental on both sides of the divide. This forum should be used for healthy discourse and credit be given to Mr. Popalzai and everyone else who has taken the time to voice their opinions. The issue should not be about KGS; and instead we should all realize that we are residents of Karachi and citizens of Pakistan, and have a moral and religious duty to correct all forms of injustice and ills in our society. Have already stated for the record that i am an OG but that doesnt mean we should become defensive about Mr. Popalzai's comments; he is entitled to same; while the facts may be corrected, ultimately, we should this as an opportunity to come together for galvanizing a part of society that has divorced itself of all responsibility for this city/country; that includes people from KGS and every other English medium school!!!

Deen | 14 years ago | Reply @Sara Ali: @Bilal Zaidi FYI, I am a Grammarian Alumni, an OG infact, feel free to look me up, CLASS of 2004!!!! I do not appreciate your direct attacks on me, I did not attack the both of you, I dont even know who you tow are, I can only assume by the nature of your remarks, your both grammarians also. just because we are Grammarians, does not mean we show a blind eye to some realities on the grounds or ignore the questionable attitude of some Grammarians, alumni, parents, faculty members. As one smart commenter above pointed, this is just a blog, not a sophisticated piece of journalism, so the blogger can not be blamed for showing lack of objectivity from your stand point. I can not believe how aggressively some Grammarian teachers got involved in this Fish market style debate. My reference to a Grammarian teacher, whose entry was not only long, but was full of hostile aggressive words, mostly written in Capitals. Should not be too hard to find. The other reality on the ground is, that Karachi is a rapidly growing city, with a population in excess of 15 million people now, Karachi like any other major urban centre of any developing nation faces the same challenge as other cities. The need to develop more commercialised zones and sectors, needs to plan for the future, develop infrastructure, urban planning is a complicated practise, even if you argue that under the table deals are happening in this country. Reality is, the place, where the building will be constructed is now a legally permitted commercial part of Clifton, hence no illegal activity. It was only a matter of time, if it did not happen in 2010, it would have happened in 2012 or 2015, as Karachi's financial district due to lack of space can not accommodate commercial urban ventures, the need is there to expand to other areas also. Just come to Tariq Road sometime or Gulshan e Iqbal, when you get the chance, they used to be purely residential Areas until the early 90's, due to the needs of the city and the growth of commercial activities, such areas have become a blend of residential and commercial, while I agree overlapping happens, and can be a cause of residents in the area, such development is inevitible as cities grow and expand. Have you ever given a thought to how this project might benefit, It would create 100s of jobs in the city, it would create income for labourers, contractors, architects, urban planners, as well as all the local companies who would benefit from providing services to this building. The best way, for this rather ridiculous debate to come to an end is, local residents, school admin, sits down with the developers and the regulators and discuss a middle GROUND that is ACCEPTABLE to all. They should work together to figure out, how their concerns can be address, at the same time, developers can go ahead and develop it. Both the residents, school admin/students/parents, developers, local authorities, should stop being selfish, just sit down and TALK, im sure a solution that makes everyone happy is doable

Farooq | 14 years ago | Reply Well done Shaheryar, your blog did garner a lot of attention mainly due to facebook posts and chain email etc. KGS does polarize opinion, and always will, due to obvious reasons. I would suggest that having had your share of the limelight, you now move on to more pressing issues. Our journalists (not unlike those in other countries) prefer sensationalism to good, credible journalism simply because it sells better.

lammy | 14 years ago | Reply and @ syed ali raza. do you know something called google? i do :D Notable alumni

This is an incomplete list, which may never be able to satisfy particular standards for completeness. You can help by expanding it with reliably sourced entries.

* Chaudhary Muhammad Ali - Special Secretary to Chief Minister of the Government of Sindh (2004–2007)
* Benazir Bhutto - Former Prime Minister of Pakistan[10][11]
* Asif Ali Zardari - Incumbent President of Pakistan [12]
* Bilawal Bhutto - Co-Chairman of Pakistan Peoples Party
* Murtaza Bhutto - Senior Member of Pakistan Peoples Party
* Ghulam Mustafa Jatoi - politician, acting President of Pakistan
* Atta ur Rahman - scientist, Organic Chemistry, Fellow Royal Society London , Federal minister for science and technology [13]
* Hameed Haroon - C.E.O Dawn Media Group[citation needed]
* Kamila Shamsie - Pakistani novelist [14]
* Hussain Haroon - Pakistani Ambassador to UN [15]
* Sadeq Sayeed - banker and Businessman
* Princess Sarvath
* Abdurrahman Wahid -[citation needed] President of Indonesia (1999–2001)
* Waheed Murad - Pakistani film actor, producer and script writer.
* Nazia Hassan - Pakistani pop singer
* Zohaib Hassan
* Pervez Hoodbhoy -nuclear physicist,and political-defence analyst [16]
* Arieb Azhar [17]

source: wikipedia

lammy | 14 years ago | Reply also. for your all's info, the Saddar campus was built WAY before half of the high rise buildings around it.

Sara Ali | 14 years ago | Reply @syed ali raza. why dont you name those politicians. there have been quite a few from grammar and yes some of them are/were bad people/politicians. but no one here is saying that all grammarians are perfect. or that there aren't other equally good or better places. thats what you and others like you ASSUME we think. and as someone else has mentioned, its people like you who have created this apparent difference btw grammar and other schools. its you people who have created this notion of KGS and its students being out of this world or whatever. as for people who keep calling grammarians brats and snobs and rich kids etc, get your facts straight. go and actually meet grammarians and you'll see for yourself how many of them are actually snobs and rich kids and brats.sure there are some kids like that, but then there are kids like that in EVERY school. there are people from all sorts of backgrounds going to grammar. and trust me most of them are not from this 'elite' class you guys are talking about. and people who talk about grammar having a 'bura mohaal', seriously? if,by bura mohaal you mean kids doing drugs and drinking etc, thats only a few out of the thousands in the school. and there are kids who do all that in other schools too. and thats not even only other schools like grammar, even some kids in govt schools do those things. that reflects poorly on the kids themselves. you CAN NOT blame the school for those handful of people. but if you want to, then don't just blame grammar, blame every school. but you won't cuz obviously for you guys grammar is the root of all evil. you wont even bother to even TRY to give VALID points to support your hate for grammar and all things grammar.

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @Ahmer: This isn't a private blog where you can write whatever the hell you please with no basis on facts. Its a part of a Pakistani newspaper that people from around the world may read. You cannot go around using a public blog as an excuse to create/represent a stereotype.

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @Shaheryar Popalzai: You defined the mindset by using a generalization from the people of our school. I think that says enough about your skills. As for the charity work thing, you clearly pointed a finger at the parents who were protesting for their children when there are more pressing issues around us which YOU think are IGNORED. The point of telling you everything we do is to just assure you of the fact that none of the issues are ignored, though yeah, this construction is not a non-issue to us, as it clearly is to you.

Syed Ali Raza | 14 years ago | Reply Oo you sensitive souls oF KGS, stop defending! Its a blog only, and to some extent a normal opinion, about you. I hold your tradition of KGS society responsible for it. Seriously, get out of that, KGS is a great institution and produced some of the very best, but there are better places too :). Maybe I am wrong, but my brother is a Grammarian, so i know :) I believe we have a few politicians from KGS.. Can someone name them pls :)

BegumNawazish | 14 years ago | Reply "they protested against the construction of a United States consulate near the campus it was understandable – who would want to live or study next to a structure that represents ‘enemy number one'. -Seriously?? You think that's the reason. Don't joke with yourself man. They don't care about the possible terrorist attacks they hate america: enemy number one? And a lot of people are commenting that the protesters called KGS buildings a national treasure and had sings saying " save the national treasure". Please, if you can look closely in the picture above, one of the placard to the right says, " save our children. Save our national treasure." Its the school theyre calling a treasure, not the building. Kids aged 3-11, regardless of what school they go to, are our future leaders, our treasures.

Murtaza Ali Jafri | 14 years ago | Reply Doesn't say much about the tribune if it's most commented and viewed blog is about KGS parents protesting the construction of a building. jealousy much? What I'd like to know, is why non-grammarians display such an inferiority complex to Grammarians. It's not that we think we're better, it's non-grammarians that do. If you don't want a high rise built next to the likes of so-called 'lesser' schools like Lyceum, American School, Nixor etc, then please feel free to protest it. Just because Grammarians have the good sense to organize and protest something in a fairly democratic way, and others haven't means that they either didn't care enough or they themselves had something to gain from it. The day Grammar started construction property prices went through the roof. That why they went through the 'inconveniences'.

A Student of KGS | 14 years ago | Reply @Shaheryar Popalzai: Dude we agree on that, but our article is high on bias, subjectivity and has hurt the feelings of students, as well as parents. Such articles may help people remeber your name, but aren't good for the image of Express Tribune. Your facts were invalid and you changed the title of your article from 'flats' to 'building' so please, dont say you didn't say it was residential. Thankyou. A hurt student from KGS.

Saad Hirani | 14 years ago | Reply @Sajjad Ahmed: Has your school/institution collected anything for floods? if yes, how much. KGS has collected over 1000,000 rupees worth cash, and many more donations in form of clothes etc. Why dont you pretend standing on the 22nd floor of that building and watch our bake sale for charity on tuesday? Does your school/institution donate over 1000 packets of blood every year? Does your institution send children between 14 and 17 to teach the poor three days a week after school. At the same time, while fulfilling our responsibilities at HOME, we represent Pakistan abroad in GYLC's and debating competitions every year. Trust me when i say this is just a share of what we do. The truth is the legacy will and always be carried on by KGS, so dont even bother questioning on that again.

Shaheryar Popalzai | 14 years ago | Reply

Right then, I actually had no plan to reply to any of the comments since the post is quite self-explanatory, but alot of people have gotten too personal with their responses. I only have a couple of points to state:

All of you thinking this is a report/article, it is NEITHER of the two. If you want reports or articles on the situation, The Express Tribune has given it plenty of coverage. Someone has already posted the links above.
Everyone who keeps mentioning rich kids, money, big cars, the post in no way uses any of the terms. I use the term elitist, that too in the last paragraph, defining a particular mindset. You may choose to interpret it as you wish.
This post questions the fact that traffic problems and health/environmental hazards already exist on the entire strip and how a complex would change things.
My post does not say the complex is next to the senior campus, it says there is an existing health hazard next to it. Please stop commenting with how I got the distance or the campuses wrong.
Nowhere in my post did I mention APARTMENT or RESIDENTIAL COMPLEX, it was a high rise building from the start. The title was picked (not by me) when the piece was put up and changed when the flaw noted.
Nowhere have I questioned anyones morals, ethics or the fee structure at Karachi Grammar School. Nor have I said no one can afford it. Those are conclusions commentors have drawn themselves.
I also did not question the fact if Grammarians do any charity work, it has nothing to do with the post, nor is it my place to question what former or existing Grammarians do with their time.

Please try re-reading the post. Attacking me with points like ‘you couldn’t afford it’, ‘you were rejected by Gammar’, ‎’you’re a lousy journalist’ and whatever you can muster up have nothing to do with the post.

A thank you to all those who put up logical points as a counter to my post.

.. .. | 14 years ago | Reply @Ahmer: dude just drop the language lessons.

Sajjad Ahmed | 14 years ago | Reply Where is the output of KGS at the moment ???? all abroad ?? any use ?? The condition of our education system right now is that of a 'jhompri' with a penthouse on top. No access to basic education for the common man with universities demanding that more and more funds be put for them! Any logical explanation ?? Where did the concept of basic necessary primary education go ??

unknown | 14 years ago | Reply Guys i think it's very sad seing us, the educated fighting where we should all be united. In times like these, this is really what reminds me of my mom's words, 'parha likha jaahil.' Wether or not we agree, there is literally no more point argueing, its only increasing our hatred for each other. Do you want that? If you do, then keep commenting like monkeys fighting over bananas.

.. | 14 years ago | Reply @anonomouus: its anonymous you idiot

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply @adeel "There are many people who dont send their kids to KGS coz of the “kharaab mohaal” not coz they “cant afford” They also reject KGS coz they get into even better institutions (yes… there exist better ones…open your eyes)… I am one such person. Rejected KGS and extremely proud of my decision." Er by your own admission you did not in fact attend KGS. Then did you experience this so called "Kharaab Mohaal"? Or is this just what you've heard? Hearsay can be a dangerous thing. Just look at all these conspiracy theories regarding the "foreign hand".

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply @Ahmer And are you aware that this BLOG POST is being published as part of etribune? Moreover, the definition of blog post you're implying also seems to include a lack of credible facts. Personal opinions are of course the entire point of blog posts, but not without a convincing argument of why the author feels the way he/she does.

@adeel ahmed | 14 years ago | Reply you rejected it, your loss. There is no 'kharaab mohol' there are only mindless fools like you who can't afford to study there and use that as an excuse. If your perverted and polluted mind leads you to such activities as you think happen in kgs, you could indulge in them anywhere else as well. if better institutions exist, good for them. too bad they can't beat us at anything.

Ali Zain | 14 years ago | Reply Dear Mr. Poplalzai, lets get some ground truths cleared up: 1. It is not an apartment complex, it is a commercial building (incase you don't know what that is, it means that it has offices). The plot in question has been turned into a commercial plot from a residential plot which is wrong not only next to our school but anywhere else as well. Just because the owner bribed the governor in question and hoped to make a quick buck doesn't make it morally or lawfully legal. 2. We took the initiative to protest against the decision because unlike others, we have A LITTLE hope in the system so recognize the error made by them. If others don't raise their voices against injustice doesn't mean we shouldn't raise ours either. 3. There were armed policemen because Grammar school had obtained an NOC (No Objection Certificate) to hold a peaceful protest. Once that certificate is approved (free of cost from the area TIB BRANCH OFFICE), the police is bound to give the afore-mentioned security. The reason the illiterate protesters against electricity don't get police protection is maybe because they don't bother getting an NOC, having a peaceful protest or thinking logically. They burn tires, resort to violence and destroy public property, because of which they get 'lathi charges' whereas they deserve to be imprisoned and fined. There were private guards present because those attending worked hard enough to be able to afford them. They had licensed guns incase you're wondering that they were breaking another law. 4. You are carelessly describing the College Section whereas the building is being built near the Junior Section (YES THERE ARE TWO DIFFERENT CAMPUSES ON THE SAME ROAD). Both are a good 300metres away from each other. Also, the wall to cover the nallah was made by the school, from its own money, not the government. AND, the reason we use the service lane is because it has been assigned by the area-police as a cordon off zone for outsiders as a security measure. The drivers sit in the cars whereas the aaya's and the maids get the children from the gate, thus making abandoned cars an impossible allegation. No more than 2 lanes out of 5 (FIVE) are used for the 'moving parking'. Also, the road is mostly deserted and it causes inconvenience to no one. 5. The protest was attended by so many residents of the area as well. They don't want a high rise in front of their homes so that random men can peek into their households and invade their privacy. EVERYONE EXCEPT PEOPLE LIKE YOU HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE BUILDING. 6. KGS isn't that expensive. Its cheaper than most schools that provide a similar, if not lower, standard of education. People from all walks of life study here and the system is fair to all. The elite send their children here because of the quality of education, not the name. Being a Grammarian is a matter of pride because we have established ourselves as the best at what we do, and nothing you say or do can change that Mr. Popalzai. The fact that I'm not using abusive language against you shows how we've been brought up and taught values, unlike you, who seems to criticize everything and everyone better than you. 7. Now we come down to more pressing issues. You claim that Boat Basin is jammed. Need I remind you that the food street is the only attraction over there that directly faces the school (the Hobnob end)? IT ENDS BEFORE THE SCHOOLS ENTRY TO ITS SERVICE LANE STARTS THEREFORE NULLIFYING YOUR ARGUMENT AND SHOWING HOW BLIND SOME PEOPLE CAN BE. 8. If we are high on our horses, we pay for those horses. Not our fault you aren't as well off as us. Work harder, you'll eventually reach there as well, no need to get jealous. 9. The policemen standby to make sure someone doesn't bomb the school, not so that somebody can't offend the 'wrong people'. We have our private guards for that thank you very much. If someone has a problem against us, they shouldn't be lying about us, they should earnestly write us a letter and voice their concerns. I don't ever remember telling someone to shut up and sit down just because I have a bigger car or more money. 10. The article over all is baseless and full of untrue, not-researched allegations that you can't ever prove or support. Post this to show your freedom of speech dude. Cheers!

khayam | 14 years ago | Reply me heard a kgs kid once say: "im not an OG im a PURE GRAMARIAN" LMAO!!!!! WTF do these burgers think they are???? it kinda reminded me of harry potter :D pure g. my ass.... i can think of another word for the g in PURE G. :D :D

Adeel Ahmed | 14 years ago | Reply @anonymous 2: LOL... pompous arrogant little tit. There are many people who dont send their kids to KGS coz of the "kharaab mohaal" not coz they "cant afford" They also reject KGS coz they get into even better institutions (yes... there exist better ones...open your eyes)... I am one such person. Rejected KGS and extremely proud of my decision.

Zeekaye | 14 years ago | Reply Now this is extreme. I mean c'mon what r u protesting against! I cross the middle section everyday if the parents r so concerned about the health of their children then why don't they make an attempt to remove the huge kachra kundi at the back of the middle section.

anonymous 2 | 14 years ago | Reply you couldnt afford to study there!

anonymous | 14 years ago | Reply your just jealous

Abeer Khan | 14 years ago | Reply @Syed Nadir El-Edroos: "If you get into such institutions, that’s a function of the type of education you are lucky enough to receive and the financial stature of your parents." Completely agree with that point. People who are studying in foreign universities often forget that they are among the few lucky ones who got a shot at those universities, only because their parents were able to send them to good schools, colleges - and, not to forget tuition, which are expensive and getting more so by the day - hence making them worthy enough for those universities in the first place.

Abeer Khan | 14 years ago | Reply Hahaha! Nice one. It's time someone put a stop to the snob squad, although - I should add, to stay unbiased - that the school is able to churn out some decent minds as well who just don't focus on petty issues.

Aliza | 14 years ago | Reply Okay now this is annoying. Firstly, this writer is obviously unaware of the true situation and simply wants to let out his anger since he got rejected from the school where really hard working people are generally accepted. Elite, not really! People are accepted on the basis of merit. So if ou spent your life thinking 'not studying' is cool and got a whole load of Bs then tough luck einstien! And this school produces the best, most focused and hard working individuals, the country, or the world has ever seen! Most of the best doctors, bankers, ngos, teachers are old grammarian and when they get back to some of those ''best institutions'' (many on scholarships that the school works hard to get them esp by making them worthy enough) they serve this country. So guess what, it IS a ''national treasure''! Moreover, its not a block of flats, its a pointless commercial building! AND kgs contributed to tonnes of aid for the flood victims and is still doing so! This institute raises responsible, conscientious, patriotic, focused, hard working, bright individuals that this country is in dire need of, plus its been here since 1847, hence very important! And the nullah is located next to the college section einstien, u apparently did not do ur research well! and the biulding is going to be built next to the junior school, kids from grade 1 to 6th go there, very young and potential targets! And when someone wants to harm this country they will do it by harming its youth that can actually make this country improve and you're actually supporting/helping them! well done popalzai! bravo! if u cant do anything good try supporting others who atleast try instead of opposing them!

hassan | 14 years ago | Reply Mr. Popalzai seems much misinformed about the issue he has highlighted. Term " elitists" used for parents and students of grammar school is an absurd assumption. True that grammar school is located next to a naalah. But then having the 22 storey commercial project next door is an entirely different issue- i dont get the p[oint he tries to make by bringing in this "nullah". It is true to a certain extent that alot of "elitists" do, and have in the past, attended grammar school. But it is equally true that Grammar School boasts of an overwhelming majority of students hailng from middle class background. To clarify the misunderstanding that kgs is like a conveyor belt or whatever for memberships of sindh clubs, every person at kgs is given an equal opportunity. If a normal person so called " non elite" doesnot get a place at grammar school it is because of far more competitive people in the waiting line. Similarly the elitists at the school get kicked out if the fail to perform upto the expected levels of academics and behavior

Ahmer | 14 years ago | Reply Clearly Mr Bilal is not aware of the difference between a BLOG POST and an ARTICLE. Every comment he's made says 'article article' and has attacked the writer as a JOURNALIST. Please look up the difference between a BLOG POST and a NEWS PIECE. Too bad your 'respectable institution' didn't teach you enough to differentiate. If you're looking for positive NEWS PIECES on your 'respectable institution' please read the following links: http://tribune.com.pk/story/55415/kgs-parents-ex-students-meet-to-fight-22-storey-project/ http://tribune.com.pk/story/56909/kgs-parents-plan-protest/ http://tribune.com.pk/story/61767/dont-be-mean-go-green/ http://tribune.com.pk/story/62727/sepa-says-khayaban-e-saadi-should-be-made-residential-again/ http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/the-newspaper/local/demo-held-against-proposed-highrise-near-kgs-300 And if you're looking for a positive BLOG POST that doesn't hurt your feelings, you can read this one: http://blog.dawn.com/2010/10/13/half-life-at-the-karachi-grammar-school/

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @everyone: People grow out of it. The whole argument here isn't the fact that the protest was wrong or not , it is against the author's personal feelings coming out in a news piece. Who is he to build up stereotypes against respectable institutions like ours? And just ONE more thing. WHOEVER IS TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC HERE, HAVE YOU EVER PASSED BY LYCEUM, PAF CHAPTER, SOUTHSHORE, DHA AT THE TIMES THEY GET OFF? HAVE YOU EVER? ARE YOU GOING TO CLOSE DOWN ALL THOSE SCHOOLS? People have LOST their minds in bitterness. Seriously!

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @jahanzeb sohail: Man I'm not assuming anything. I'm sure you're one of the high achievers and are even going to go, or are going to the best universities, but saying that is utterly nonsensical. How can you say that when clearly the article is BIASED?

lammy | 14 years ago | Reply @momina: an elitist school for me would be British overseas school or international school of karachi.. yes. Just because they are SO exclusive that no one ever hears about them, does not mean KGS should get all the fire. and @ Zainab Imam 5 hours ago Excuse me, did I miss something? Did the high-rise builders at any point say that they are not going to have parking space inside the building or is that just an assumption? well. name me ONE high rise building in Karachi that have sufficient parking?

lammy | 14 years ago | Reply Well, you complain against the traffic jam and pollution and everything that KGS causes to this road. Do you really think this construction will help it? seriously? Half of you are probably just bitter. We know we cause alot of issues to our surrounding, so does the Forum, Park Towers, and everything else. They are not state owned (obviously) so THEY also represent the rich and elite investors right, So why do you even go there? oh wait, you hate KGS because you can't get in. Face it, whether you like it or not, KGS is still one of the top schools in Karachi. It was made very clear that KGS is protesting NOT for a class struggle. It is obvious that a 22 storey high rise building WILL cause alot of security issues for the Junior and Kindergarten Section, where very young kids, as young as 4, are studying. and they are unfortunately more susceptible to kidnappers. also, FYI, KGS does contribute to the society. The Karachi Relief Trust, which is helping flood victims is run by Old Grammarians who are now doctors etc. Benazir was a student of A level as well. Ad the Saddar campus? Do you think our students ENJOY being in the trafic jam? the worst jams happen at around 6-7PM, and let it be clear Grammarians do not normally go to school at that hour. and the national treasure they were referring to is not the school itself-stop being so shallow, they mean that the CHILDREN is the future, hence national treasure. The writer of this article and the commenters dont even have enough information. look at the correction-this is clearly a way to attract attention. So hypocritical the lot of you, when they complain and protest, you say it is a class struggle of the elite. when they don't, you say they do not contribute to that society, they have the money and the power yet they do not do anything. Furthermore, it is not fair to blame everything on KGS even though you yourself know nothing, it is easy to sit and point fingers. Despite multiple and serious security threats that the school had to face, KGS had only been able to build the wall next to the 'naala' last year. Why? the 'naala' is not school property. The government did not allow the school to touch it. KGS had made alot of complaints about the naala, but no one seems to hear them. there used to be a temporary wall there, where random men could climb up and ogle at the female students inside. is THAT fair? SO if you don't know anything, don't ac like you know everything. and @ Ali, Grammarians certainly do more charity than you do. It is KGS's fault none of you got into KGS and KNOW what you all are talking about.

KGS student | 14 years ago | Reply The author has a valid point, but his argument seems to have quite a personal bias towards KGS.

hassan | 14 years ago | Reply @Syed Nadir El-Edroos: wait wait wait....elitists? kgs inaccessible? you must be kidding me!!! its true that you will find much of the elite class at kgs, but let me tell you that you will find a higher number of students from middle income background. Coming down to the "inaccessible" thing kgs has a consistent high reputation which we can trace back as far as 1847. This is my first year as a student here(alevels) and if the number of seats are few compared to the number of applicants, it is obvious that only the best will be selected. if you still think that kgs is "inaccessible" to outsiders then it would be equally as inaccessible to the students in grammar from the start. Even these "elitists" can get kicked out if they dont perform upto the mark expected at school.

S. Saleem | 14 years ago | Reply @Shahjahan Bhutto: I am sorry, anytime I hear words implying common sense, empathy, good will, fairness, honesty, justice etc. from a Bhutto, I have make sure my wallet is still in my pocket and I look behind my back.

Ozair Sarwar | 14 years ago | Reply Also you consider KGS elite based on the crowd that attends which you define is selective. It is selective but if you think money is the only denominator then you must have never heard of the admittance requirements which demand a good academic record from every applicant including the necessary 7 A O-level grades for admittance into the school's A-Level program.

Ozair Sarwar | 14 years ago | Reply Alright I'll concede the point about the motor traffic because KGS does block up the traffic on the nearby road and creates problem for those traveling in the Boat Basin Area. As well as the point about pollution. But most of you are whaling against KGS without having full information on the issue in the first place. The construction of flats is not being protested its the construction of a commercial centre/building. Those same types of buildings that are under more threat by terrorist violence due to the amount of human traffic that it experiences. During security threats who do family members and friends warn you not to visit Park Towers and other commercial areas. Because they are potential targets. So I don't know what you people are complaining about considering the fact that this was a peaceful protest by parents regarding the security of their children studying in the nearby school not a show of elitism as you people call it. As for the police being there they were contacted prior to prevent the protest form getting out of hand. There's no law against protesting and in this case the police stood by not because the KGS crowd is elite or superior but because the protest didn't involve violence, or window smashing or car smashing and the other multitude of harmful activities that do occur during a protest regarding bijli or water. I'm sorry to say this but the opinion that kids from only rich families attend KGS is nothing but false. There are a lot of kids from well of families but the majority is from middle class. You consider KGS students as elitist. Thus you are implying arrogance and a sense of superiority. That in of itself is an arrogant assumption. Why because they have higher incomes. So far there was nothing wrong with their attitude in protesting for what is justified. By extension the 'elitism' is also being applied to KGS students. How many of you know KGS students really well other than through conjecture. In O-levels and A-Levels over hundred of those students are students from other schools. "If you get into such institutions, that’s a function of the type of education you are lucky enough to receive and the financial stature of your parents. Institutions such as KGS, Aitchenson etc, monopolise scare resources and more importantly access to opportunity. Its not an achievement then that they get into top universities around the world, it would be surprising if they didn’t." Thats what you said Nadir isn't it. Financial resources!! Opportunity!! Monopoly!! Are you kidding me!! Do you have any idea how hard it is to get into those institutions? The level of excellence they require? You think that KGS families are money banks? 90% of KGS students applying to these places apply for admittance with aid because there too expensive. Out of those (0% around 35% apply for full aid. Do you have any idea how difficult it is to get into these good universities when you're applying with aid. You lose your competitive edge compared to the other applicants and even then aid priority is given to Americans and respective nationals compared to international applicants. Even if the issue of aid is removed, what you think we just send in an application and waltz right in. These places are some of the most respected in the world and they have high criterias and requirements. Your statements make it seem like you just talked about this issue without any prior knowledge! And just so you know anyone can apply to these colleges and universities. The restriction isn't only to KGS and Lyceum and all the other schools which would be wrongly grouped together in what I'm guessing what would be the 'elitist block'. Any student from any school can apply but there's no surety that they will be admitted and that holds true for all students including KGS ones. I know this and can say it safely because I'm in my final year in KGS currently dealing with university applications. I'm from a family of three brothers including myself and a single mom and i can safely say that our financial situation is similar to a lot of those in KGS. And as for where charity is concerned you people automatically assume that the only reason KGS crowds do charity is for is because of their conscience or what in crude and crass language seems to me the implication of 'looking good.' How can you forward such conjecture without actually knowing the students and the parents and instead just stereotyping them. As a student i know how much my peers do, how much friends do and how much I've done. I'm not turning this into a competition all I'm saying is what we do, we do because we want to contribute and make a difference and that includes the parents as well. Right now I'm thoroughly surprised. Initially i was interested in this article when it caught my eye but not only did I find the article biased and missing a lot of relevant information with one or two valid points what really led me to writing this was the comments of my fellow citizens. Surprising shocking and disappointed doesn't begin to describe it because truthfully me and my peers really don't consider ourselves different from the rest of you.

Mudassar | 14 years ago | Reply @Syed Nadir El-Edroos: totally agreed!

faiza kapadia | 14 years ago | Reply i completely agree with Faisal and Naziha...Also the writer appears to be confused about the issue at hand and hence has thrown in lots of issues together. Mr.Popalzai should stay focused on the issue at hand and if he didnt protest that was his choice but those who did was theirs...

Alizeh Bashir | 14 years ago | Reply as for the rest of you, get your noses out of your economics books and dont be hating on us with explanations of how we're monopolizing scarce resources...and yes it is indeed "access to opportunity" because you give the damn test or you did well in your o levels and you'll get in if you're smart enough..dont criticize because you've been trying ever since you can remember and haven't managed it..perhaps its too decent a place for the haters and it is not an expensive school. check the fee structures and then make your comments. there is a need for educated people in this country. you may wish to at least attempt to be one of the few. yes every other kid matters. at their schools their parents can protest. at ours, ours will. yes some of us stay on abroad after our studies, because we developed the qualities at kgs to be able to diversify our talents as well as ive ina nd contribute to different environments..hardly the definition of an elitist...and living abroad isn't easy, because no one's washing your toilets and there's no family to look after you when you're unwell..its the strife, the determination towards pushing your limits, setting high standards, and living through the thrill of achieveing them its one thing a group of parents wanted to protest against..they do not have the responsibility of taking over all of pakistan's problems..

JusticeForAll | 14 years ago | Reply Instead of either camp getting defensive, we should try to collectively work for the betterment of society as a whole. Being an ex-Grammarian, parent of a KGS student and a resident of the area, the issue isn't simply about a building coming up next to the School but the way in which our entire city is being commercialized. There are zoning laws in most civilized countries that prohibit high-rises coming up next to hospitals and schools etc. This issue may have been brought to the fore by and because of the KGS administration and parents but it affects a multitude of people (for many who are not aware, a significant number of the participants in the protest comprised of residents of Clifton, Blocks 5 and 7 who were also present at the hearing before the EIA). Its not simply related to environmental issues but changing the landscape of residential areas of the city and the consequent impact on infrastructure, which is non-existent to begin with. As for KGS being elitist; perhaps there is an element of elitism, but that's not restricted to KGS or Pakistan. In every country in the world there are Etons and Harrows and Philips Academies etc. Today's deterioration of values is across the board and not restricted to any particular school. In our time at KGS, the beauty was that no one knew what the other's parents did and no one cared i.e. friendships were not built around cars, houses and wealth. Even today, most of the KGS students' families are middle class and the school administration makes the special effort to ensure this. However, KGS continually gets bad press for the wrong reasons. Undoubtedly, the KGS crowd (by collectively remaining silent on issues which dont impact them) have contributed to the situation in the country as much as anyone else, but to single them out is unfair. Where one does agree with Mr. Popalzai is the fact that the KGS crowd wields sufficient clout to have the US Embassy moved and is likely to ultimately succeed on this issue as well. However, instead of only mobilizing themselves when it affects them (ala the lawyers movement being focussed on restoration of Judges as against fixing their own Court system), they should work on other issues affecting society as a whole i.e. right from electricity to extremism to corruption to poverty to governance. It is towards this end that we should all work but invariably the two biggest issues in our country rear their ugly heads i.e. who will lead (egos) and what is the banner? With the KGS issue, call it selfish, self preservationist or for a good cause, people assembled and made a difference, even if it was a cause affecting KGS. Ultimately people should realize that this country is perpetually placed on the precipice of disasters and we need to come out of the "exit strategy" or "waiting for the Messiah" modes and take collective action and responsibility, otherwise buzz-words such as civil society and civic sense, will remain just that.

Alizeh Bashir | 14 years ago | Reply KGS is home to children from just about every class background. it's here where we find true friends, not for our money, or for the number or size of our cars, but for the people we are.being a "new g" myself, i could NOT agree for a second that there is any alienation..i was welcomed and i spent some of the best years of my life, with real people. traffic jams occur at just about EVERY school in the city. should mothers NOT be picking up their four year olds? would you leave your kid to wander out on the street looking for his driver?its a school for christ's sake, shall we shut it down to avoid a total of one hour's traffic? sure, traffic regulation may be imposed but don't aimlessly comment where you have nothing to support your argument..and NO ONE has opposed that kind of regulation, in fact im sure if it were present, we'd all appreciate it. yes some of us have drivers, but if you are a student at the karachi grammar school, your experience would not have been translated through such a negative approach. the "nullah" too is a part of our identity..its an aspiration for every athlete to lead their team OUT of their nullah, and its something each of our houses has faced. it gives us strength and determination to try harder the next year..its something that becomes the theme of our jokes..and its what brings us together. to say the least, you live in pakistan...the nullah should be the least of your concerns..its a third world country, dont be expecting too much luxury, particularly when it is the "elitists" with whom you are so discontented..and the saddar campus is undeniably beautiful. deal with it. the building of the consulate was not opposed because it was to be the building of "enemy number one"..the united states is NOT enemy number one by any standards, at least not those of the kind of parents that produce the kind of kids that attend kgs..its the idiots that threaten to bomb the consulate who would have also posed as a threat to the grammarians..surely saving our lives is reason enough to oppose that construction. if the parents are protesting against one thing, take it in isolation. you dont need to clog up issues and draw comparisons. the issues in themselves are clearly very different. stop adding to the rubbish that people have to say against the grammar school and the children that form it. have some respect and hold some pride, or you cant be worthy enough for the institution.

Urooj | 14 years ago | Reply I agree with "humanflux". I'm a grammarian and I'm only part of the upper middle class. Many Pakistani's feel they have a right to critisise us. Yes, many of us are pretty well off but that does not mean people can get away with saying that we have a mindset that we are inferior than others. The issue was raised for reasons that may not have been important but in the right way. The protests were not violent. they were preaceful demonstrations and therefore there was no lathi charge imposed on them. The protest was a fair way to show what grammarians felt and being in a democratic state I think we all need to learn to live with that. PS. Grammar School's fee is less than that of other private schools. So for all those who said that schools such as ours should be shut down because people cant afford it, there are other schools that are far more expensive.

F A Mehboob | 14 years ago | Reply The issue is the commercialisation of that area and the ensuing effects of pollution and traffic madness - this is a microcosm of what is wrong with UNPLANNED URBANISATION. Looking at the bigger picture, Karachi has no electricity or water - what high rises do is place huge demands on utility and infrastructure on a per unit area basis. Karachi can ill afford highrises as madness will simply turn into mayhem (if it hasnt already). How does the author feel about the residents who purchased property and built their homes in that locality BECAUSE it was a RESIDENTIAL area - are they vultures who scavenged off the poor and built large homes in a posh area and now deserve their just desserts by having the main thoroughfares on either sides COMMERCIALISED - I think NOT! How do you feel about the said road being COMMERCIALISED ILLEGALLY? How do you feel about the letter the SUPERINTENDENT OF POLICE wrote to all the schools less than 12 months ago advising them of SECURITY RISKS TO ALL SCHOOLS? How would you feel living in a HOUSE WHICH WAS IN PERPETUAL SHADOW? SADLY THE AUTHOR HAS WRITTEN AN ATTENTION GRABBING BIASED PIECE. PERHAPS THE PARENTS OF KGS ARE DRIVEN BY THEIR OWN SELFISH MOTIVES IE THEIR CHILDRENS SAFETY - WHATS WRONG WITH THAT?????? THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO EXPRESS THEMSELVES!!!! As far as KGS parents go, the only thing I'd like to highlight that the author is pointed out is that THERE ARE A LOT OF OTHER THINGS WORTH CORRECTING and PROTESTING ABOUT...SO BE MORE SENSITIVE TO THE OVERALL ISSUES THAT AFFECT OTHERS AND HELP PROTEST ABOUT THOSE AS WELL...YOU CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE!!!

jahanzeb sohail | 14 years ago | Reply @bilal zaidi not envious. i'm just making an observations from the sort of replies. This article seriously seems to be hurting some part of every grammarians (and by grammarian i mean the self titled elite of our society) ego. why would i have anything against them? or be envious of them. your ASSUMING that i'm not one of those high achievers :)

Zainab Imam | 14 years ago | Reply Excuse me, did I miss something? Did the high-rise builders at any point say that they are not going to have parking space inside the building or is that just an assumption? Also, if this is about the city not having the infrastructure to support the high-rise in question...well, this city has been badly planned since the past 60 years, where were the concerned KGS parents then? Naziha, good attempt at trying to show them as caring citizens but just because they have donated time and money to the flood disaster (which, of course, IS commendable) does not show that...what about the traffic nuisance and air pollution they create every single day? Law-abiding and caring, are we? Then please, could you first clear that up?

momina | 14 years ago | Reply Well said Faisal Kapadia, firsly, the proposed buiding is not flats,but a 20 story office block, and the increase in traffic congestion this entails can seriously compromise the safety of the students, some of whom are as little as 3 years old... with the law and order situation in our city constantly worsening such a busy area could be a potential attraction for suicide bombers as well(as we just witnessed at a.s.g mazar) secondly, the staff and faculty at kgs ensure that the school related traffic is organized and moderated so as to minimize its nuisance to the surrounding neighbourhood, with parents themselves voluteering to become traffic wardens, and thirdly, those who claim that kgs is an elitist organization need to get their facts straight...kgs has students and faculty from all walks of life and all sorts of professional and ethnic backgrounds, an elitist school for me would be British overseas school or international school of karachi..

Yousuf | 14 years ago | Reply "7/10 Pakistanis who study abroad in the best universities such as Harvard, Standford or Oxford are people from KGS." Lol? Where is this information coming from? Thats the most biased and ignorant comment ive seen in a long time.

Adnan Qureshi | 14 years ago | Reply @osama athar: you mean 'not many'. Dont you wish you went to Grammar?

talha | 14 years ago | Reply To be honest i agree to a certain extent with the article. I currently study at KGS and the issue at hand is really of no importance to the student body. I firmly believe that the school itself causes enough traffic is not one to speak out against pollution. However to imply that the Parents and alumni are "elitist" is absurd Karachi Grammar School has made countless donations to flood relief and various other charities. Aside from that many old grammarians have gone to the flood affected regions and are personally involved in the rehabilitation. A well written article but a tad to judgmental. The minute i read it only two words came to mind "Bitter Non-grammarian".

parvez | 14 years ago | Reply There are two issues here which are being interwoven but should be kept separate. 1. The proposed tall building next to a small children's school - not a good idea. Some form of accommodation or compromise is needed from both sides. 3. KGS and it position in Karachi as a premier educational institute and using this article to vent ones feelings on this point - not a good idea.

S | 14 years ago | Reply Sour grapes

perpectives | 14 years ago | Reply Don't jaaalus. Your article is not only invalid, it is also pointless...and worst of all, ill-informed. By aiming only at KGS, you've ignored problems that are common to all schools. Just because everyone's facing them doesn't mean that they stop being problems, or that nobody should protest against them.

Saadullah Awan | 14 years ago | Reply @Mustafa Hanif: no those who go abroad to stanford, harvard etc, do you ever see them contributing to our society in any positive way? they usually settle abroad with jobs in multinational companies forgetting about their culture and people.

Ibrahim S. Habib | 14 years ago | Reply @Mustafa Hanif: yes, and 7/7 of those people settle abroad after getting their degree, without contributing anything to this country. national treasure, indeed.

anonymous | 14 years ago | Reply This is well said. I must say that the administration of Karachi Grammar School is just cold. Not that I do not like this school, personally I'm one of the biggest fans of KGS but my point is why can't they see the development and advancements this country will make. Clifton is the new city center, after Saddar and yes we are lacking high rises. More employment opportunities and investment opportunities is what we really need for this country to flourish. If we just suppress everyone because we have the power and money doesn't mean you say 'NO' to right projects. Besides that, I don't understand what is the harm? Our school says that it's besides the junior section, so what? If we, Grammarians think we belong to the elite and have money and power then why can't we just use that to protect ourselves rather than preventing the construction. And to be honest here. Not many. Or I think non of you know this but there is more to this building than just environmental and security issues. If you can recall there was a similiar situation a few years ago and it was resolved by someone who studied in the school, who's father works for the government. I think it was the school's responsibility to respect that student and his parents but they didn't. That is the real story behind this.

Zee | 14 years ago | Reply Jealous much? If we dont have money to help the flood, why are we wasting it on making another high rise building...saddar campus is more then 160 years old you are forgetting that at that time there was no pollution, or security threats....Saddar is the heart of Karachi and (if you had researched properly), they often have to shut the school because of riots, Pollution is a BIG problem there, and we fear passing through saddar whether its at school time or after, do we really want that in clifton as well. Also if you think Mothers are already causing a rush imagine after the building has come up. Im not saying your entirely wrong, but the junior section has children aged 3 to 11 Security is a big concern. Also the building will not magically come up it will take years of construction. i.e noise pollution, dust pollution, air pollution...That and the nAlla?? Also think about it, if your 5 year old kid was in a school, any school...and a high rise building were coming up (In todays time) where the school had already received multiple bomb threats, wouldn't you get off your well-fed horse and protest. And dont you have anything else to write aboutfloods, corruption and the rising cost of living then judging people??

bilal zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @jahanzeb sohail: 'Hit the Grammarians right where it hurts?' Seriously are you THAT envious of better achievers than you that you want to HURT Grammarians now? This should give other people who want to comment an idea that they're ideally stupid if they think this article is well written. Its more like a cheap onesided point-of-view, whereas journalism means to give all aspects of an issue.

jahanzeb sohail | 14 years ago | Reply Awesome piece of work! no offence to a lot of the people commenting but it seems like Shaheryar hit the grammarians right where it hurts with this article.

Faisal Kapadia | 14 years ago | Reply Hahahaha the article title just changed from flats to a big building? Hind sight eh??? Write a piece then get hammered then add nuance..pretty much says it all!

farhat kapadia | 14 years ago | Reply Im truly amazed. Your approach is rather shallow. The protest is against commercialization and not limited to parents who are concerned that their kids "cant study next to a big building." Its your perception that all parents are "seated too high on well fed horses". - get a reality check done.If other schools havnt complained thats their own decision and if residents had issues they had the right to complain and protest. The KGS parents are excercising their right to speak out - get your facts in order

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply Is it just me or did the title of this article change from ...flats to ...a big building?

your mom | 14 years ago | Reply disgusting.You are the same people who would kill to send your children to KGS.Just because your kids didnot get in doesnot mean you have to hate KGS.

Ali Dharamsey | 14 years ago | Reply Get your facts right. The campus in question is the junior school, which has over 800 students aged between 3 and 11 years of age. What you are speaking about are the other two campuses. If you write an article, at least know what you are talking about. The protest was to save these children, who do not have any naala's or traffic jams. Secondly, saying that the "Grammarians" are too high and mighty to study next to flats is wrong. As you may or may not know, the campus in Saddar is located next to low rise flats, which are residential. The building that is being proposed is a high-rise commercial building, which should not be allowed to develop as it is a residential area. Also, it is necessary to realize that as this is a foreign run school, holding international respect, it is a target for terrorist activities. This is not to say it is the only school, or even the one in most danger, but just saying that it is in fact a security threat to have a commercial building next to a school, be it this school or any other. If other schools have not protested about such things, it was their choice. Karachi Grammar School will not stand for such things.

Sara Ali | 14 years ago | Reply @deen. even though i am an ex grammarian now, i will always defend my school against those who bad mouth it for no apparent reason. and i think a student who is part of any school will defend his/her own school. i dont think we think we're 'God’s gift to Pakistan and possibly mankind' (you yourself are generalizing there btw), i think any student studying in any school who gives something, no matter how small, back to its country is Gods gift to Pakistan. you're the one who's creating this difference between grammarians and students of other schools by saying comparing them in such a way. I dont even believe all grammarians are perfect or close to perfect or whatever. i think there are both good and bad people in grammar. just like in any other school. Grammar is known as ONE of the best schools. there are others too. and all of them have EARNED a reputation for a reason. i fail to understand why we deserve so much hate just because our schools have a reputation. or should i say school cuz it seems the only one being attacked is grammar.

Salman Latif | 14 years ago | Reply Excellent write-up!! You hit the nail right on spot.

bilal zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @Deen: Dude, that over protection of the name comes with the article. We do not portray ourselves as anything, we're who we are. This is an article by a JOURNALIST and The Tribune is a paper, not a controversial blog. Shaheryar here has used his occupation wrongly to give out the hate for the school. Do you realize they let him print this article JUST to see this feedback? The guy clearly is out to get the school just because he dislikes it personally. The meaning of Journalism is to give news, not be a CRITIC! Come on. Even I agree that protesting was a little stupid given the current city conditions, but using that as an excuse to let your hate out for the school is plain wrong. I mean 2-3 people here even went as far as stating that KGS requires you to have 7 As on one transcript to apply for A Levels. I don't understand what is wrong with that, or how that makes the school for the elite. A school for the SMART more like. So don't go out of your way to just plainly oppose what everyone has to say without thinking!

Sara Ali | 14 years ago | Reply exactly Faisal. also, so pro grammarians are generalizing every critic for hating against the school out of jealousy or whatever (which isnt even what most of us are saying but okay) but every critic of the school is not generalizing every student and its family? they have the right to label grammarians as 'elitists' and 'snobs'? what valid reason DO you have to be so anti-grammar? the fact they protested or because they cause traffic jams?

Faisal Kapadia | 14 years ago | Reply @just someone else I do not live in clifton or defense..so stop making assumptions since you are sounding like the author of this piece, in fact let me clue you in further. I as a part of this society and as a Pakistani have a right to protest against anything I deem fit in a non violent manner. I can protest against the sidewalk being paint black and yellow instead of white and red if I wish to and am allowed by law so on what wisdom do you base your statement? The fact of the matter is that this protest had people of the neighborhood as well as kgs parents, who exactly is ok with a high rise next to their house pray tell me? Oh by the way the plan may be to build 21 stories but if the permission is granted for 21 30 usually emerge. Forget kgs for a min and check the shehri website you will all find just what kind of hazards plazas like this pose in the case of an emergency like an earthquake a fire etc, they are usually a hazard onto themselves let alone the neighborhood around them. We can use this chance to poke a finger back at an institution just because we hate it, or we can realize that the parents of children who study their are just exercising their rights and in a peaceful manner and let the courts decide the outcome of this issue. Either way we should not have to "justify" our protest to anyone because one persons savior in these times is another's terrorist meaning the issue is subjective, its that simple. Do also remember an elitist usually does not stand outside on a road waving banners, concerned parents do..

anonomouus | 14 years ago | Reply create another section for noor mian is crazy

anonomouus | 14 years ago | Reply Yo! i am a grammarina at the moment... you know what i think.. i think that you are completly right in saying this... may be my school...kgs....wants to take over that place soon and

bilal zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply @maheen usmani: they arent flats my dear friend, its a commercial building prone to security threats!

Ameena | 14 years ago | Reply Oh this just made my day! Very well written!

Uzair Madhani | 14 years ago | Reply The writer of this article really needs to get his act together. Putting a high-rise building in a resedential area is simply stupid. Im from KGS, and I there are terrible traffic jams after school anyway. A commercial bulding will make it worse. And apart from grammar parents, there were also nearly 80 peopple from from the Block 7 community. So it's not only KGS that is opposing the commercialisation of khayaban e saadi.

Sara Ali | 14 years ago | Reply infact, my question shouldn't have been 'how does that make just grammar bad' it should have been how does that make grammar, or any school, bad? wherever there are schools, universities, colleges and even offices, there is traffic. people don't, or atleast most people don't, get angry at the schools for that because they would be stupid to. i mean, what can you do about traffic? close down the schools? think about that before you start saying things like "the whole nuisance KGS creates for afternoon traffic in the boat basin area" and "Its like the parents who come to pick up their children think they can do anything and park anywhere they want since THEIR child studies in KGS. Let them see how the common man feels when everyone turns a blind eye to his VALID protests." Because if, by ‘valid protests’, you mean protests against traffic jams outside schools then I’m sorry the protest is not valid.

.. | 14 years ago | Reply The people in the flats next to the saddar campus used to throw things into middle school during break when all the children would be outside. A man actually jumped into the bathroom and almost molested a girl. These apartments are being built on the side where kindergarten is ie. where there will be 3 yr olds running around. Parents are just concerned about their kids; it's not elitist its practical. Also, KGS does a LOT for "worthy causes" and the children who graduate and go abroad continue to do so as well so STOP HATING.

Farooq | 14 years ago | Reply Excellent rebuttals by Naziha and Faisal. This article reeks of a personal vendetta against the institution. The parents/students/alumni are well within their rights to carry out a nonviolent protest for a cause that seems very legitimate indeed. A commercial building next to a school can only lead to traffic and security problems (amongst others). And I know for a fact that while KGS alumni may be privileged, they do more than their fair share when it comes to giving back to society.

Sara Ali | 14 years ago | Reply i dont know too much about the exact reasons for the protest. but i just want to say that its okay if you think the issue wasnt worth the trouble. and if you want to write about that, sure go ahead. but atleast dont use this issue as an excuse to take out all your personal hate for the school. 'These people are either just ignorant or seated too high on their well-fed horses to look around (or down for that matter). Seriously guys, I don’t see any schools complaining about high rises, and they’re not even located next to a ditch filled with half of Clifton’s trash. Let’s be fair shall we? I’m sure none of the residents who had to bear with the school when it opened took out a rally complaining about the noise every morning' and the writer also says KGS saddar section is located next to high rises and no one complained about those. well, EXACTLY. if these people were just too 'ignorant' or 'seated too high on their well-fed horses' or even just plain stupid they would protest about that and every single other problem too wouldnt they. but the fact that they didnt do anything about that or even that they havent done this for the naala shows that they have sense and that there probably is some issue about this building thats worth complaining about. and as for the traffic jam. its funny how the writer and many people who have commented say it like theres only ever traffic jams in front of KGS. people, theres St.Michaels like literally 5 mins from KGS and there are traffic jams there too. there are traffic jams outside EVERY school. how does that make just grammar bad? even more ridiculous are people using phrases such as 'parents of KGS brats' and 'its time these snobby people get a slap on their face.' yes there are snobby people and brats in Grammar. but there are snobby people and brats in EVERY school. clearly people who can say things like this are very biased in their views and i dont think they're very concerned with the issue at hand, i think they have a strong bias against the school anyway and are just taking it out here.

Alina | 14 years ago | Reply I agree with you to an extent, but I don't like your 'holier than thou' attitude that you have in your article. You have an angry attitude and sound as if you think you are above all of this. Just because you have come to the realization that there is inequality in Pakistan doesn't mean that you are excluded from it. Yes, most of us don't enjoy the social divide and writing with a strong opinion is likely to help improve the situation but I just think that It's wrong that you seem to exclude yourself.

Faizan | 14 years ago | Reply Every time I want to read about a non issue being given too much attention I meander over to the express tribune blogs. I am never dissapointed.

indoctidiscantisourmotto | 14 years ago | Reply haters gonna hate

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply And as hard as a person tries to break that 'elitist' image, people just refuse to see that Karachi Grammar School is one of the lowest fee private A Level schools. The tuition for Nixor, Lyceum and Southshore all exceed those of Grammar.

Bilal Zaidi | 14 years ago | Reply Dear whoeverwrotethis, For your information, this high-rise building isn't intended as a residential building. It is intended to be a MALL, or so people were told. SO AT LEAST GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT. As for studying against a Naala, 90% of the rural schools in Pakistan are in an area with health risks, at least they're still schools. Otherwise, I'm sorry, but posting an article just because it is controversial or strengthens the bitterness in people's heart is utter crap. For the record, the only people subjected to a 'lathi' charge are the ones who engage in violent protests such as burning flags, statues, pictures, tires etc.

Long Live KGS | 14 years ago | Reply The problem is not just high rise buildings! It is the fact that they plan to turn the entire area into a commercial area. The reason people feel more comfortable having their children in the Clifton Campuses is because in Saddar they are surrounded by the danger of these commercial set ups. Instead of hating on Karachi Grammar School and hiding behind your computer screen telling us what we are doing wrong, you need to get a life and stand up for something you truly believe in. At least the parents and students of Karachi Grammar School stand up to make a difference when it comes to a matter they are concerned about. They have been the victims of many threats from various groups who feel that they are 'too westernized' or 'elitist' and have every right to protect their children if they feel that making that area commercial will pose such a threat.

Maheen Abbas | 14 years ago | Reply hahaha im an ex grammarian too, and its funny how far they really are taking this whole issue! i mean look at the saddar campus its surrounded by buildings, so many juloos' pass by that campus and primarily its located in saddar, nothing's ever happened there, so why is the clifton one any different? the parents really do need to take relax a bit, the building is just providing residence for people, i highly doubt its gonna be an 'environmental' threat!

unknown | 14 years ago | Reply Does anyone posting such comments even know that the protest was against not only the commercialisation of block 5 clifton,but the surrounding areas too, and only half the crowd was grammarian PARENTS, 80% of whom were non-grammarian students. The residents of Block 5 took part in the protest too.

unknown | 14 years ago | Reply @Faisal Kapadia: i completely agree with your point of view. its like double hypocracy how they abuse kgs and it's stance for morality, and then end up forming admission lines. Take ONE side.

unknown | 14 years ago | Reply @Shumail: adding to your LIMITED knowledge, kgs is fighting a separate case demanding better parking plans and more security around saddar. As for other schools, the private schools association is supposed to act, not KGS.

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply @Fatima: Well said. @Mirza: Thank you for validating my argument (if it managed to make it past the moderation stage).

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply Wow. The commentators on this article seem to have gotten the entire issue worse than the author. Would you deny the right of anyone to protest about anything as long as they do it in a non violent fashion. Probably not. Was the KGS crowd not within their rights to protest. Mind you "their rights" not about whether their protest was about something ridiculous or not. Was treatment of the protesters by the police different from other non violent protesters? Yes. Is that not then the real issue? Groups should be allowed to protest in a non violent manner about whatever they choose- the purpose behind their protest is not for me or you to decide. In that respect the treatment accorded to Grammarian protesters was different from the baton charges meted out to other protesters residing lower on the socioeconomic scale. Instead of speaking up for the rights of such people all that the textual diarrhea littering the comments section of this blog has done is to hate on the Grammarians for something they would be within their rights to do so in a free society. Once again this is not about what they were actually protesting about- just their right to do so. But turning to the subject matter of the protest it is laughable the way people are pointing fingers at grammarians regarding the "inherent hypocrisy" of their protest and not caring about the rest of the country, its schools etc. To be honest I found their entire protest strategy laughable as well but calling it "hypocritical", "reeking of elitism"? Really? Pause and think for a second, just a second, what YOU have done today regarding the situation in YOUR country. What protests YOU have carried out against the condition of other schools. If you are counting on this "elite" bunch to make changes in YOUR country, then you have already accepted elitism as the eternal status quo. I think I'm quite done now. The country's burning, can't afford to waste any time can I?

Adil | 14 years ago | Reply Well well well...this article has surely given an opportunity to all those who couldn't make it to KGS to shoot their venom and jealousy against the institution. Badly struck by the inferiority complex. All i can say to u all is to get a life! And Mr. Omar Quraishi! Hello Sir !! Great to come across you after a long long time :) Hope you're doing well :)

Mirza Abeer | 14 years ago | Reply God, the traffic jams on that road are such a damn pain!! Its like the parents who come to pick up their children think they can do anything and park anywhere they want since THEIR child studies in KGS. I say let the damn building be built! Its about time these snobby people get a slap on their face. Let them see how the common man feels when everyone turns a blind eye to his VALID protests.

Shumail | 14 years ago | Reply HELLO, what are all these pro KGS commenters on about?! Shaheryar's points are all valid: If you are complaining about a building next to the junior school and making it an environmental issue, why are you not protesting about the environmental issues surrounding the other schools? or the security issues with the Saddar campus!?!? Laughable. To those who are crying about the commercialisation of the area, did you perhaps miss the fact that the whole damn city is expanding in every direction and commercialisation is a reality in every neighbourhood - good luck to your protest but it REEKS of hypocrisy which is correctly outlined in the last lines of this article.

Fatima | 14 years ago | Reply Dear Mr. Popalzai, You seem to have misplaced the concept of responsible journalism. Your article has some very valid points which are worth further exploration but you negate them by misrepresenting the nature of the protest. The Tribune's own report on it that you have linked to says clearly that the building is a commercial 20 storey building and that it was not just KGS affiliates but also residents of the area who participated in the protest. Moreover, the vitriolic comments that you pass against the institution that have little to do with the matter at hand and it seems more like a case of the sour grapes rather than a well-reasoned and thought out article.

D | 14 years ago | Reply WHO wrote this? =S

faria.syed | 14 years ago | Reply

Schools are where we send kids to learn, to grow and to be come over all better people. No one in their right mind would defend the commercializing of a residential area at the expense of students.

But the fact is if we must fight the good fight - for poor, students studying under unbearable circumstances - why can't they ever be someone elses?

Of course KGS parents have a right to protest. If we had zoning laws than they wouldn't have to - they could simply register a complaint.

I would not want my kids to play soccer in the shadow of a highrise office buidling and I would fight to make sure that their play ground has a view of the sky.

Just because Grammar parents aren't very 'nice' doesn't mean they are wrong.

Sb | 14 years ago | Reply Great peice Shaheryar! I particularly loved the caption!

Kamila | 14 years ago | Reply i don't think flats here means actual apartments - its more like the idea that KGS kids don't want to study next to a building that looks like it doesnt belong in their posh area

just someone else | 14 years ago | Reply Apparently the KGS brigade haven't quite grasped what the author meant by his article. He clearly outlined that students at other, less privileged schools have more serious issues to go through, but their demands are not met. however, just because the high-rise may be a security concern to rich kids (and if they call themselves middle class then they should check up on what being a middle class Pakistani actually entails), their is a protest out on the streets. @Mr.Faisal Kapadia living in Pakistan is a security risk, that is if you venture outside the pristine and unnecessarily well-guarded boundaries of Defence/Clifton. so quite frankly, you have no grounds to protest the building of a high rise, more of which are needed in KHI. i hope they build a 220 storey building next to KGS. and i don't know who considers that water-mark of elitism a national treasure, but if for one, am totally up for bulldozing it over and building a new mini-mall. or KGS museum. maybe then it would be something really historical

Salman Arshad | 14 years ago | Reply I think there is something illegal about the building as well.. Just that the elite don't mind the illegality, which is probably normal for them to ignore it, but are really annoyed at the inconvenience the project is going to cause them.

Deem sheikh | 14 years ago | Reply Good God, what a ridiculous comment FYI there are tons and tons of high rises through out the city around peoples homes schools park In tons more congested and logistically challenged areas of Karachi Yet you only see a small segment of the elite class living on the other side of Clifton bridge Other even affluent areas are a mix of commercial and residential Real estate development in this part of Karachi was inevitable

lubna lakhani | 14 years ago | Reply Oh God the person who wrote this article should have atleast bother to do her research first....these are not 'flats' but rather a high rise, for offices. This building will be the tip of the ice berg as there are 30 other such buildings being planned in this corridor of Clifton.. major rules and regulations have been broken to commercialize this very residential plot. Wake up ppl its not abt KGS its abt our city and its fast and furious deterioration do something abt it now, help KGS, dont be vindictive think the bigger pic, think 30 high rises in this part of the city which is not equipped to handle such a load.

Ghausia | 14 years ago | Reply lol at all the comments. I have to agree with people here though, there's a huge traffic jam in front of all schools and even universities, mine is one example. But yes, protesting against a high rise building is ridiculous. And it is unfair that people protesting for genuine, important things get lathi charged because they're not 'the right sort' like the parents of KGS brats.

BOY | 14 years ago | Reply This article has its own faults. What the author has conveniently failed to mention is that the building is going to be a 22 story COMMERCIAL one!! It's to be located beside Junior school. As you know, such conspicuous buildings and landmarks are ideal for terrorist attacks. Hence, the protest stands just and right. The author should get their facts straightened before writing such an article.

nida | 14 years ago | Reply well written!!

D'oh | 14 years ago | Reply Nice article. Simply stupid protest by the students of KGS (or whoever orchestrated this). I have nothing against the profile of the students that study there, and in fact respect the quality of education the school imparts. But come on, this is just ridiculous. If KGS really wants to bring students (that some people may consider are among the brightest / privileged in the country) out on the street, do it for a worthy cause. I would have supported a protest to clean up the nullah next to the school even if the administration wakes up to this cause decades too late. But judging by the recent protest, I expect them to declare a "No-Fly Zone" above their premises next. Sure, if some apartments threaten these students (and no other students in this huge country), then what about them drones! Or the failing fleet of Airblue! oh NO!

tahira | 14 years ago | Reply LOVE IT!!!

Wasif | 14 years ago | Reply Why my comments still under moderation. Does this not shows yellow journalism

Ali | 14 years ago | Reply The author is just jealous he did not get to go to Karachi Grammar School :P It's not our fault if your school alumni is not strong or proactive enough to fight for something what you believe is your right. @the person who said that Grammarians do enough charity. Please. There is a difference in doing something to clear your conciounce and doing something to actually make a difference. If the alumni and parents of Grammar School are strong enough to not let the US embassy get built next to it, they can certainly do a lot more than run a few charity campaigns and arrange fund raisers. (read: parties for rich folk)

Deen | 14 years ago | Reply I strongly agree with the comments of Nadir El Edroos, that the sentiments and concerns of societies elite in the major urban centres of Pakistan are given priority, coverage and importance. Being a Grammarian alumni I was invited to be a part of this procession, my common sense did not buy the idea that the protest was against a commercial high rise in a prime real estate part of Karachi. If you ask me, all these parents care about is the difficulty they will now experience in finding a parking spot when they come to drop their children off. These parents should take a moment to think about infact the congestion nuisance that Karachi Grammar School causes to motorists and pedestrians in the Clifton/Boat Basin Area during the hour the School gets off. Only just this week, I got stuck in a very discomforting traffic jam at Boat Basin at 130 PM because of the school. Cars are Triple Parked on the Main Road, how is normal traffic to get through ?

Pseudo | 14 years ago | Reply This is a fascinating newspaper - covers all the ridiculous/useless stuff. Barely can one find something insightful. Next time, someone should blog about those who have the time to write crap blogs and comment and fight on crap blogs. Infact, we can have a name for it- 'crogs'.

Syed Nadir El-Edroos | 14 years ago | Reply I am sure no one disagrees with parents for protesting for the betterment of the enviornment of their childrens school. That is their constituional right, more power to them. The problem however is in their potrayal of the school as a national treasure and Gods gift to humanity. There were mass protests in the Punjab as the government announced to "privitise" several colleges and raise fees, parents and studetns protested, where was the coverage or the conern? Instead, they got some severe warnings of expulsion from the adminsitration and for good measures, some spent the night in the local thanna to make sure they accept the reality of increased fees. This is a clear example of one world for the haves, and another world for the have nots. Will the building or has the nallah effected the education or results of the students, the rate of admissions to foreign universities? No ofcourse not. Has this detered people from sending there children to KGS, no! The reality is that for the vast majority of families across the country a mere 5% raise in fees leads to parents pulling their children out of school. Sorry for not shedding a tear for the poor souls at KGS or any of the overpriced schools and universities across the country for that matter.

Asad Rehman | 14 years ago | Reply Dont expect this to be published( being a Pakistani newspapers site) but the protest was against unsolicited under the table deal done by the builder (Noman in this case) with CDGK with regards to building a 22 storey office building in a residential area with a 7 floor car park. I guess the biased author of this piece of trash did not even bother reading up the reasons for the protest.

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply Could a moderator please explain why my comment is still under moderation? Thanks.

Faisal Kapadia | 14 years ago | Reply Elitist or not as parents whose wards go to KGS, we are entitled to our right to protest about whatever we feel is wrong. This protest and its association by the author to elitism and other problems in our country are just snide tries to drag a legitimate issue through unnecessary muck. If anyone else feels wronged about their children studying next to a high rise why don't they protest about it as well? I pass by many schools on the way to drop my child to KGS at 7am every single one of them causes traffic inconveniences just like at KGS so why target this institution? I am neither a KGS alumni nor have a chip on my shoulder because of that fact, perhaps the writer should next time check the situation, fee structure and admission demands of some other schools before picking on KGS....I can understand the dislike ppl have for this institution but somehow when admission time comes around the line of applicants just gets longer every year. Guess that's because people like their kids studying next to the "rubbish heap" eh?

Road Runner | 14 years ago | Reply Popal boy great Job KGS is a disaster for motorist and perhaps for society too. Same goes for SZABIST who has caused much traffic nuisance in same area. One feels this country is only for the elitist who can make or break rules at will.

Waqqas Iftikhar | 14 years ago | Reply also a kgs alumni....(alright i was only there for my a-levels)....but man that protest was funny, particularly the 'dont be mean, be green' poster. The nullah by the way was officially called Nehr-e-khayyam (thanks to Mr. Omar Quraishi, our econ teacher there for that gem). Do think Popalzai has stirred a hornet's nest though, some humourless individuals might get on his case...

Obaid | 14 years ago | Reply Sorry *Sheharyar !!

Obaid | 14 years ago | Reply Maheen.. As I said.. you have simply nailed them down !! This article has to be one of the best you have written.. ! Great work !! Keep it up !

Syed Nadir El-Edroos | 14 years ago | Reply @Mahvesh: I am sure they make a contribution, all I said was that whatever contribution they do make is a result of having a clear advantage over other students. to claim that it should deserve some special treatment because their contribution is somehow more valuable in this day and age is outrageous. Its reinforcing a rigid class system and nothing else

maheen usmani | 14 years ago | Reply I may be in the minority amongst my friends in Karachi, but I have to say that I agree with your logic here, Shaheryar. You are 100% right about the traffic jams and nullah in Clifton. Why is being located next to flats becoming such a major issue for KGS anyway?

humanflux | 14 years ago | Reply Gosh darn it, another etribune blog post completely skewed in one direction. Ever driven by City School PAF in the afternoon, or lyceum, or FPS? Lets close down all the schools shall we? That should probably take care of all the traffic issues troubling the author and all the other commentators. What could have been an okay article talking about the differences in police response to protests by grammarians compared to other protests (HINT: maybe one of them wasn't violent ) completely went off on a tangent."It also reeks of the elitist mindset that is so rampant in our country. The one that screams ‘We are always right – you shut up and sit down."- You came to this conclusion from a simple non violent protest? You know what does reek of an elitist mindset? Your comment about how you were "inconvenienced" because of the protest. Any sort of change will always require patience no? And as an ex grammarian yes that nulla is and is was disgusting, but environmental hazards and health hazards are not one and the same thing. And you're completely off the mark about no other schools protesting against buildings in their vicinity. Let me give you another HINT: CJM (a few years ago) and I'm sure there are many more. And what's all this nonsense about protecting KGS because it is a national treasure. Did any of the protesters make that claim? If so, link please. Or are all of you just making that assumption? And as for a lot of grammarians coming from rich families, that maybe true but I also knew a lot of grammarians whose families were strictly middle class. Just because a place is frequented by mostly rich people doesn't make it elitist. It's an attitude. And no where did you demonstrate this to be true for KGS (maybe you're going by general opinion? And if so, what use is a journalist who references articles using the "public opinion")

hasan | 14 years ago | Reply aamina.....i'm with you on this one. what is happening out there? parents, get a life.

Ovais Tariq | 14 years ago | Reply Agree hundred percent with your post, there is no point in protesting

rahim | 14 years ago | Reply haha like

Lord Elrond | 14 years ago | Reply like

Roronoa Zoro | 14 years ago | Reply haha nicely done.

Asif Ahmed | 14 years ago | Reply Mr Popalzai's article seems like a case of sour grapes. He needs to reread the first sentence of his own article and practice what he preaches. Asif Ahmed

Wasif | 14 years ago | Reply A really nice article and truth as well. really liked the check word attached to pollution.. ha ha @ Naziha, first of all if someone is giving charity then it is for his own self and for landing into better part of the heaven after death rather boasting his or her self around that poor flood victims being helped out. As far as being "elite" is concerned so correct your self first that KGS cant be elitist, since its is a verb that can be attached to persons/individuals and not to non-living things. This type of self centered approach is also a form of corruption with in your inner self. For sake of God there are things that should be thought at macro levels rather then focusing on individual levels.

Shahjahan Bhutto | 14 years ago | Reply I wish we could buy, sell, purchase, give, award and/or force common sense up on people. These parents need to get their hands on some... Urgently! Like yesterday. Also, Naziha needs some as well

Deen | 14 years ago | Reply I am an KGS Alumni, and I thought this protest was ridiculous. I was personally invited the Old Grammarian Society, but they had failed to fully mention in their email invitation what the protest was aiming towards. They merely mentioned that they are protesting some construction activity close to the junior school. The way I see it, their reason for protesting might be the loss of parking space around the school which they use in the adjacent lanes. And yes I very strongly agree with Shehryar on the whole nuisance KGS creates for afternoon traffic in the boat basin area. When I was a grammarian I did not realise the nuisance we created for motorists in the area, I passed by KGS in the afternoon at the time when school ended (115-130) for the first time this week since I was in A Levels, that is when I realised, what a Nuisance Indeed for Motorists we were, cause this time I was the motorist who got caught in a Jam due to school time traffic.

Yasser | 14 years ago | Reply ahaan. That's what we call a good, nah not good but great post. You highlighted the issue very well

Ammar hasan | 14 years ago | Reply nice one mate.

Mahvesh | 14 years ago | Reply Nadir, that's a bit unfair - KGS might not be a 'national treasure' but most students who're studying anywhere, regardless of the institution, can be recognized as such. How do you know students from the KGS aren't going to contribute to the country as much as someone from a public school?

Babar Javed | 14 years ago | Reply Like

Rabia | 14 years ago | Reply @Mustafa Hanif: Dear Hanif being an ex grammarian and also a grad of one of the 'best' foreign universities myself, I would like to ask how is many Grammarians studying in elitist universities abroad a contribution of KGS to Pakistan!

Maryam | 14 years ago | Reply totally agreed...!!! well written... protest on this subject is funny....people have so much ample time on their hands i suppose...

Omar R Quraishi | 14 years ago | Reply @Naziha Syed Ali: Dear Naziha, Kindly contact me at omarrquraishi@gmail.com Thank you

Umair Kazi | 14 years ago | Reply You took the thoughts right out of my mind, thief.

Tippu | 14 years ago | Reply Hahahhahahaa A security risk? How so? Should all flats in karachi be flattened or just the ones which happen to infringe on the exclusiveness of these KGS imbiciles?? And environmental hazard?? Is this the worst environmental hazard in karachi? Arnt there any others that may deserve their attention just a little bit more? These morons never cease to amaze me. I dont think they've bothered to think this one through in their own head before deciding a protest is called for!!

Sj | 14 years ago | Reply You CANNOT compare this protest to those that are organized against electricity shortages and high food prices. Good for them for actually conducting a peaceful protest against the building of high rises around the school (which many consider a historic building in karachi.) This protest is not against the system, and even if it was, every citizen has a right to voice their grievances as part of a democracy. Whether the reasons for this protest are justified or not is a completely different story. I for one am completely against the gentrification of a historic city like Karachi. The eradication of historic buildings and formation of ugly high rises around them destroys the visual landscape of the city. The Karachi Grammar School stands for much more than just a school. Its buildings are the embodiment of the history of this country, its ideals revolve around, bravery, valor, unity and most importantly a student body that is all inclusive (regardless of social standing.) If one may think of this as elitist grammarian ideology, so be it.

just someone else | 14 years ago | Reply @Naziha. the whole debate is not about KGS being an elitist institution(which it is). the issue here is that while most of school children have to study next to buildings just as high, the KGS parade can't stand that some shooter might sneak up and take a shot at their kids. don't our kids matter? and anyway as for your second point, yes there should be no such institutions in the country if they are out of reach of the common man. the competitive edge given to students from here makes sure that they don't have any competition at all qualifying at daddy's business, while students from elsewhere spend half their lives working their way up the ladder. and for those who think that KGS "produces" good students, please keep in mind that they require 7A*, and that too on one marksheet, so it's no wonder they top the academic charts.

Zainab Imam | 14 years ago | Reply This is what I call putting things in their proper perspective. Well done Shaheryar!

shayan | 14 years ago | Reply Everyone is equal, but some are more equal than others, right? Haha

Naziha Syed Ali | 14 years ago | Reply I know plenty of people with children studying in KGS who have donated generously to the flood relief effort, both in terms of time and money. They are also active in supporting educational ngos such as The Citizens Foundation as well as other causes. It's unfair to suggest that they are callous, self-absorbed individuals just because they can afford to send their children to a private school. Granted, KGS is elitist in the sense that only a tiny sliver of society can afford to go there, but would you rather that there be no high quality educational institutions at all in this country? Should everyone go to a government school and obtain a mediocre education because most people cannot afford to do otherwise? The solution is to improve the standard of education for the average Pakistani, not malign institutions that are already offering quality education. Given that he's working for an English language newspaper, I'm sure that Mr. Popalzai too has also received his education at an "elitist" institution. But perhaps not at KGS. I'm just hazarding a guess. Another point worth mentioning is that parents do have valid concerns regarding both security and environment if the construction of the high-rise goes ahead. It has nothing to do with studying next to flats, nor the nullah (which incidentally is located next to the senior section, not the junior section which is some distance further down the road and is the one affected by the proposed high-rise). The high-rises next to the Saddar section were constructed way before schools in this country came under threat. Also, if traffic in the vicinity of the school is so disrupted in the afternoons when classes are over (a situation which, contrary to Mr Popalzai's implication, is no better elsewhere in the city where schools are located), can you imagine what it would be like with parking for a multi-storey commercial building creating more chaos? As for the indifference shown by our "elite" to protests over more important issues, that is an affliction common to most people in this society, not just those who have the means to send their children to expensive private schools. Incidentally this school, because it is not privately owned per se and is instead administered by a board, has lower fees than some of the other private institutions in this country. Moreover, its student body is considerably more diverse in terms of income level than other such places, a fact that would surprise those who are quick to sneer at KGS' supposedly rarefied atmosphere. There is however, one point that I do concur with. The policemen standing by would not be such placid spectators if it were a demonstration by electricity- or water-starved people in other less well-heeled localities. And that is indeed patently unjust. Every one of us has the right to demonstrate against whatever issue affects us directly, without fear of state reprisal.

Syed Nadir El-Edroos | 14 years ago | Reply @Mustafa - getting into harvard, stanford or oxford is not an achievement in itself that benefits the country. If you get into such institutions, that's a function of the type of education you are lucky enough to receive and the financial stature of your parents. Institutions such as KGS, Aitchenson etc, monopolise scare resources and more importantly access to opportunity. Its not an achievement then that they get into top universities around the world, it would be surprising if they didn't.

Ahmed | 14 years ago | Reply Fully agreed ! If elders are going for these kind of tactics then what their children would be learning ? It is the height of materialism !

Aamyre Tarique | 14 years ago | Reply haha when was it? And BTW I share your sentiments Sherry :D

Mustafa Hanif | 14 years ago | Reply I agree with the article and the the comment of the person above me - until the final few lines. KGS does contribute to the society, 7/10 Pakistanis who study abroad in the best universities such as Harvard, Standford or Oxford are people from KGS.

S. Ali Raza | 14 years ago | Reply If it was a "Burger" joint or a shopping mall opening up next doors, they really wouldn't have a problem I guess.. ;) LIKE IT!!

osama athar | 14 years ago | Reply not much KGS fans would like the post. :D

Aamina | 14 years ago | Reply Hahaha being an ex grammarian, even I think that's taking it a bit too far. Well written, I agree with you!

Syed Nadir El-Edroos | 14 years ago | Reply KGS is a national treasure? So this inaccessible elitist institution is what we should be proud off? Insane! At least we know that Karachi's elite is not shy off coming out on the streets if the issue at hand really touches their hearts. Perhaps spare a thought for the millions of unfortunate souls of the country who dont even have access to a playground, for if there is a national treasure that is being destroyed are a ALL the children of this country, not one school whose greatest achievement is perhaps maintaining a conveyor belt of new members to the Sind Club or whatever island of entitlement is in fashion.

Jahanzaib Haque | 14 years ago | Reply

Like.

I’m from KGS and I can’t study next to… a big building?

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