Kasab and after

Published: December 7, 2012

The writer is a consultant and a freelance writer based in New Delhi, where she writes for Business Standard and blogs for The Times of India

The hanging of Ajmal Kasab, the lone surviving gunman from the Mumbai attacks four years ago, brings the curtains down on another agonised chapter in the turbulent history of the India-Pakistan relationship. However, it also shows how far both countries have come considering the tensions that have been a constant feature of our times.

Pakistani politicians and their people have soberly reacted to Ajmal Kasab’s hanging, refusing to rise to the bait of triumphalism that was on ridiculous display in parts of India. The overwhelming reaction has been of inevitability accompanied by a certain inward searching as if to ask, where did we go wrong? When and how did we put guns in the hands of our boys? How long is this fragmentation of Pakistan going to continue? Certainly, it’s much too soon to say that the wind is turning in Pakistan, especially when the sectarian violence in the country seems to take new, ‘creative’ turns every day. But if the spirit of inquiry and questioning that marks the Pakistani media on issues within were to be extended to Indian concerns, we could be turning a new page in the bilateral relationship.

Certainly, there are straws in the wind: Zakiur Rehman Lakhvi, a Mumbai attack mastermind, has been arrested and after pushing his Cabinet to activate the travel agreement with India, President Asif Ali Zardari has recently been calling for intensifying the fight against terrorism and religious fundamentalism. With kilogrammes of explosive material meant for targeting Muharram processions being found all over the country, the question that remains is if anybody’s listening.

From some accounts, Pakistani Army Chief General Ashfaq Kayani is paying heed. Foreign diplomatic sources say that Kayani has begun to realise the impact of this “creeping ideology” and is concerned that it will infect his beloved army and divide up the nation. The question is if he, as well as the people of Pakistan, can come to terms with the fact that those who are challenging the Pakistani state — for example, the Tehreek-i-Taliban Pakistan — have the same roots as those who are challenging the Indian state, for example, the Lashkar-e-Taiba and Hafiz Saeed’s Jamaatud Dawa.

With Kasab out of the way, the Pakistani establishment must move in the direction of investigating Lakhvi and his comrades for their role in the Mumbai attacks. If serious and credible action is taken against them, it makes it much easier for Delhi to return the compliment. From Siachen to trade, India would be ready to break bread on all the issues confronting the relationship.

Kasab’s death was a foregone conclusion but it nevertheless coats the Manmohan Singh government with a veneer of strength, especially if you remember that the three men charged with killing former prime minister Rajiv Gandhi are still alive on death row, even after 21 years. It defangs the right-wing Bharatiya Janata Party, at least, momentarily, and allows the Congress party to display a couple of muscles.

But if the ongoing parliament session is as stormy as the last one and little or no business is transacted once again, both parties will lose face. In the ensuing political chaos, strongmen politicians like Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi will gather steam, as will anarchists like Arvind Kejriwal. Certainly, Modi will use his success in the forthcoming election in Gujarat next month to position himself to move to the centre as a prime ministerial candidate for the 2014 general elections.

In Pakistan, the forthcoming election season won’t be without its moments of anti-India bashing if Imran Khan’s comments that Sarabjit Singh should be hanged are any indication. That kind of demagoguery does no one any good, least of all an educated man like Mr Khan.

Kasab’s hanging is already yesterday’s news but it provides an opportunity for both nations to take a deep breath and ask themselves what they can do next — next year, as well as in the next decade — for both of their peoples.

Published in The Express Tribune, December 8th, 2012.

Reader Comments (50)

  • sattar rind
    Dec 7, 2012 - 11:55PM

    both country may start peace talks for nxt generation and for the region …

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  • All Pakistanis
    Dec 8, 2012 - 12:04AM

    “With Kasab out of the way”

    Now it is time for all the Indian terrorists, of the likes of Sarbjeet Singh, in Pakistani jails to go.

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  • BlackJack
    Dec 8, 2012 - 12:21AM

    I fail to understand the connection between Kasab’s hanging and the practically non-existent investigation into the planning of the Mumbai attacks. As far as I see, there have been four kinds of responses that we see in Pakistani media which probably represents all major opinions:

    Kasab was guilty – good riddance.
    Kasab was guilty, let’s get rid of all terrorists, Sarabjit needs to be next.
    Kasab was an Indian and the whole thing is a charade.
    Kasab was a Pakistani and hence was not given adequate legal representation.

    I have not yet heard any Pakistani acknowledge their country’s reluctance to move further on the investigation into the attacks and its planners, or even mention how the alacrity with which cases like that of Lal Masjid being settled contrasts sharply with the obvious feet-dragging on the Mumbai attacks; in fact, people seem to think that with Kasab gone, India has satisfied the blood lust of its citizens and the issue will soon fade away from public memory – this is not the case. The time for empty talk is past – pithy speeches from Kayani, Zardari and co etc sound good, but they have not reversed the tide. Pakistan continues holding these animals close to its chest while they continue to chew on its entrails.

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  • Adnan khan
    Dec 8, 2012 - 12:52AM

    @ all pakistanis – i am sure with the execution of sarbajit and others pak will become a cradle of peace???? Please introspect and try to understand the pain we have caused to others – although it looks small to what we are doing to ourselves :(

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  • ok
    Dec 8, 2012 - 1:11AM

    Many Pakistanis speak of samjhouta express to counter Mumabi Attack.
    All the criminals involved in samjhouta express attack are in jail.

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  • Shahid Orakzai
    Dec 8, 2012 - 1:42AM

    “From Siachen to trade, India would be ready to break bread on all the issues confronting the relationship.”

    Name a few places where india has given concessions to pakistan in spite of Zardari bending backwards to improve relations.

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  • Lala Gee
    Dec 8, 2012 - 1:45AM

    “In the ensuing political chaos, strongmen politicians like Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi will gather steam, as will anarchists like Arvind Kejriwal. Certainly, Modi will use his success in the forthcoming election in Gujarat next month to position himself to move to the centre as a prime ministerial candidate for the 2014 general elections.”

    One mass murderer is hanged because he was Muslim and the other, Narndra Modi, is being praised because he is Hindu and rewarded by re-electing for his role in killing 2,000 Muslims.

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  • peace
    Dec 8, 2012 - 1:55AM

    Time now to punish “Samjohta Express” culprits.

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  • Lala Gee
    Dec 8, 2012 - 2:22AM

    @BlackJack:

    The day India will punish the masterminds and sponsors behind Mukti Bahini, TTP, BLA, LTTE, TNA, etc, the day those guys you blame will cease to exist, because there would be no further need for their existence. Till then you can keep crying foul, but nothing is going to change.

    P.S.: Even after passage of 28 long years after the massacre of 5,000 Sikhs in 1984 by the Indian Hindu hooligans, the victims of the carnage are still waiting for justice. Also, Muslims of Bombay and Ayodhiya massacres are still waiting for dispensation of justice as well. Lets not talk about the victims of Gujarat massacre and the victims of the humongous atrocities committed by the Indian security forces in Indian Occupied Kashmir. What you think is so special with the Indians that they must be provided instant justice.Recommend

  • gp65
    Dec 8, 2012 - 2:27AM

    @ok: “Many Pakistanis speak of samjhouta express to counter Mumabi Attack.
    All the criminals involved in samjhouta express attack are in jail”

    Not just that, it was an attack by Indians within India. It was not a cross border attack.

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  • sameer
    Dec 8, 2012 - 2:56AM

    gunman? really jyoti ji? what else could he have done to make him a terrorist?

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  • gp65
    Dec 8, 2012 - 5:33AM

    @Shahid Orakzai: “Name a few places where india has given concessions to pakistan in spite of Zardari bending backwards to improve relations.”

    Differentiate between words and actions.
    1 Zardari talked about implementing MFN in trade (still not implemented). The immediate quid pro quo was India waiving its objections to special trade terms by EU for Pakistan – which er WTO rules, India was entitled to oppose. India delivered it last year itself. Pakistan has still not implemented its part of the bargain. Oh and by the way India had given Pakistan MFN status in 1996 itself.
    2. Visa liberalisation is a 2 way process. India was ready to do this in May but Rehman Malik delayed it.
    3. India has all along promised Pakistan ‘No first use’ of its nuclear weapons which Pakistan has not reciprocated.
    4. Pakistanis had died in Samjhauta express train. The planners are sitting in jail. The planners of 26/11 are roaming freely giving hate speeches and encouraging jihad against India.
    5. As an upper riparian country, India would have been well within its rights to keep 50% of river waters and give Pakista 50%. Instead India has agreed to Indus water treaty which gives the smaller rivers to India and larger 3 rivers to Pakistan. Despite this generosity and despite the fact that even during war times India honored the IWT, Pakistan leaders (both civilians and military) falsely accuse India of stealing its waters.

    Please give me one example of what Zardari has done which India has not reciprocated?

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  • gp65
    Dec 8, 2012 - 5:44AM

    @Lala Gee: “One mass murderer is hanged because he was Muslim and the other, Narndra Modi, is being praised because he is Hindu and rewarded by re-electing for his role in killing 2,000 Muslims.”

    You can continue to lie but that will not change facts. The facts are:
    1. The trigger for Gujarat riots was that in Hindu majority India, Muslims burnt 60 Hindu pilgrims alive. Think of what kind of response that would get in Pakistan if the reverse had happened.
    2. 794 Muslims and 250 Hindus died. NOT 2000 Muslims as you claim. This is as per answer given in parliament which is more reliable than random websites spreading lies.
    3. Modi was the chief minister of Gujarat at the time of riots and that is his only connection with the riots. Does anyone consider prosecuting Qaim Ali Shah for all the Karachi target killings because he is chief minister of SInd? What about prosecuting Raisani due to all the Hazara target killings? Their linkage is no more and no less than Modi’s.
    4. Within 2 days of the riots, Modi called the army in and the riots stopped. In 10 yeas since then there have been no communal riots in India. Do you trust any politician in Pakistan could promise that there would be no target killing or terrorism in their state for 10 years starting today?
    5. 33 Hindus have been convicted for the riots including a senior minister so your notion that Hindus escape conviction and Muslims get convicted is simply not true.
    6. Modi’s role has bee viewed under the microscope and so far he has been cquitted in all cases.
    7. In the 2007 elections BJP (the party that Modi leads) won seats even in Muslim majority areas.

    I have provided this information multiple times to you yet you continue to mislead.

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  • gp65
    Dec 8, 2012 - 5:52AM

    @Shahid Orakzai: ““From Siachen to trade, India would be ready to break bread on all the issues confronting the relationship.”
    Name a few places where india has given concessions to pakistan in spite of Zardari bending backwards to improve relations.”

    There is difference between talk and action. Name one action of Zardari that has not been reciprocated by India. You will not be able to find one.

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  • abu-uzhur
    Dec 8, 2012 - 7:02AM

    @Gentlemen :

    Excuse me for expressing thoughts that come to mind on reading some of the comments.

    Patriotism , which robs a man of his capacity to see things objectively , to form

    opinions impartially , and to examine one’s own views critically , is no patriotism .

    It is a sickness of mind .Recommend

  • vasan
    Dec 8, 2012 - 7:10AM

    To all Indian bashers pointing the killing in Gujarat, Bihar, skhs, tamilnadu etc etc. All these are internal matters of India and are well taken care. These cases are more than 10 years old and many judgements against the culprits have been passed and many are languishing in jails as well for the crimes committed by them, If other countries start asking questions and demand investigations about Pak’s own murdering of their own people, about Pak army’s attorcities, missing people in balichistan, evasion of action for bangladesh holocaust etc etc, you will not know where to hang your heads. What the Indians are demanding are actions against the terrorism sponcered by Pak in India. This kind of poking your nose in other countries, whatever pretext it may be, must stop once and for all. And also the double games being played by Pak. Once credible prosecutions and convictions happen in the mumbai mayhem case, you can demand concessions from India and start negotiating. Till then you have your hands full to attend to.

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  • Pakistani
    Dec 8, 2012 - 8:13AM

    @Jyoti Do you enjoy this regular tutu-meme of Indians and Pakistanis on this forum. There is something really ominous about how these two groups fight. I fell there is no place left for humanity in this debate anymore.

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  • wonderer
    Dec 8, 2012 - 8:29AM

    @Shahid Orakzai:

    “….. Name a few places where india has given concessions to pakistan…..”

    Will you Sir, tell us the reasons why Pakistan wants any “concessions”? I cannot see any. India never asks us for any “concessions”.

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  • SK
    Dec 8, 2012 - 10:08AM

    Jyotiji,
    Yesterday Imran Khan denounced media for not verifying with him or leadership of TIP regarding the authenticity of the “statement” on Serbjeet Singh by some TIP “spokesperson”. He denounced the content of the “statement” and claimed he does not know anybody called Naimullah Khan who is supposed to have made the statement on behalf of TIP. This was on live TV interview in India on Aaj Tak Agenda conference. I think Jyotiji you need to retract/apologise for this remark at the end of your piece.
    SK, Mumbai

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  • Lala Gee
    Dec 8, 2012 - 10:36AM

    @gp65:

    “@Lala Gee: You can continue to lie but that will not change facts. The facts are:”

    Here is a brief from the media advisory of December 3, 2012 of the ‘Coalition Against Genocide‘, the reference I provided in my comment. If this does not satisfy you, then click the “Reports” section on their website which will give you a long list of reports published by Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, U. S. Commission on International Religious Freedom, and others exposing in detail the events of the massacre and later cover-ups and denial of justice to the victims of this Indian holocaust. I am sure lying lies on your part, as I have repeatedly provided references from the listed reports.

    “Coalition Against Genocide (CAG – http://coalitionagainstgenocide.org/), a broad alliance dedicated to justice and accountability for the Gujarat pogrom of 2002, will be holding a press a conference at Capitol Hill, Washington DC to announce bipartisan support from members of the US Congress to continue the ban on Gujarat Chief Minister Narendra Modi’s entry to the US.

    Modi was Chief Minister of Gujarat in 2002 when organized sectarian violence resulted in the killing of 2,000 people and the displacement of over 150,000. Modi has also engaged in systematic persecution of religious minorities in Gujarat during the last ten years.

    WHAT: Press Conference to release a letter signed by 25 Congresspersons, urging the State Department to continue the ban on Narendra Modi.”

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  • Hukka
    Dec 8, 2012 - 10:54AM

    To the author .
    How is kasab hanging any different than Sarabjit Singh. Why show soft corner to Indian terrorists? And can we demand hanging of col. Parabhat, mastermind of samjhotya express?

    Please do answer with open mind in your next article

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  • Feroz
    Dec 8, 2012 - 11:20AM

    Pakistan is on very shaky diplomatic grounds after its flip flops first in acknowledging its role in the 26/11 massacre and secondly in convicting the masterminds of this tragedy. It has not only put itself but also the Indian government in a very tight corner. In fact the inaction can be categorized as suicidal because as and when the next Pakistan sponsored terror plot gets executed in India, the ramification are too grim to contemplate. The World may not have the same levels of tolerance as Pakistani citizens towards violence.

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  • F
    Dec 8, 2012 - 11:30AM

    Kasab was hanged for indulging in a grotesque act of terrorism. Glad to see India act fast. All rights were granted to a foreign criminal. But Kasab was a foot soldier. The plotters of Mumbai continue to be hidden by Pakistan for “lack of evidence”. It is the same Pakistanis who denied that OBL was living amongst them in full glare and with full blessings of the military. Pakistan, as a next step, shoud surrender the plotters to India or arrest them permanently. But that is not feasible. Nothing can satisfy Pakistans’s ever growing appetite for “evidence” and its brazen denials.

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  • gp65
    Dec 8, 2012 - 12:57PM

    @Lala Gee: “WHAT: Press Conference to release a letter signed by 25 Congresspersons, urging the State Department to continue the ban on Narendra Modi.””

    Not sure if you realize tha COngress and BJP are political opponents. MEdia statements always have lower credibility than statements given in parliament. At least that is true in India. Secondly, you prove that there are stakeholders in India speaking up for Gujarat negating your earlier post that Kasab was hanged because he was Muslim and Modi escapes justice because he is a Hindu.

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  • muneer
    Dec 8, 2012 - 1:31PM

    67 years and counting and still both nations on the verge of mental regression…..nothing to be proud of.

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  • Khan
    Dec 8, 2012 - 2:24PM

    To the author
    Kindly research before writing, coz IK never said about the sarbajeet

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  • Lala Gee
    Dec 8, 2012 - 4:28PM

    @gp65:

    “Not sure if you realize tha COngress and BJP are political opponents.”

    Apparently you don’t pay attention what others say and then accuse them of lying. These are the US Congresspersons not the Indian Congress people. 27 Congressmen and women have singed the plea, which was released on 4th December 2012 (4 days ago) in the mentioned press conference, to keep the US ban on Narendra Modi to enter the United States for his active role in the genocide of 2,000 Muslims of Gujarat. For more information on the state participation and subsequent massive cover-ups and plain denial of justice to the victims, read this report published by Human Rights Watch, “We Have No Orders To Save You: State Participation and Complicity in Communal Violence in Gujarat”. Here are the “photographic evidences of the brutalities of the Hindu mobs” as documented by the Human Rights Watch, and available on their website.

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  • abhi
    Dec 8, 2012 - 6:52PM

    @Lala Gee

    It gives me a lot of pleasure to see you guys jumping up and down on Narendra Modi and Bal Thackrey. And the icing on cake is you quoting US congressmen’s report. US the most hated country in Pakistan.

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  • Dr.Sinha
    Dec 8, 2012 - 7:13PM

    @Lala Gee:
    Sir, You are right in saying that the signatories of a note to Secretary of State Clinton were U.S. Congressmen and not members of the Indian Congress Party. However, as it turns out, many of these U.S. Congressman have little or no knowledge about Gujarat. Indeed, some of them even have friends and associates who have visited Gujarat to explore business and investment opportunities because that state is the most prosperous in India for which Narendra Modi should be given the credit (even though I do not personally think much of that man). Also, the system in the U.S. is such that all you need is a petition from a few hundred Muslims (the vast majority of them are Pakistanis who have taken upon themselves to “protect” the interests of Muslims of India, although they butchered Bengali Muslims and continue to do so with the Shias, Ahmedis, etc. in their own country) to urge the Congressmen to represent a particular issue with the adminitration.
    Having said that, Human Rights Watch has also condemned, in the severest form, the grave atrocities committed by Pakistan against its religious minorities, particularly Hindus and Christians, whose numbers have dramatically declined. If you think logically, Sir, why would any Pakistani Hindu want to uproot himself and migrate to India? There are stories depicting the Pakistani barbarism and horrors when young Hindu girls are kidnapped, forcibly converted at gunpoint into Islam and — worse still — married off to a much older man (fit to be granddad) or even sold to brothels in Lahore and elsewhere. I wonder how an average Pakistani would react if an innocent Muslim girl was kidnapped and suffered the same inglorious fate as her Hindu counterpart. You don’t throw stones at others when your house is made of fragile glass and is collapsing! By the way, Human Rights Watch, Amnesty International and a host of other organizations condemned in the severest form the appointment of Pakistan at the U.N. Human Rights Council which had to accommodate that country because of an aberration in the procedure system of the world body. Like an American diplomat privately told me, it’s like appointing a butcher to guard a flock of sheep. The butcher is, of course, Pakistan.!
    As far as Narendra Modi’s “atrocities” against the Muslims in Gujarat are concerned, I suspect no amount of reasoning and factual support will change your one-track mind if you are a convinced and dedicated full-time anti-India baiter. You are ripping many facts out of context (you consistently fail to mention that prior to the outbreak of violence against Muslims, a trainload of Hindu pilgrims had been roasted alive by Muslims who had torched the train and some of them even said they would like to eat their “boti kababs” with whiskey!!). It was a tragedy and a sinful loss of human lives (both Hindus and Muslims). Independent court trials, experts and investigators have personally exonerated Modi from any wrong doing, though the real perpetrators, including the masterminds behind the carnage, are cooling their heels in jail. By the same token, Sir, why is a sworn Hindu hater like Hafeez Saeed, known as the mastermind of the Mumbai carnage (this was not only confirmed by the killer Kasab but also by others, including Headley in the USA) and other criminals such as Dawood Ibrahim, who have committed some of the world’s ghastly crimes, given free run in your country? Is it because Pakistan has no law and order system — its judicial system is run by lackeys and supporters of the extremists and religious fundamentalists who are busy converting into a stone-age country? I hope, Sir, you will ponder upon the points raised. You seem to be a good man but you need to be critical of your country’s own malaise and not adhere to your brainwashed thinking instilled in you despite the facts presented.

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  • Javelin
    Dec 8, 2012 - 7:34PM

    @Lala Gee:
    “These are the US Congresspersons not the Indian Congress people. 27 Congressmen and women have singed the plea, which was released on 4th December 2012 (4 days ago) in the mentioned press conference, to keep the US ban on Narendra Modi to enter the United States for his active role in the genocide of 2,000 Muslims of Gujarat”

    I live in the US and I have never heard of this. Please let me know the names of these US Congress men, and I will find out why they were so misguided. Reading your various posts in the Tribune, I can’t beleive you are so radical and anti India. Chill it.

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  • Vikas
    Dec 8, 2012 - 7:53PM

    @peace:
    I think it’s time to punish Pakistan now.

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  • a_writer
    Dec 8, 2012 - 8:29PM

    @Lala Gee:
    I didn’t know Narendra Modi travelled to Pakistan with the help of RAW and killed citizens of Pakistan – must be reading the wrong newspapers

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  • Ahmad Khan
    Dec 8, 2012 - 9:52PM

    @a_writer: Narendra Modi is a Terrorist and a bigger terrorist than S called” kasab”. IS there any Law that If you kill Indian Muslims numbers greater than 2000 then He will become Minister? Or L.K.Advani demolishing Babri masjid? Have you Arrested these two Hindu Terrrists to show the world that How the Justice is done? If, Answer is NO, then You have No right to ask another nation for anything, hear again, Anything. We have’nt included the miscreant Active army duty Hindu terrorist Col. Prohit? When are you handing him over to Pakistan for killing 65 Pakistanis? Make sure you do that so that you be able to ask for anything.

    @Vikas: Common!! Punish Pakistan. Have courage!! Just a Note of caution: You Daddy is leaving Afghanistan!! Keep that in Mind. So start Packing up from there and Be ready to be accounted for 10 years of terrorist activities in Pakistan.

    @Javelin: You heard or not. Entry of Terrorist Modi is still Ban in the USA. period. If you are illitrate then it’s not our responsibility to educate you.

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  • Hemant
    Dec 8, 2012 - 9:53PM

    @BlackJack:
    I agree with you.Lets hang all the Jihadi’s in Pakistan, and all ‘Congress Netas’ In India,
    Let us teach this White skin & the whole world that We can Burn Gold in this great land we
    unnecessarily fight with each other.Religion has not solved the problem;

    Maybe colour of our skin and good family values can be our assets.

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  • Pan Mat
    Dec 8, 2012 - 10:28PM

    @Lala Gee:

    WHAT: Press Conference to release a letter signed by 25 Congresspersons, urging the State Department to continue the ban on Narendra Modi.”

    US Congress has also urged Pakistan to dismantle support for terrorist on numerous occasions, you choose to ignore or deny these assertions. Why this selective respect for US Congress?

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  • gp65
    Dec 9, 2012 - 12:06AM

    @Lala Gee: “hese are the US Congresspersons not the Indian Congress people. 27 Congressmen and women have singed the plea, which was released on 4th December 2012 (4 days ago) in the mentioned press conference, to keep the US ban on Narendra Modi to enter the United States”

    Speed reading error. My bad. The US COngressmen need not worry about denying visa to Modi in 2012. Modi has made it clear that after the first time he was denied visa in 2005, he will not apply for it again. And US COngressmen have even less credibility than Congress (I) on this issue. First on the numbers – if Indian parliament says 790 and US COngress says 2000 Muslims were killed, Indian parliament is correct. Secondly, if Narendra Modi is personally accountable for deaths in riots in his state because he is CM – riots that were brought under control in 2 days by Modi calling the army – then they should be even more concerned with indicting Bush for the people who died in Iraq because Bush actually called for the war where Modi never called for the riots.

    Plus when US COngressmen asks you to control terror – you don’t pay attention, when they speak on BAlochistan you don’t pay attention and when they speak about denying visa to a person who has not even asked for it, your ears perk up.

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  • Lala Gee
    Dec 9, 2012 - 1:01AM

    @Dr.Sinha:

    “You don’t throw stones at others when your house is made of fragile glass”

    This is the only statement that makes sense in your exceptionally long rebuttal. The rest is mostly rhetoric without any supporting references. Honestly, I expect better standards in writing from a person possessing a doctorate degree. Anyway, don’t you read the comments posted here by your fellow countrymen, relentlessly throwing stones at others from the self assumed position of righteousness, while their own country’s record is so bleak (By the way, this is exactly what you also did in your comment).

    “and is collapsing!”

    I am sure we will not only defeat TTP, BLA, and other outfits of the likes, but also bounce back with more vigor, resilience, and resolve for progress like Sri Lanka did (despite all the Indian machinations and the havoc wrecked there for 20 long years through her proxies, ‘Tamil National Army’ and ‘Liberation Tigers of Tamil Elam’).

    “You are ripping many facts out of context (you consistently fail to mention that prior to the outbreak of violence against Muslims, a trainload of Hindu pilgrims had been roasted alive by Muslims who had torched the train and some of them even said they would like to eat their “boti kababs” with whiskey!!).”

    I don’t say much myself, I don’t have to, and I don’t need to, because there is so much already said by the world’s human rights organizations – I just quote them and borrow from their reports. I am amazed by your, and @gp65, logic that since some protesters unintentionally, or intentionally, caused an accident (“Banerjee Commission Report”) which resulted in the death of 58 people, now punishing all the followers of their religion is justified, even though the others don’t have anything minutely remote to do with the incident. What kind of doctorate did you do, and where did you get your education? Is there any law and law enforcement bodies working in India, or it is a wilderness where the only law of jungle is ‘might is right’. If this is the way of thinking of educated Indians, no wonder the kind of extreme brutalities committed by the ordinary masses during the riots. Check this long “List of Reports”, and read them as well, related with the Gujarat massacre which are published by Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch, the two most respected organizations working globally for the human rights. Mind you, these reports cover only the Gujarat holocaust; there are many many more covering the massacres of Sikhs and Muslims of Delhi, Bombay, Ayodhiya, Kashmir, Assam and elsewhere. Also, there are reports covering the sufferings of Indian Christians from the hands of Hindutva followers.

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  • Javelin
    Dec 9, 2012 - 8:38AM

    @Ahmad Khan:
    “@Javelin: You heard or not. Entry of Terrorist Modi is still Ban in the USA. period. If you are illitrate then it’s not our responsibility to educate you”

    Try and learn English before calling others “illitrate”

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  • Sania Khan
    Dec 9, 2012 - 6:20PM

    @Lala Gee:
    Sir,
    I liked the comment and the presentation of arguments by Dr. Sinha whom you have tried, in vain, to repudiate not by giving counter-arguments but by resorting to crude suggestions about his views. I am an American of Pakistani origin, with family ties in Lahore, and I feel ashamed to say that my family comes from Pakistan.
    Coming to all the negativity you have been so diligently presenting about India, I am horrified to see you completely ignore the accusations that are flying around the world about Pakistan’s treatment of its minorities. Dr.Sinha has rightly spoken about the persecution of Hindus and Christians, and also of Shias, Ahmedis, etc. in Pakistan. The kidnapping and forcible conversion of Hindu girls in Pakistn put us to shame, and add one more inglorious chapter in the history of what we Pakistanis living abroad acknowledge and perceive as a failed state. Indeed, both HRW and Amnesty have severely criticized Pakistan for persecution of minorities who, unlike in India, have very little means to redress the problem because of the widespread acceptance of such persecution in Pakistan. You must find unity in diversity, as India is doing. By harping on Islam all the time, you are completely isolating yourself in world opinion which, like it or not, is totally opposed to Pakistan for a variety of reasons, including religious fanaticism, terrorism, etc. Foreign buyers avoid Pakistan, as my business associates repeatedly tell me, for these very reasons. Just take your green passport and go to any country in the world (if they first issue a visa to you at a consulate in Pakistan!). You will be horrified at the reaction of the hosts when they encounter a Pakistani who is, invariably, treated either as a terrorist suspect, a drug dealer or as a religious extremist. These are general stereotypes of Pakistanis. As far as Narendra Modi, the Gujarat chief minister, is concerned, who are we Pakistanis to judge what happens to Muslims in other countries when our own house is in shambles? Do you have the power or the moral authority to question, let alone influence, what transpires in another country? India, I know it because I am constantly in touch with lawyers and international law experts, has a far better judicial system than the one in Pakistan which suffers from nepotism, favouritism and other evils. Indian courts have sentenced the culprits of the Gujarat violence to imprisonment in the Gujarat incidents (it is also a fact that the riots were triggered off by Muslims first killing Hindus and burning a trainload of them, as Dr.Sinha pointed out). Do you not think that troublemakers and hate-mongerers such as Hafiz Syed should be prosecuted because of their horrendous role in the Mumbai carnage in which nearly 170 innocent people, including tiny children, were savagely massacred by machine-gun wielding killers sent by Mr. Syed to Mumbai. Or are you viewing the world from a prism that is convenient to your eyesight and ignoring the rest of it because it puts you in a poor light? Living abroad has its disadvantages, but the biggest advantage is that you are not brainwashed and you can balance your views and see your ownself in a different light. We are also taught in our schools and colleges to be self critical (this is exactly what Dr.Sinha was telling you in his comment) and not accept blindly what others want you to believe. You will help Pakistan by doing away with the madrassah mindset, and learn to tolerate, if not accept, the opposite views. This will eventually give you and others happiness. Life is not just about yourself; it is about everyone living on this planet. I hope as a much younger person than yourself — I am sure you are an elder and I express my respect to you — you will not take my comments as patronizing. .

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  • Lala Gee
    Dec 9, 2012 - 11:16PM

    @Sania Khan:

    You’d have earned my better respect if you had come straight.

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  • Ashwini Kumar
    Dec 10, 2012 - 1:25AM

    @ Lala Gee

    Dear Ms. Sania Khan,

    You have made a brave and decent effort to instill some common sense in this guy who rants under the name of Lala Gee. He consumes a lot of space writing his diatribes with regard to every article where India is mentioned. As an Indian, I thank you for trying to put things in perspective. I have many Pakistani friends in the USA and most of them are nice and well-mannered people with great deal of understanding for the complexities of the situation on the Indian subcontinent. Lala Gee and his ilk squirm at the thought of a peaceful coexistence, and live in a dark age of the past dominated by the urge to dominate or subjugate others to their ideology and thinking. He is not going to stop his diatribe no matter how hard you present facts; it’s the hall empty glass that will always stand before him.

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  • Mango aadmi
    Dec 10, 2012 - 2:36AM

    @Lala_gee: All the problems of India you have pointed out are act of Indians on Indian soil and impacting Indian people hence it is our problem. Your advice on these will be valued only as much as our advice to you to take care of situation against Ahmadis, Shias, Balochis and Hindus. What happened in Mumbai was act of Pakistanis in Indian soil impacting Indians. There is no equal deed from Indians on Pakistani soil. Hope this is clear enough for you to understand or at least realize the difference. Stop comparing apple with orange.

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  • Mango aadmi
    Dec 10, 2012 - 3:03AM

    @Sania Khan: Salute
    @Ashwini : Right said
    Since 1857 mutiny against British it is a very well known fact that Britishers used their ultimate weapon of “Divide and Conquer”. And we as fools fell in that trap and are still trapped since past 67 years. Kasab could have been a earnest earning citizen very much alive and supporting his family rather than brainwashed to such a gruesome act and die at gallows. Such a waste of life. The only thing we need to sacrifice and only thing we need to kill is the hatred and mistrust in us against each other and with religious tolerance and respect for each other’s faith our people can not just live in happiness but prosper very much. Pakistanis and Indians are bound together, one bleeds and other will surely get hurt. Imagine the world with Afghanistan Pakistan India and Bangladesh having open borders and trade and with so much of cultural similarity I can only see lot of happiness. Sigh…..wish this dream comes true.

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  • Praful R shah
    Dec 10, 2012 - 8:49AM

    @BlackJack:
    This is not blood thrist but removing sore reminder of event. No nation will like it’s innocent citizen killed without any fault. It did not make difference whether they Hindu, Muslim or any other religion. Reading from your news paper this is normal to yor culture.

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  • Ali
    Dec 10, 2012 - 7:06PM

    Dear Jyoti,

    The more sane Pakistanis know and agree with what you say. Its a shame that they are not the ones making the decisions!

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  • vasan
    Dec 10, 2012 - 7:16PM

    Sania Khan : Extremely well said.
    If you read the comments in ET under all news items from Indians and Pakistanis, living in their mother country and abroad, one thing is clear. The views by Indians about Pakistan on the subject of Islam. religious bigotry and terrorism are nearly the same whether living in India or abroad. On the other hand, the views of most of the pakistanis living abroad, esp in Western countries, tend to be similar to the Indian views whereas the views of Pakistanis living in pakistan are more or less diametrically opposite, I have read many comments by pakistanis living abroad repudiating comments from people living in Pakistan on these subjects. This must mean definetely something.
    For your info, I am an indian who lived in Western countries for a long period but now in India.

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  • Canadian Pakistani
    Dec 10, 2012 - 9:10PM

    @vasan:

    “The views by Indians about Pakistan on the subject of Islam. religious bigotry and terrorism are nearly the same whether living in India or abroad.”

    Proves only one thing. “Extreme closed-mindedness”.

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  • Learner
    Dec 11, 2012 - 1:07AM

    @ Lala Gee

    I salute you for taking on the mob of Indian bigots on these pages. They will leave no stone unturned in their efforts to paint Pakistanis as the worst people on earth and their own monsters as innocent bystanders.

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  • vasan
    Dec 11, 2012 - 9:46AM

    Canadian Pakistani : The definition of “Extreme close-mindedness” in this context is not reading the full comment, esp the lines just after your quoted line. I will not comment on whose mind is closed.

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  • Mango Aadmin
    Dec 14, 2012 - 9:55AM

    @Learner:
    Clearly you need lot of learning :)

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