Drama in Lahore: US diplomat faces double murder charge

Published: January 28, 2011

Broken windshield of the US diplomat’s car after he fired at two people in Lahore. PHOTO: IJAZ MAHMOOD

Broken windshield of the US diplomat’s car after he fired at two people in Lahore. PHOTO: IJAZ MAHMOOD Policemen stand next to a car, which police said a U.S consulate employee was travelling in when he was engaged in a shoot-out, after it was brought to a police station in Lahore. PHOTO: REUTERS/FILE

Two cases, including one for a double murder, have been registered against US diplomats involved in a dramatic shooting and hit-and-run incident, which claimed the lives of three men in Lahore on Thursday.

One diplomat has been charged for murder for killing two men on a motorbike allegedly in self defence, at Lahore’s Qartaba Chowk – while a companion of the diplomat, who is also an American citizen, crushed to death a bike rider in a hit-and-run incident, following the shooting.

The accused diplomat, Raymond Davis, opened fire at the two men – identified as Faizan Hayder, aged 22, and Faheem, 20 – at a traffic signal of Qartaba Chowk, after which he fled from the scene.

Two of his companions, who were in a Land Cruiser, tried to follow him but in an attempt to avoid a traffic jam entered the wrong side of the road and hit a motorcycle, killing one person.

However, two wardens managed to chase the diplomat and apprehended him at the Old Anarkali chowk.

Capital City Police Officer (CCPO) Muhammad Aslam Tarin confirmed that all three deceased had no previous criminal records, adding that none of them had robbed or fired at the diplomat.

Tareen further said that the American diplomat had shot at them, adding that two FIRs under Section 302 of PPC have been registered against the accused.

One FIR has been registered for shooting and killing two people, while another has registered against the unidentified accused involved in the hit-and-run.

Earlier reports suggested that the police declared those who were killed as armed dacoits. The CCPO had earlier said, “According to the diplomat two bike riders whipped out their pistol after which he fired at them in self defence and tried to flee from the scene.” He said that due to their suspicious movement, Davis thought they wanted to attack him.

Tarin said the accused was still in their custody and after consulting the embassy and prosecutors they would take action against him according to the law. He also said that the accused US diplomat was unable to show legal proof or license for carrying a weapon.

Superintendent of Police Umar Saeed Malik confirmed that both cars belonged to the US consulate. He said that the white car driven by Davis was headed towards a hotel when the incident occurred.

Ali Amjad, an eye witness, told The Express Tribune that the Land Cruiser, while following the fleeing car on Jail Road, collided with a biker identified as Ubaidur Rehman.

Davis’s car while on the run also injured a traffic warden who had tried to stop it. The car finally got stuck in a traffic jam at Anakali and was caught by the chasing warden along with an angry mob, Amjad said.

Raymond was then moved to Old Anarkali police station from where he was escorted to an unknown place by DSP Raza Safdar Kazmi in his official vehicle.

Amjad, who was present at the jail road at the time of the incident, said that the first shot was fired was from the car as, immediately after, the pillion rider fell from the bike. He said that more shots were fired from the car, after which it fled from the scene.

When contacted, US embassy spokesman Alberto Rodriguez told The Express Tribune that the embassy is working closely with the authorities and the consulate in Lahore on the issue. Although he confirmed that the US national is an employee of the consulate, he said he could not confirm his name or portfolio.

Hayder was a resident of Ravi Road and, according to his family, had left the house for the court to pursue a case against the killers of his brother who gunned him down a month ago. The family said that Hayder carried a pistol but only for self-defence. They further said that Hayder was not a dacoit, and was being used as a scapegoat by the police to save the skin of the American diplomat.

Published in The Express Tribune, January 28th, 2011.

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Reader Comments (221)

  • feroze
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:07PM

    If it was actually self defense then Bravo to the American for doing what needed to be done. If it wasn’t self defense then he should be tried accordingly. As for the US Consulate car running over a pedestrian, well for that the driver should be arrested for negligent driving and charged for man slaughter or what ever law that applies!!Recommend

  • Zone
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:08PM

    Now all religious parties will say that he was a CIA agent and the robbers were heroes and soon they will be called SHAHEED E CHOR…Recommend

  • Copper
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:12PM

    and all liberals will shout that kill all the Pakistanis save ourselves in “self defence”Recommend

  • Aown Kazmi
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:20PM

    MY HOUSE IS NEAR THAT ROAD. The man says he shot in self-defense but if so why did he try to flee the scene of the crime??? He was stopped by civilians otherwise he would have escaped, now this doesn’t seem like self-defense too me.
    Also he was american (and so obviously more learned about self-defense and what-not) so why did he shoot the guy in his head as opposed to his leg or just shooting the bike off the road. Also I might ad that this road is a very very busy street and so the “robbers” couldn’t have possibly stopped the car in mid day light, with hundreds of people around and than robbed the foreigner…. thats just HIGHLY unlikely.Recommend

  • Umar Farooq
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:31PM

    Self Defence means no use of power more than needed, ironically there is no fire from other side and if going to, in case, than again must have been killed the person who had the gun not both of them.Recommend

  • Long Live the Awam
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:35PM

    its a sensitive issue. We must not jump to conclusions. he killed the men with weapons may be his acts were governed by self defence . As an American he knew if he stop mob will do justice first then do trail so he tried to run away from the sceane and in a his way hit a padestrian. We should also try to understand the duress he was under going.
    I think he did what any one of us could have done in a country where we are seen not with friendly eyes.

    Let investigation proceed and trust our Law enforcement agencies. they are pakistanies and cannot go against the feelings of Pakistanis.Recommend

  • Jan 27, 2011 - 5:35PM

    @Zone – com’on where from you brought in the religious parties under current situation??
    Guys we should condemn this act of killing conducted under both the circumstances. No one is permitted on this soil to take law in hands. Do Americans kill robber in self-defence back is US??? No, so the very same rule applies in Pakistan as well, in case the americans had forgotten it.Recommend

  • Huda
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:36PM

    Imagine if a Pakistani had shot dead a couple of Americans in New York City. Hell would break lose. Waiting to see how this turns out.Recommend

  • jutt
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:37PM


  • Rizwan
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:41PM

    Very soon there will be statement from home dept terrorist was about to fire on His Highness Mr, David so in self-defense he opened fire,
    Our own police department will escort him to airport for safe departure from dangerous Pakistan,
    I think somebody should give bravery medal to Mr,David,Recommend

  • Ali
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:43PM

    Why does the US have a consulate in Lahore anyways? They only need one in Islamabad, there is no need for them to entrench themselves in our country any further. The sooner they leave the region the better.

    If it was self defense then so be it. But there is no need for them to be there, unless they are tourists in which case they wouldn’t be getting shot at as they wouldn’t be involved in the internal affairs of our country!Recommend

  • Elyaz
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:47PM

    I am sure if some pakistani has done the same thing in USA……he would have been labelled as a terrorist……this american guy will surely get away with this regardless of he did this in self defense or on purpose…….n it will be a shame if they let him go without any trial…….Recommend

  • fedup
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:48PM

    if a pakistani kills 2 goras in USA in self defence, they would say he is terrorist. Justice would be denied to him, but here in Pakistan, that American wouldn’t be put on trial…Recommend

  • Iftikhar-ur-Rehman
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:50PM

    I believe the American has already been taken away by a senior Police Office KAZMI and maybe handed over to the Americans( TICKER ON ONE PRIVATE TV CHANNEL).The instructions must have come from Rehman Malik. I would like to ask him (REHMAN MALIK) if he himself had killed someone in self defense in USA he would have been arrested and the news would have been on each and every TV channel like BBC,CNN,FOX,SKY etc. I am sure he remembers when he was detained while going to Airport when his driver took a wrong turn.
    Come on Rehman Malik act in Pakistan’s interest just once………Recommend

  • Sara
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:52PM

    these so-called seculars and liberals even do not question whether american was allowed a gun.

    after following a lot of blogs here, i feel that we still have slaves in Pakistan who failed to realise that Pakistan got independence in 1947.

    Sham on you all……… you cry about your conciousness and when it comes to ordinary Pakistanis you get mum. slaves….Recommend

  • Junaid
    Jan 27, 2011 - 5:58PM

    @elyaz : comon most probably he did in self defence and we know how street gets nasty some times.
    even if pakistani did that in US resisting robbery he would get fair treatment.
    if he had killed robbers that nice and dont bring crap in between.Recommend

  • SUB
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:03PM

    @ Elyaz/ Copper? Huda: You are so True

    We have seen a lot of Mulla and Blesphmy law bashing on these pages in case of Salmaan sb’s murder, let us see how many bloggers show up to comment on this one :)

    I will be particularly looking forward to the “foreign educated” lot. HeHeRecommend

  • Nadir
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:08PM

    American and Israeli flagmakers in Pakistan will be smiling…alot of cloth is heading towards the flamesRecommend

  • Talat
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:12PM

    3 Pakistanis shot dead by an American National in Lahore just a while ago and has declared it an act of Self Defence …. The Same Self Defence in USA by a Pakistani would have been tagged “Terrorism” ….. ~!~Recommend

  • J.Oberoi
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:13PM

    A quick question: Is carrying guns legal in Pakistan? Everybody seems to carry one.Recommend

  • Nadir El-Edroos
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:14PM

    Is the problem that he killed two people, or that he killed two people and he was American. Killing two people in Pakistan doesnt even get you mention on the front pages, but if you are an American it does! Just goes to show how we Paksitani’s devalue our own fellow citizen’s. Recommend

  • Jan 27, 2011 - 6:18PM
  • Nadeem Ahmed
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:20PM

    We must wait for investigation before judging anything. If American is gulity, then must be punished accordingly.Recommend

  • edgarm
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:44PM

    agree with Huda and Talat. Recommend

  • Jan 27, 2011 - 6:45PM

    In other news , American killed thousand and continues to kill Pakistanis in self defense using Drone strikes. Thought this was a breaking news too. Recommend

  • Naeem Siddiqui, Australia
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:46PM


    The time of Slavery of Goras have gone this is the era of slavery of Mullahs of our respective sect.

    Why you are becoming so angry if a foreigner killed two Pakistanis who are suspected of being robber. day before yesterday in the same city a 13 years old boy blow himself to kill his fellow innocent Muslims that boy was made believe that he is doing right thing and will go to heaven by who!!?? our so called Mullahs. !!!

    Which incident is more serious !!!??

    Whatever that American diplomat done is wrong and a crimes, he is in police custody and being investigated wait for the result and let the legal process follow and don’t be so excited.

    And for your and my others excited Pakistani fellas information is that US could very well claim diplomatic immunity for her diplomat, lets see what happens. Recommend

  • Waqqas Iftikhar
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:48PM

    if he shot a couple of robbers dead …good on him….showed all of us how to act…Recommend

  • Shamsi Ajani
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:56PM

    Please tell me why do US counselor official carry gun?. Do diplomats carry guns and shoot people on streets and then do a hit and run and kill and injure additional persons. Veil of diplomatic immunity should be lifted and he should be tried according to law. Let justice be done.Recommend

  • Ed
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:56PM

    Kudos to the American diplomat for his excellent marksmanship! Recommend

  • Khan
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:58PM

    If any Pakistani had Killed any Ameriacn in New York in self defence America would have threaterned Pakistan for an attack as Paistani is involved in terrorist attack on US.Recommend

  • Imran
    Jan 27, 2011 - 6:59PM

    If the two bikers were indeed trying to rob him, then he had the right of self defense. At least he didn’t burn or lynch them.Recommend

  • Morbid Isolation
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:01PM


    …and you must be the king of the utopia where everything is black & white, proving a crime & providing justice is easy and unicorns are the predominant mode of travel.I’m sure the story and the aftermath will be MUCH more complicated than your naively simple conclusion.The world isn’t a simple place,it never was.Recommend

  • hghg
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:05PM

    **see first kill azam tariq spokeman and tehreek e taliban hakimuulah mehsud qari hussain

    long long time they killing you ,still you cant kill them

    show there dead body for beleive

    and about americans – dont let america bully you but still america will also do for its self interest what they can

    so improve conditions god help those who help themselves

    no businness news ever heard from pak always news of blast- no bearings,automobile ,tyres,medical equipments,die tool and moulding,making buildings and sccoflding eathquake,proof**,computer jobs,accounting,tally

    you only know (Hypersonic, Subsonic Cruise Missiles and Ballistic Missiles,fighter planes

    first thing why development budget small then military

    you can safe youself and think of attacking – this will create problem naturally

    you dont have anti missile system, no barriers on roads, no criminal records Recommend

  • Sharjeel Jawaid
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:14PM

    Having suffered the trauma of being mugged five times in last seven years, I wish me and all such victims could shoot the muggers and get away with it too! Recommend

  • A A
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:23PM

    Afia was also arrested in the name of “self-defence”.? She also attacked on american from karachi? And see how quick is our police in investigation. Pedestrian was also robber?Recommend

  • Jan 27, 2011 - 7:33PM

    This was American justice… now let us see the Pakistani justice…!!!Recommend

  • sohaib
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:34PM

    Since he is an Americans and we are their slaves, how dare our laws apply on them? Guys, cool down, this American must be already on the plane going home while we are venting our frustrations here. Just think about Aafia and many other Pakistanis languishing in their jails and our muted responses to these acts of injustice. You could call us poor , but are we beyghairat too??

    And diplomats are not allowed to carry weapons. Must one of those Blackwater types who have been given visas by the dozens by our ‘patriotic’ ambassador in US. Recommend

  • Guru
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:37PM

    Agree with you Khan..How confidence that these americans has ..and we Pakistanis are just born to die like that.. as we have no Body to take careRecommend

  • Aoun
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:39PM

    If he had really killed those persons in self defense then he got to prove it,
    He is an intelligence officer then he must be conversant with the rules of engagement, no where in the world it states that u shoot in the head of a suspected attacker. he should be tried in court and it should be made public
    weapon could have been planted also, there is no second witness about those who were alleged robbers and they pulled a gun out at himRecommend

  • Abdullah
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:45PM

    It wasn’t robbery…he fired from inside the car and both got shots in the back. Its like a pre-emptive action. They are free to kill anyone. Recommend

  • Zone
    Jan 27, 2011 - 7:51PM

    Aafia was a terrorist…what the hell she was doing in Afghanistan…Though her supporters say that her only fault is that she was wearing a scarf but the reality is that she started having extremist thought In the US and went to Af from Pak that is what her husband has said that is why he has divorced her..
    As for this issue…we Pakistanis are very radical towards american..the angry mob would have killed this american..that is why he did what was right..though having a gun with u in the public is nothing new to this country eg Karachi, Quetta etcRecommend

  • ali
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:00PM

    its amazing how is electronic media is on pay list of the americans themselves.
    Right now as i am writing this there is not a singlr channel reporting this.
    absoultely disgustedRecommend

  • Amer
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:00PM

    The investigation will find the details but I saw the pictures of the guys shot. One of them had a belt with ammunition around his waist which they say that people who do things like these usually have and the other guy’s gun was under the motorcycle. You can see all this on GEO as well. Recommend

  • faraz
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:05PM

    What has this incidence to do with liberalism or conservativism? He should be tried according to the law of the land, thats it!Recommend

  • Singh
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:18PM

    Most of commentator don’t know the Law In U.S. You guys are ignorant about US law.
    Yes In U.S.A in self deffence you can shoot & Kill. It is Land of Law & law is equall for every body. It does not matter who you are. Senater, congress man, Governor arrested same way as any other person. Ex. Governor Of Illinois is in prison on corruption charges. i.e he gave job to his known person etc. Mr. Tom Delay from Texas sentence for prison for channeling money from one account ot another account for political purpose. To all please read US paper everyday before you make any comment on US Law.Recommend

  • karachiite
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:32PM

    for the people who are asking why did he flee in case you guys have forgotten this is the same country where Sialkot brothers were done for! step in that guys shoes and honestly say you would stop to face the mob who kills first and find guilt laterRecommend

  • Abidi
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:38PM

    Good job done,Pakistan is short of two carjackers/terrorists.The Lahoris should be thankful to this brave AmericanRecommend

  • Mohsin Aly
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:41PM

    Great America ????Recommend

  • syed maududi
    Jan 27, 2011 - 8:53PM

    they kill from the drones, and its ok
    they regularly kill people in road traffic accidents and now they openly shoot people.
    but hey they are the good guys. we are all criminal/terrorist, unless you are from the liberal classes.Recommend

  • Jan 27, 2011 - 8:54PM

    Off course, Zardari or our CJ won’t be doing anything to this American whether he is right or wrong. They want IMF tranche of dollars. That’s the point. Americans rule. Recommend

  • tamoor
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:04PM

    wat nonsence American (panic situation)i don t get it .These three peoples are innocent.Recommend

  • Nael
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:08PM

    Justice must prevail. If it was self defense, well done. If it was unprovoked, he must be tried according to the prevailing law regardless of all the pressure and diplomatic immunity. Recommend

  • Danish+S.
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:11PM

    WOW! I salute the Pakistani double standards! Hundreds of people die on the streets of Karachi in incidents of petty theft but no one get all worked up about it. Those killers are on the lose, looting and maiming over and over again. But just because an American Citizen acted in self defense (still under investigation) and killed the alleged robbers, he should be termed as a terrorist? Can the LAW please have its turn in this LAND OF THE (im)PURE!!!?? Yes what happened to the little boy is indeed tragic and the driver of the vehicle should be prosecuted and punished for it, no question about that.

    There are a bunch of people who are claiming – “had a Pakistani done something like this on the streets of US he would’ve been termed as a terrorist”. Well my beloved countrymen/women when was the last time a Pakistani citizen did that? I remember one who tried to blow up a bomb in middle of Times Square and trust me he wasn’t doing that in SELF DEFENSE! And lets assume if some Pakistani does kill an american citizen in self defense, rest assured he/she will be TRIED in court!Recommend

  • Hamood
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:11PM

    If the the guys on the motorcycle were robbers and pulled a gun on him then he acted in self defense. American haters need not get emotional. All these American haters also line up US embassy in Islamabad everyday in hopes of getting a visa to the dream land. Hippocrates. Recommend

  • Ali Ebrahim
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:17PM

    Don’t consular staff enjoy diplomatic immunity (civil as well as criminal) anyway?Recommend

  • Haroon
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:32PM

    what a self defense !
    If this is a self defense, then why Talibans (not TTP) are declared as TERRORIST !
    Americans occupied their land and they are self defending, so simple.Recommend

  • Zone
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:32PM

    There is a problem with us Pakistanis we always think that there is a conspiracy against us from USA…we need to be secular and liberal…Recommend

  • A.S
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:40PM

    Well Said – Danish. bravo!!!!

    Double standards of people and their megalomaniac complexes have no place in today’s complex world.

    Watching the world with such tainted lenses will only consume from within with even more ferrocity.Recommend

  • Nadir El-Edroos
    Jan 27, 2011 - 9:42PM

    This is just so fustrating! Everyone is treating this guy with the same ignorance and media induced hype that Paksitani’s are treated with in other countries, were people presume guilt because he is Pakistani. Just because in America a Pakistani suspected of a crime is treated as guilty from the minute he makes headlines, doesnt justiffy that we should treat him as if he is guilty before knowing the facts. People are proclaiming here that the two motorcyclists are innocent, they may be, but let the facts come forward. Recommend

  • Waiting
    Jan 27, 2011 - 10:00PM

    How long before someone uses the ‘B’ word? i.e BlackwaterRecommend

  • Umair Waheed Sheikh, Khayban e Hafiz,IBA Karachi
    Jan 27, 2011 - 10:27PM

    Three less robbers on the road! Atleast the American had the courage to confront thieves. Otherwise they either would have robbed him or if they would have been caught, they would have been released the next day. So good for everyone. Why do people act so much against the Americans? They carry weapons because the government cant provide protection to its top brass let alone the common man. So what should one do! We should commend this guy for his heroism! Hip Hip Hurray!Recommend

  • Majid Urrehman
    Jan 27, 2011 - 10:31PM

    Justice must be brought. Otherwise we riot. Pakistan is not Afghanistan or Iraq. Recommend

  • Sara
    Jan 27, 2011 - 10:32PM

    one more Sara :)
    U r right ALI. diplomatic staff has immunity.
    By the way this AMERICAN was sent back as PERSONA NON GRATA, when he was in Peshawar.

    Now this is point, who sent him back in Pakistan, and what HAQQANI sahab doing in AMERICA, issuing visa’s to every american, without any investigation.Recommend

  • The US Paki
    Jan 27, 2011 - 10:51PM

    Guys, please read the news first and then comment on it. News does not say if the shooter was Gora, Kala or Coconut (brown outsite, white inside, meaning Pakistani who is US Citizen). In the news it does not say that the shooter was the one who also killed the third man, it was another car from the US Consulate which killed the third mand and injured the fourth man. Feel bad for all the dead and injured people.Recommend

  • Aftab Kenneth Wilson
    Jan 27, 2011 - 11:08PM

    Their family members are saying that these guys went to the courts on date of some hearings and were carrying firearms. Even many witnesses of the scene admitted that these boys were armed. Mr. Raymond David was on his way after getting cash from a bank and kidnapping must have also been in his mind (He is American) so it can be presumed he acted in self defense. All of us know the situation of lawlessness in our country where criminals easily get bail to do more crimes. Media Houses and fanatics are only having field days on this incident. Let us wait for some more findings from our Most Disqualified Police which will only do what they are told to do.Recommend

  • Mir Agha
    Jan 27, 2011 - 11:33PM

    It’s actually a conspiracy theory. Hatched by the ISI, China, Arabs, mullahs, and regular Pakistanis to make the poor defenseless us national out to be a murderer.Recommend

  • Khurram Nizami
    Jan 27, 2011 - 11:37PM

    today if we dont stand up as a Nation tht a fair trial should be conducted against these foreigners secondly why was there a fake plate no on prado as per Express News ?trust me these foreigners in a shield of self defence will start killing our Pakistani brother and sisters.

    Big parties like MQM and PML N should take up a stand if they have the courage I doubt MQM ll do it becaue of Altaf bhai been in UK, PML N should rise on this issueRecommend

  • Manuel
    Jan 27, 2011 - 11:37PM

    This seems like an op gone bad. Maybe I watch too much burn notice, but this seems like an op gone terribly wrong. The car that ran over the pedestrian was probably a) an escort? or b) the car pursuing the shooter.

    The shooter could be trying to flee the other car, and wanted to create confusion to escape. I don’t think he counted on the quick response of the public to surround him and detain him.

    Head shots also mean the shooter was trained and was executing the motorcyclists. So there may be something there.Recommend

  • Umayr Masud
    Jan 27, 2011 - 11:45PM

    Freaked out people should not be let lose on the road .. But i guess the people on the motor bike were curious because they finally saw a “GORA” after so many years .. and the gora was freaked of them being kidnappers.. Paranoia at its bestRecommend

  • Madiha Akhtar
    Jan 27, 2011 - 11:53PM

    Its either my way or highway. Either they are drone attacks or the involvement of the US officials in the affairs of the country.Though there are many speculations regarding this news that whether they were robbers or not? then are the US officials free to carry pistol in the streets of Pakistan? In 2009 also there was an incident in which four US marine officials were caught for having weapons in the federal capital of Pakistan. It was given much hype by the media but no concrete actions were taken. Lets hope that further investigations could reveal the truth regarding this case.Recommend

  • Jan 28, 2011 - 12:09AM

    the man will be called back to US and nothing will happen. he is just a technical adviser and does nt njoys diplomatic immunity but that does nt matter. The govt n the officials will provide him will ll that necessary stuff. The blood gone in vain. Had it been the case vice versa, then you would had seen how the plot would be linking back to Al qaeda and terrorists n finding a way to enforce diplomatic nd military pressures, for which they always trying to crfeate oppurtunities. Imagine soRecommend

  • critic
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:42AM

    compare your headline with the Dawn headline. you are fanning extremism.Recommend

  • Jan 28, 2011 - 12:45AM

    Foreigners aren’t allowed to carry arms, So even if it was self defense, the question arises why were they carrying arms. Let the matter be investigated. Plus two innocent boys were killed too, the american would need to pay damages for their life IF it was the result of his negligence.And for the record I am very much anti islam kay thaykaydar and “westernized” as right wingers put it. Recommend

  • nOOne
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:46AM

    It makes me recall that allegedly, Aafia used an assault rifle to attack trained US soldiers. She was tried, and jailed.
    Mr. David put a pullet in someone’s head. Nice shot. He is surely a professional. But not professional while driving. Killed another guy while trying to flee.
    What was he doing alone on roads of a terrorist country? Which is unsafe for any foreigner?
    According to intellectuals, i find here, it was an act of self defence. I question, were ANY of you there? (Furnish a proof, or stay quiet).
    Now this is something interesting. People mis-use law related to prophets. And that caused a huge outrcy. Well, why shouldn’t i believe that Mr. David misused his right of self-defence? If they were armed, with a licensed pistol, he was carrying unlicensed weapon. (baretta is deadliest from close range, and prohibited).
    And Mr. Australian, who commented on this post, we are “shah sy zyada shah k wafadaar”. Ghulaam zahniyat nahi tu aur kya hai?
    I just hope that when the murderer is tried in courts, witnesses are not prevented from giving their accounts. On a second thought, its not difficult to get “witnesses” for a few $$$. But, i still hope that justice shall prevail.
    Let me remind everyone here. No matter how innocent he is, he can’t escape imprisonment for life. And he isnt a diplomat at least. Could be a clerk or assassin or whatever. But not someone of a rank who should receive diplomatic immunity.Recommend

  • vijay
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:52AM

    No wonder, he was carrying a hidden agenda to disrupt the peace of Lahore , as they usually do.(No wonder we American can go beyond law to protect our interest/national security)
    why he tried to flee from crime scene??????????Recommend

  • Noor Lodi
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:59AM

    The thing to note is that no fellow American is condoning his act, neither are they showering him with flowers or 800 lawyers showing up to defend him. Or the American Christian Mulllahs giving speeches in churches to defend him.

    But I would agree if the situation was reversed with Pakistani in US killing two Americans, there would have definitely terrorist inclinations, at least in the media. Yes there is a double standard, but so do we have. We all are humans and we all have double standards. No one is perfect.

    Plenty of bias on both sides and plenty of miss-information all over.Recommend

  • Shazi
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:07AM

    He was infect CIA agent (Black water) solder who had killed 2 robbers, i think those were 2 robbers and they robbed this CIA and when they were going back on there back, he shoot at them and kill both of them, these 2 can’t be terrorist because terrorist just blow themselves they don’t use pistols like this, He kill 1 innocent guy in busy road of Lahore when he his drive car back in one way traffic and hit a bike rider and kill him, he would be charged for murder because he was not a consulate person and he had killed 1 innocent guy.Recommend

  • A. Rehman
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:20AM

    what a delightful comment! we have plenty of good marksmen – should we open season on his/YOUR compatriots??

    @Ed: Recommend

  • Venomal
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:22AM

    Its a sad incident indeed. My initial thoughts are, whether those two bikers indeed had a gun on them. Since there is no witness alive and no one to ask what his/their intentions were, I am afraid that this american would be cleared of all charges and send back to the US.

    Secondly, I second those who are talking about “What if, a pakistani had done the same thing in the US”, he would have had his citizenship evoked, his life ruined and a “Terrorist” label would have been planted on his forehead.

    Thirdly, I do not think that there is any harsh punishment for self-defense. What might be done is that this individual would be made to pay blood-money to the families of the two/three victims.Recommend

  • Asif
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:23AM

    if the pakistanis were robbers then atleast some cross firing should have taken place and why did the guy kill them instead of injuring them?Dr.Aafia is a constant reminder to the fate of a foreinger assaulting an american.Recommend

  • Ali
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:26AM

    This is an excellent opportunity among many others for Pakistani public to act like the way they are doing in Tunisia, Egypt and Yemen. Come on guys lets put our lives on the line and save this nation and our children. Who is with me?Recommend

  • Salman
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:34AM

    Im just surprised how quickly spare tyres turned up for protesters to burn. Recommend

  • Haris Chaudhry
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:39AM

    There are on average 50 people killed in Pakistan on the roads by fellow Pakistanis EVERY single day. Hundreds of women and children get raped by fellow Pakistanis. Thousands others get abused, assaulted and millions suffer injustices of various kind.

    The Ghairat Brigade again has jumped on this unfortunate incident for point scoring. This is shameful. If I was that American and someone remotely showed me the gun to intimidate, rob or kill, I wouldnt hesitate emptying my magazine to ensure I and my family stay safe.

    I am sure most of you will do that too. The Ghairat-Brigade just need to loosen up. Plenty of Pakistani based American killers are in American jail without a single of them accused of terrorism.

    In fact let me ask this hypocrite lot – State exactly when a Pakistani born American was accused of terrorism which turned out to be a false allegation ??

    There has not been a single Pakistani which killed another American and in return labelled as a terrorist by any media outlet.

    Most of the ghairat brigade feels so confused, deprived and mentally oppressed that they wouldnt let go of any opportunity to malign America.

    Haris ChaudhryRecommend

  • Zaidi
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:40AM

    They were men and this is no way for men to die!
    If he did it in self defense he should have known better than to shoot to kill!
    But killing a Pakistani doesn’t really matter does it? We would surely be carrying a Beretta pistol and shoot to kill as there are too many outlaws in Pakistan one less wont hurt or 2 or just one pedestrian.
    Now we should act as we are told and let him go back to his country.
    Try punching some one in self defense in NYC, and then we would be terrorists from a terrorist state.Recommend

    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:43AM

    a time of disparity… a time to feel ashamed of being a Pakistani and announcing to the world openly that WE ARE THE SLAVES OF THE STATES AND DO WHAT WE ARE TOLD TO DO….. Pakistanis after the treatment of the government and police should know that they even have no worth in there own mother land’s streets….. our Police has defined that the word PATRIOTISM is the letter of the old standard English and that know we people whose grandparents once fought for the bride and honor are at present a piece of rubbish for the westerners who can do what so ever they will and do any sort of experiments on our nation for we are no more then mer LAB ANIMALS for them with no voice to shout and no feelings to express….. If today the YOUTH does not come up to the streets reminding the government their duties that they have on their shoulders for us so called FUTURE of the nation then I AM SORRY TO SAY I AM GOING TO FEEL DISGRACED TO CALL MY SELF THE MEMBER OF THIS ONCE TO BE A PROUD NATION…..Recommend

    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:46AM

    trigger happy americans !! they have to answer to no one specially if its poor brown men who died !!Recommend

  • Hamood
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:59AM

    Pakistani state has failed to protect its citizens against armed robbers. Many a times even the police is in cahoots with the robbers. Dozens of such incidents with two guys on motorcycles happen every day in all major cities of the country. Since our government is not going to protect us, this seems to be only way to protect yourself. Recommend

  • Noor
    Jan 28, 2011 - 2:20AM

    only we in the land of impure have the right to kill our own.. you outsiders stay away.. dont target our prey lest we go hungry.Recommend

  • Rashid Hasan
    Jan 28, 2011 - 2:21AM

    @feroze: If only everyone is as sane as you! Well said. Recommend

  • smaq
    Jan 28, 2011 - 2:33AM

    wow! i feel sorry for people who are supporting this act, actually not only our leaders but also faction of our educated society is “slave minded” ,

    how can you allow an american citizen to kill people on the streets????? and just think for a second if this would have happened in america by Pakistani citizen????

    May Allah help us and protect us from “slave mentality” of our people.Recommend

  • riaz
    Jan 28, 2011 - 2:35AM

    @awan… what if next time he will kill someone you know in self defense?Recommend

  • Jan 28, 2011 - 2:38AM


    The liberal jihadis will side with the american until their own becomes a target practise, they probably too shameless to even admit that. Complete story is, their was another car that was rushing in aid to the American [who shot the guys on the motor cycle for carrying a pistol], and ran over another pedestrian, how was he able to carry a weapon, when he is on visit visa and not an employee of the US consulate?
    Liberal jihadis diverting with generalizations is despicable and pathetic, there was a PAkistani citizen body parts son of actor Jameel Fakhry which were just handed over by the US, they never charged him of terrorism nor arrested the ones who murdered him. If the bystanders would’ve had the wisdom of our slave system, they sshould’ve done the “infinite justice” on the American there and then, that would’ve been better.Recommend

  • Nadeem Ahmed
    Jan 28, 2011 - 2:56AM

    If those motorbike riders had pulled a gun on American and pointed towards him, then he had every right to fire first and defend himself. Everything will come out after investigation, but my question to Pakistani media is that they were quick enough to find identity of american, but identities of those victims are still not clear. Their bio data will tell the whole story.Recommend

  • saqib sharif
    Jan 28, 2011 - 3:35AM

    Why the blood of Pakistani people are so cheap? I am asking this question to all Pakistanis, Can’t we become and behave like a nation? Can’t we stand for Pakistan not for Zardari/Nawaz/Altaf/Asfand/Kiyani? Can’t we become Tunis or Egypt?

    We have to become a nation my brothers and sisters otherwise we are will be killing like this and our Govt. will not look at our interest infact others and theirs.

    Please join your hands for Pakistan.Recommend

  • Clean Pakistan
    Jan 28, 2011 - 3:43AM

    what the heck was he doing in that part of Lahore, in a private car, armed, ready to to go that length – to kill? and the rescue team treated people on the street like insects – kill at will to save him?

    i sincerely hope unbiased investigation is done and justice is served, otherwise it will further sour the Pakistani-Public US relationship.Recommend

  • Ali Haider
    Jan 28, 2011 - 4:27AM

    He must be having some name? Or is his name American? Why are we making this a Pakistani vs American issue? And if he is handed over to the US consulate then we should be ready to see more of such incidents in the future.Recommend

  • An American
    Jan 28, 2011 - 5:13AM

    This is a conspiracy by CIA, Mossad, RAW, ISI, KGB, FIA and UN to divert attention from AfgahanistanRecommend

  • Peace On Earth
    Jan 28, 2011 - 5:30AM

    The article doesn’t state details such as if the man fled the scene or not so I won’t rush to judgment. However, if you live in Karachi you are probably aware of men who ride bikes and carry AK-47s with them and I am sure you would also fight back if one of them pointed a gun at you. If the US citizen did indeed fight back in self-defense then good job.

    May justice prevail…Recommend

  • Sam
    Jan 28, 2011 - 5:32AM

    Pakistanis need to learn self respect and get rid of AmeriKKKan menace that has dehumanized Pakistanis and shed their blood with impunity. US CIA agents in Pakistan are crminal thugs.Recommend

  • Imran
    Jan 28, 2011 - 5:40AM

    Shame on Pakistani Govt and Police, it simple robbery case and everyone knows it, and Shamless Pakistani govt is ignoring the fact he acted in self defence…

    Free the American citizen asap!Recommend

  • Imran
    Jan 28, 2011 - 5:42AM

    Free American citizen asap, he acted in self defence!Recommend

  • Hamza
    Jan 28, 2011 - 6:01AM

    Self Defence can be used as a defence if there was a fear of immediate grievous bodily harm. This could have been possible if the American did see the victims taking out his gun (a gun was found). The opposite is true if the gun (on the victims) was never used.

    What is necessary is, that people should stop jumping to conclusions and become self declared judges. We have courts for that

    Moreover, the media needs to stop being irresponsible in such matters. It is appalling how certain tv channels have already popularised this as a conspiracy theory and I’ve tried to gain political points from this situation. Such channels need to be dealt with strictly. Speculation does not help anyone. Recommend

  • Mawali
    Jan 28, 2011 - 6:35AM

    give us all a break!Recommend

  • J
    Jan 28, 2011 - 8:10AM

    You don’t know what the he’ll you’re talking about! We are not going to allow an American Diplomat be prosecuted in a Pakistani court. Why don’t you go over there and see exactly what it’s like to be an American in a country where you don’t know who wants to kill, kidnap, blow you up and/or exploit you before they kill you publicly. You’re misinformed my friend…Recommend

  • kazmis
    Jan 28, 2011 - 8:20AM

    @Aown Kazmi:
    In Karachi dacoits loot in the traffic jam on the gun point. While in Lahore both dacoits were in possession of guns. If a person killed them at self defense then it is no surprise. I wish all pakistan citizen should be allowed to kill dacoits at sight in self defense. It should be no crime.Recommend

  • Jamal
    Jan 28, 2011 - 8:25AM

    Pakistan should immediately boycott the military aid, to start with. Pakistanis ask for military aid and this happens. Wikileaks showed how our general was sharing sensitive information with the Anericans. He even asked them to help him get an extension. That is why they do it. Recommend

  • Ramzan+Ali
    Jan 28, 2011 - 9:04AM

    @Huda; Agreed to your point !!!

    Nothing will happen to this American, once the PM or the President will call the police & tell them to leave him. After all we been sold to Americans……..Recommend

  • bilal
    Jan 28, 2011 - 9:27AM

    he will bribe and get of all this mess quickly if he understands our costumes im sure he is :P Recommend

  • hateAmerica
    Jan 28, 2011 - 9:32AM

    U made a stupid comment…If we people don’t have soft corner for our people ..then what can we expect from our non-Muslim enemies!!!!!!! It mean we are rightly kicked by Americans!!! Think before commenting in this type of issues, that what we want to show to the world!!Recommend

  • Mujtaba Abid
    Jan 28, 2011 - 9:49AM

    our so called FREE judiciary will soon declare these american asses innocent !Recommend

  • Noor
    Jan 28, 2011 - 9:52AM

    Well! he may be, though I’m not from anu religious outfit.
    Allegedly, he is the same person who was stopped at Sherpoa checkpost in 2009 and denied the authorities by keeping his car locked and instead threatening the law enforcement agencies.Recommend

  • Noor
    Jan 28, 2011 - 9:59AM

    @The US Paki:
    I wish you were related to one of the deads closely, anyway we’re taught to have real brotherly feelings for all Muslims.
    At the same time, we’re taught not to be lenient with even real son or daughter if involved in a crime.
    will US govt allow any Pakistani to attack their citizens any place in the world, merely after a Pakistani felt threatened?Recommend

  • RizwanTKhan
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:04AM

    Govt better not let this American go just like that. Only courts should do it after the whole proceedings. Recommend

  • Noor
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:06AM

    As they say, Dr Afia was detained and awarded 84 years inprisonment, just for aiming a weapon on US soldier? (though we don’t believe it).
    the bottomline is that we should make ourselves strong enough to tell any foreigner in their faces that we had enough.
    our leaders should resolve their issues within the country and not complain and get benefitted through foreigners. they should invest and generate profits by developing economy of own country.
    Only then we can get a respectable treatment from the world.Recommend

  • Noor
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:11AM

    How come a visitor who came just 10 days ago, drives perfectly on Lahore’s congested roads and speaks fluent URDU?
    Check this link as well.

  • Fahad Zafar
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:20AM

    No one has any right to kill people. How would “robbers” try to rob a person in broad day light and on that busy road. The American spy could have called emergency police number for help and if he had to shoot then he could have shot on the legs. Government should request US Govt to withdraw his immunity. I hope Mr Shabaz Sharif and Mr Shah Memmood can answer our questions as Chief Minister and Foreign Minister respectively. Recommend

  • Noor
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:20AM

    @Nadir El-Edroos:
    Yes we do take serious note even if the killer is a local, especially in such circumstances.
    Secondly, if he was Chinese, we could have taken it liniently due to vice versa relations.
    there should be a tit for tat.
    I have a question here
    Why don’t you dissolve UNO, if one of the members & their citizens have to act like a master over others?Recommend

  • Noor
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:26AM

    @Naeem Siddiqui, Australia:
    Please make yourself comfortable in Australia. If you’ve that much of pain for this country, fall back and face what your fellow citizens are facing.
    It is easier saying than facing; Are Mullahs to be blamed for everything, including killing of these 3 people?
    maybe some Mullah hepnatised david to feel threatened to the extent that these may be killed on point blank.
    Do you know who’s behind that brain washed 13 year old child?Recommend

  • Yasir Siddiqui
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:40AM

    One simple question that we should be asking is what in the world was he doing at Qurtaba Chowk in the first place? Americans have no business there except that they were probably planning another terrorist attack on our soil to fuel anarchy and insecutiry. I firmly believe that CIA has a lot to do with most of the terrorist attacks carried out in our country in order to create reasons for us to believe that we (Pak & US) share a common enemy.Recommend

  • adnan
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:42AM

    So if it is agreed that lotters (if they are in this case) have to be killed in a same way, then we must shift this duty to the americans… by the way self defence does not mean to kill other person…here in this blog it seems that many a people are still doing their self defence and just wanted to paint themselves as Liberals…(so called)….
    Is not it the misery of this country these so called Mullas painted every incident as Sazich to islam and on the other hand our so called Liberals tried their level best to portray what ever west is doing, is right and Halal on us….. Recommend

  • American Spy
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:45AM

    This American Agent, “Raymond Davis” (if that is his real name) had 3 cell phones and a gun. Only spies carry 3 cell phones.

    Besides, the two other Americans killed an innocent pedestrian. The driver must be charged and tried in Pakistan.

    None of them had diplomatic immunity, so they must all be tried in Pakistan. Also, no Bail must be granted.

    Lahore is not Iraq nor Afghanistan. Recommend

  • yar jan
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:46AM

    seemed he was aware of it already and the rest 2 were too actors of this drama…. ………………Recommend

  • satyram
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:49AM

    Here point is not this that he killed two young Pakistani in self defence, point to be noted is this that how much rest of the world is afraid of Pakistanis.Recommend

  • Rehan
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:55AM

    Many question comes to mind:

    1) Why the american guy was carrying the weapon with him?
    2) Why he tried to flee from the scene?
    3) If he fired in self-defence then what threats were there for him as there wasn’t a single fire from the other side? Seems like he is trying to deceive the issue.
    4) He must be charged accordingly to kill an innocent biker while trying to flee. There could be no excuses for that at least.Recommend

  • Sandy
    Jan 28, 2011 - 10:57AM

    Law of the land must prevail !! But tradition of not obeying law is set up by Pakistanis themselves why to blame somebody other. Americans follow their laws at home and make us compulsory to follow them in US . Recommend

  • S Asghar
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:04AM

    Many have missed the sad part that the guy who got hit by Four wheel drive on wrong side of the road. He was getting Married next month. When can we take our glasses off from nationalism and Americanism to just actually feel the tragedy :/

    I even do not care for those woman who got knocked down from raksha, they are still alive but not that fellow :/Recommend

  • Simple
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:11AM

    A case should be registered against Raymond, in Pakistan. And if families of the murdered give immunity, then its OK, Otherwise Raymond should be hanged in Pakistan as Law says.
    Government should not play a dollar game on this incident.
    Judiciary is now a trusted institution. Chief Justice should take a suo moto action. Recommend

  • Kash
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:15AM

    We are indeed a stupid nation. We jump to conclusions and blow our time and brains out on something that is not even investigated. We run on media hype and we lynch, kill, rob our fellow citizens on our bloated egos. Think about it, those who are trying to accuse the driver… If I am the person driving and someone tries to rob me or my family (if it is proven by witnesses), I have every right to kill, whether i shoot him in head or his crotch is my justice, you shouldnt tell me what to do… because YOU were not there to help me when i was being robbed. So YOU should shut up. And if that American is a blackwater guy, why would he kill in broad day light to innocent looking bikeriders in a city where he lives and works everyday… May God let justice prevail…Amen Recommend

  • J Oberoi
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:19AM

    The ‘gorey log’ will never respect the sanctity of human life in the subcontinent as long as we ourselves don’t. A common man’s life in Pakistan and India is worth nothing. We are illiterate, stupid and let religion,caste and creed rule our lives. No wonder that a handful of Englishmen managed to rule a huge country like ours for centuries. We just don’t have the intelligence to see the right from wrong or work together as a society. If somebody shows us a dollar note, we’ll sell our ethics in a jiffy.

    It is time we faced up to the fact that as a race of people, we have a lot of evolving left to do. We are still mentally primitive and can never hope to catch up with the Orientals or Caucasians. The rest of the world will move up while we languish in our petty differences and religious narrow-mindedness. I hope we nuke the hell out of each other. The world will be better for it.Recommend

  • RKM
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:25AM

    face the truth…no authority can even touch this american…trust me…!!Recommend

  • Thoku
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:27AM

    Why is everyone asking why he carried a gun? to shoot down air balloons.Recommend

  • Armi
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:37AM

    @Hamood : Hypocrites;believes one thing does another, not Hippocrates ; an ancient Greek physician.

    There’s more than meets the eye here. Americans won’t station a stupid gora in Pakistan. Either he was perceptive enough to figure out that he was gonna be robbed and took action. Or he’s been in Pakistan too long and has lost his mind. And as for the Land Cruiser that thought it was on some kind of rescue mission; ridiculous.
    @Ali Ibrahim : Diplomatic immunity for murder? This surely would be a test case.

    The law for self defense: Use of force is justified when a person reasonably believes that it is necessary for the defense of oneself or another against the immediate use of unlawful force. However, a person must use no more force than appears reasonably necessary in the circumstances.

    David would be tried in American courts as the Americans wont let him be tried here and in any case Pakistani courts wont want to take the risk of letting him off the hook lest they been seen as pro-American, so they’d want to stay away from the matter.Regardless, the important thing would be to establish if he used more force than necessary.

    Here’s a precedent for the hit and run.
    “An American diplomat, Consul General Douglas Kent, stationed in Vladivostok, Russia, was involved in a car accident on October 27, 1998, that left a young man, Alexander Kashin, crippled. Kent was not prosecuted in a U.S. court. Under the Vienna Convention on Consular Relations of 1963, diplomatic immunity does not apply to civil actions relating to vehicular accidents. However, on 10 August 2006, a U.S. Court of Appeals ruled that since he was using his own vehicle for consular purposes, Kent may not be sued civilly.”

    Simply, put it wont be surprising if both the accused escape any sort of punishment.
    Eventually the Pakistani masses are gonna rue their leaders for being American “ghulam” and the urban intelligentsia and rulers would rue the “awams” lack of comprehensibility of how the real international political structure operates. sigh.Recommend

  • bunny
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:38AM

    Zone: If it would have been you or ur relative then what…..

    Its not a religious issue why someone is carrying weapons in Paksitan that has no lisence….and are we so cheap that anyone could kill us and then say i did it in self defence…..Justice should come in…no politics….just proper investigation and then justicce….Recommend

  • SA
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:43AM

    Its rather sad to see that the so-called pro america liberals are still defending the culprits of the incident giving them the benefit of doubt. Lynching the accused is of course barbaric, condemning isnt! Or have the foreign degrees really gone to their heads?? Pathetic and disgusting! Recommend

  • Waqas
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:44AM

    Let justice take its course; it is said the those shot were armed, so they can not be pronounced innocent of the alleged charges. It needs to be proved beyond doubt that the American did it in self defense.

    Considering what our mob is capable to do (sailkot example) i think the American did what I wud have done i.e. escape to avoid being beaten to a pulp by general public. In order to make it impartial, a judicial commission can be formed to see that justice is served.Recommend

  • Tippu
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:51AM

    There is no reason for any foreigner to gun people down. So the possibility of the the american killing two innocents is extremely remote. On the other hand, there are many many many idiots who chase cars and lots of abduction gangs.

    So the first thought that came to my mind was: WELLDONE!!! this should teach those %$^% to keep their distance and not flash guns willy nilly.

    The second thought was, even though i am sure the american did the right thing by gunning these two hoons down, the law of the land must be respected and to let justice run its course.

    I am confident the american will be found not guilty and i hope he returns home safe and sound. Recommend

  • Shakil Ahmed
    Jan 28, 2011 - 11:56AM

    The americans will soon fly to USA and may be a “C Off” also given by Mr. Premier and President.

    And our “Elite Class” must start demonstrating one more case and the “Religeous Parties” would successfully move toward a new topic from the old “Boring Puplic Issues”

    The the Commentors including me here is ready to write over here and to continue bearing all the losses for the Nation.

    And yes, The Nation, has to earn few coins to keep their children “Living”.Recommend

  • Dimple
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:00PM

    No one has the right to kill us Pakistanis… only we can do it to ourselves!Recommend

  • Jawad+Iqbal+Jawad
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:02PM

    two robbers, if they were, could not do the blunder of stopping a car on a busy road, in heavy traffic. On the other side the youth was hit by the other vehicle was totally innocent. Can they say that they killed him in self-defense?. According to Americans Dr. Afia only attempted to kill the US soldiers in jail where she was imprisoned after getting kidnapped. She has been given life imprisonment and now what about the Killer who intentionally murdered two Pakistani citizens who had no criminal record previously. His fellow killers crushed an innocent Pakistani citizen under their jeep. After drone attacks, helicopter attacks,now, they are killing Pakistanis on roads. They must be stopped. Otherwise they will start their door to door campaign in killing our citizens in “Self Defense”. How can one declare the killed ones robbers before complete investigations. Its totally prejudiced point of view. Recommend

  • Shakil Ahmed
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:15PM

    and and and and was the Aafia Siddiqui’s Case was not of “Self Defence”?

    My question is from “LIBERALS”Recommend

  • Faisal
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:26PM

    Raymond must face the trail of Pakistan. Every one Innocent Until Proven Guilty.Recommend

  • Sana Rasool
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:26PM

    Excuse me but carrying guns is definitely NOT legal in Pakistan or any other country of the world for that matter.

    I was just wondering how can two people on a bike try to hit a guy in a car? And how did Mr. Davis even get suspicious in the first place? How did he know he was going to be attacked? And if he did it in self defense as he claims, why would he flee? Why not tell the police whatever happened?

    Plus the fact he had back up all ready to pull him out of the scene kind of indicates it was all pre-planned by the Americans. Recommend

  • Jan 28, 2011 - 12:33PM


    Both of them must be punished to the full extent of the law. They must also not be allowed to leave the country under any CIRCUMSTANCES. Pakistan needs to act now and show to the world that we are no pushovers. Salams for 2011.Recommend

  • Jan 28, 2011 - 12:33PM

    Its called preemptive strike actually. Gora Sahab had gut feeling that the “terrorists” gonna pull their pieces so he acted first. Just like his govt did in Iraq and Afghanistan. Recommend

  • Pakistani
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:35PM

    If they ask for their diplomat’s return – Then why not AAfia and others -

    COLD BLOODED Murder in Broad Daylight – they r the real terrorists as becoz of their attitude terrorism flourishes.

    Time to take a stand – Wake up Pakistan Recommend

  • Awam ki Awaz
    Jan 28, 2011 - 12:38PM

    First Question: How the hell a foreigner allowed to carry a weapon in foreign country with out license ?

    Second Question: It’s a universal law that you are never taught to use your powers and kill in the name of self defense. Why the Mr. David didn’t shot them on their legs an calls his backup team ?

    Third Question: Driving like lunatic in wrong way and killing innocent biker ? Who is going to pay the price of it ?

    And I am pretty much sure that the foreigner was not only a employee of foreign embassy in fact a highly trained commando who had guts to carry and use weapons in open street.

    Mark this: “this guy will get away in any means even if he is guilty for the charges of dual murder”

    You all know the reason…Recommend

  • Amir Ali
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:07PM

    ok some one explain to me this. the bullet marks are at the front of the wind screen .. not at the door window. Shouldnt robbers rob/ threaten from the door window.
    The shots indicate that the bike riders were infact in front of the car .. and not at the side .. rest i believe you people are smart enough to figure things outRecommend

  • Cyko
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:13PM

    Wonder US sending so Poor DIPLOMATs who are killing only for 1000$? Thats what David u’ve been taught leaving US as a diplomat, “Shoot someone if u withdraw money and finds someone carrying a gun, follow barbarian law wherever u go” … American diplomats comprises of such cheap workers … Amazing…

    U were driving 1.8M (PKR) vehicle, with a coverup vehicle of more than 2M (PKR)…hmmm 1000$ is lmore or less 100,000 (PKR)

    1000$ presumably as a day’s max withdrawing limit, is it, fellas? Incase if it is a robbery.

    If, david, you are diplomat u’ve been briliantly brought-up/trained, as a Killer, never knew Diplomats with such skills…

    @ Rameez Khan the author : DRAMA in LAHORE ??????? U Call it a DRAMA ????Recommend

  • Afridi
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:14PM


    When your own state is incessantly engaged in killing, marginalising and disenfranchising its broad swathe of its own citizens in Baluchistan and KP, how come a state will bother about this incident… Recommend

  • A Pakistani
    Jan 28, 2011 - 1:33PM

    *I have checked all the web sites and news westren news media like BBC, Sky News, Reuters and amazed to see that every one is telling that he killed the two gunmen, but no one mentioned that they also killed a biker hitting with the car while trying to flee from scene on wrong side of the road. You can’t see the news about the third innocent biker hit by the American consulate vehicle. * Recommend

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